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Why are we regressing on gas mileage?

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posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 05:12 PM
If you look at the UK/EU market its now dominated by turbo diesels. For good reason.

My car is a skoda superb (volkswagen groups poverty brand). 2.0 Turbo Diesel. 6 spd manual. 140 bhp. Cruise all day at 75 mph and get 50+ mpg doing it (and its a big heavy saloon with all the modern toys).

I've been in the USA many times and don't see many private saloon car turbo diesels..why? Is it memories of noisy slow diesels from the 70s/80s?

Other than fashion I don't see the benefit in hybrids at the moment. There is not enough improvement over a good diesel to be worth all the packaging compromise.

posted on Dec, 16 2010 @ 01:24 AM

Originally posted by justwokeup

I've been in the USA many times and don't see many private saloon car turbo diesels..why? Is it memories of noisy slow diesels from the 70s/80s?

No, it is emissions requirements which are more strict on nitrous oxides than Europe, and less strict (as in not at all) on CO2.

There are a few turbo diesels in the USA, all expensive German models, e.g. VW, BMW and Mercedes-Benz.

In Europe also taxes on Diesel fuels are often less than gasoline, whereas it is often the reverse in the USA.

posted on Dec, 16 2010 @ 01:28 AM

Untrue - we could have both - high gas mileage AND pollution control.

Yes, you can, but you can't have these AND performance and high mass/large size, which is what people buy.

edit on 16-12-2010 by mbkennel because: (no reason given)

posted on Dec, 16 2010 @ 06:38 AM
reply to post by justwokeup

The problem with diesel is that the ultra-fine exhaust particles enter the blood stream through the lungs, and cause high blood pressure, cardiovascular disease, heart problems - and often, early death.

Heart Disease and Diesel Exhaust (PDF)

Diesel particles are the tiniest of deadly combustion particles. Recent medical investigations suggest that their extremely small size may allow them to pass easily into the bloodstream where they can cause oxidative stress and inflammation that leads to heart disease and premature death.1

...Medical Studies Link Diesel Particles to Cardiovascular Disease and Death.

• Exposures to particles are associated with elevated risk of premature cardiac death as documented in the two largest air pollution studies ever conducted.4
Daily exposures to particles are also linked to premature death in the 90-city National Morbidity and Mortality Air Pollution Study5
• Workers in the trucking industry have a 32-49% higher risk of heart disease than the general U.S. population according to a 2007 study.6
• A link between exposure to particles and vascular inflammation/atherosclerosis has been found in animal studies and could explain how particles are linked to heart attacks.7
• Ultrafine particles—as concentrated in fresh diesel exhaust --lead to systemic acute inflammation and exacerbation of cardiovascular disease and atherosclerosis according to recent studies.8,9
• Traffic proximity is related to heart attacks and mortality 10,11,12
A 2007 study of 700 heart attack survivors shows that they were most likely to have been in heavy traffic the hour before they suffered the heart attack, whether in cars, streetcars or buses. Studies find that traffic-related health risks are better correlated to truck rather than car volume and therefore may be more strongly related to diesel engine exhaust.
• Particles elevate cardiac risk for women.13
Researchers documented a 24% increase in risk of women having a cardiovascular event and an overall 76% increase in risk of death from cardiovascular disease for each 10 ug/m3 of PM2.5 in the ambient air. Within-city risks were higher than the risk between cities suggesting the importance of local sources of particles, such as diesel vehicles.14
• Abnormal heart rhythms were found in healthy state troopers exposed to particles
In a 2004 study,15 particles were linked to significant changes in heart rate variability, ectopic (out of place) heart beats and increases in blood inflammatory markers within hours of exposure. 16
• Formation of blood clots (thromboses), have been documented in laboratory animals exposed to diesel particles.17

And there's a lot more, ie.,...

Evaluation of the direct systemic and cardiopulmonary effects of diesel particles...
Recent data suggest that ultrafine pollutant particles (diameter

posted on Dec, 16 2010 @ 08:51 AM
reply to post by mbkennel

Exactly, I admit I like performance, thus I have a car for that. However, I also have a beater that I drive daily that is not performance but usable for daily life even better than my performance car.

That is a problem though with most. Not everyone is lucky enough to find deals to have the best of both worlds. I can look around and see most people in my area pick large vehicles (that do not even have 4x4 capabilities) just because it is a status symbol to have. But to each their own. I could show numerous parts of why a person should get a different vehicle but this is a free country and I personally do not want others telling me what to buy (though they are trying that with health care). The best I can do is explain to people I meet why a certain vehicle might be better suited to their liking.


posted on Dec, 16 2010 @ 12:15 PM
reply to post by soficrow

Mbkennel : Thanks, that makes sense.

Soficrow: Very interesting, thats a new one to look into. Thanks !

posted on Dec, 17 2010 @ 11:36 AM
reply to post by D.Wolf

regards to the concept car, i'll be interested to read the specs when they are released. nice looking motor imo.
puts my handpainted wheels to shame.
regards f

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