My son chose not to say the Pledge of Allegiance at school ther other day

I wish more parents would show thier kids some of the "old school" things a lot of us grew up to.




I still sing this song in my head almost 30 years later.

reply to post by Darkblade71


That little ditty is the ONLY reason that I know the preamble to the Constitution by heart!

To the OP, I'd say that it is his choice, and it does not require an explanation! Personally, I refuse to say the words 'under God' when I recite the pledge, as this goes against my firm belief in the secular nature of the Constitution and the original principles and intentions of our Founding Fathers when they set up this nation. But if someone were to ask me why I omit those words, I would say that it is a personal choice, nothing more...

The pledge is outdated! One nation under the PTB!

reply to post by Funkydung


The star I gave you was for your son...........the kid has balls and is very intellegent, you're evidently doing a great job raising him.

Go down a few posts and read Hot Baked Tater's reply.........she always has good insight and advice.

Your son's civil liberties, in my own opinion are being messed with.

I love America, but some of the things this country has recently done I am not proud of nor condon.

Below are some quotes that support your son's allegiance to the ideas of America, not necessarily the principals America is currently following.

We have strayed from the ideals our forefathers fought so hard for.

A man's country is not a certain area of land, of mountains, rivers, and woods, but it is a principle; and patriotism is loyalty to that principle. - George William Curtis

A man's feet must be planted in his country, but his eyes should survey the world. - George Santayana

A patriot must always be ready to defend his country against his government. - Edward Abbey

Our country is not the only thing to which we owe our allegiance. It is also owed to justice and to humanity. Patriotism consists not in waving the flag, but in striving that our country shall be righteous as well as strong. ~James Bryce

They actually said the pledge in school!!??
Awesome but I'm shocked!
And I don't believe this story.
People aren't even allowed to wear clothes to school that say they love America anymore or have an American flag on their bike.
If this story is true then Shame upon the parents teaching (in this case IF it was true the kid didn't even Know Why he didn't want to say the pledge- poor thing) their attitude toward their conutry/the one the flag represents and the disrespect for those who Died so they CAN say the pledge Or almost anything else.
No wonder this country is full of a socialist anti America generation with parents like you and a prez that doesn't salute the flag either....
Sadly, 'the let's all hate and bring down America plan' is Almost going according to schedule; these clueless children will be running what's left of America some day and parents that teach disrespect for their country will/Should be sorry

Is this a public (United Stated Goverment funded in part or in whole) school, or a private school?

reply to post by AmericanDaughter


Did you just leave a Tea Party function??? Apparently you believe in the freedom of mass conformity... If the kid doesn't feel comfortable reciting the pledge, he should have the FREEDOM to not do so, even if he can't seem to vocalize why it is that he isn't comfortable with it...

By the way, the first sign of fascism is extreme nationalism, which your post was simply dripping with!

reply to post by AmericanDaughter


You know, people with attitudes like yours are what hurts this country. I, for one, want my kids to THINK about what they are saying, not just blindly say it because they are "supposed to".

I stopped saying the pledge of allegience because I have to reason to pledge allegience to a flag or a republic that I don't believe in. Give me something worth believing in and I MIGHT choose to pledge allegience to it. However, that is me as an adult. I would NEVER force a child to pledge allegience to something until they were fully cognisant of what that meant.

I cannot speak for your son, your son must speak for himself, he is old enough too. Your son should have his own reasons for not saying the pledge. I'm 16 and live in the middle of Missouri and we say the pledge every Monday. I stand up but do not say it.

my reasons?


"I pledge allegance to the flag, of the United States of America"

I don't like symbols and I don't pledge allegance to a piece of cloth.


"and too the republic to which it stands"

well what reamains of one


"One nation under God"

i'm not very religious and their just pushing christianity down my throat

"indivisible, for liberty and justice for all"

during times of war our liberty can be taken away, like being drafted, and in the vietnam war people who spoke out against the war were put in prison, just two examples...

S&F for your son and I wish the best of luck to you and him !

Funkydung, BIG UP to your kid, it takes raw courage to stand alone for any reason, these days more than with us. You give him a thumbs up from me

I disagree with the assertion that he should have his own valid reasons, no that is not reasonable. He has a doubt, that's all, he erred on his own side of caution, against all pressure, peer and teacher. He needs to decide either way, but there should be no pressure for him to do so. Until then, you can only re-inforce his own free will to him, and educate him about the implications, of both decisions.

The note you wrote was perfect, short and sweet, and double underlines the opposite natures of "free will" and "conform". It is your free will to conform, more like it. Alethea's post is probably the best answer, nazi salute? No thanks. And again, "no" will be his most powerful weapon as a teen and adult. When in doubt, don't.

peace to you both

Here I am, the new guy, and I'm probably about to piss off a lot of people.

I don't like my government in it's current configuration. Democrats and Republicans BOTH are controlled by special interests, and once they get to Washington it seems like even the most well meaning Congressmen think their first duty is to their reelection campaign, and not to those whose interests they are supposed to represent.

Nevertheless, my eyes well with tears whenever I hear the Star Spangled Banner, and when I pledge allegiance to the flag I do so with my whole heart. I do this, not in support of the numbnuts running our country, but for what this country - and it's flag - are SUPPOSED to represent.

I'm not trying to be mean, but you have failed to do the right thing by your son. You say you support his decision to not recite the pledge; but by your/his own admission he doesn't know why he decided to do that. I think he is probably taking his cues from you, and it makes me wonder why you have such disdain for the values that made this country great, that he would think it's OK to disrespect the most visible symbol of our greatness.

I'm going to take a wild stab in the dark and ask, "Did you vote for Obama?" I'm willing to bet the answer is yes. His attitude toward our country is the epitome of what is wrong with the left. He wants to destroy our country, bringing the greatest nation in the history of the world to its knees by destroying its institutions and disrespecting its traditions so he can create his Communist utopia; and he's dragging the rest of you along with him.

If you want my advice, teach him the values this country was founded upon (unless you are one of those who see the Founders as nothing more than rich, white, slave owning traitors - in which case you're both lost.) Teach him the meaning of personal responsibility, hard work, and self-sacrifice for the benefit of others; teach him that while things aren't going that well at the moment, we can always aspire to be great once again. Have him memorize the Declaration of Independence, or at least this part:

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.

THOSE are the ideals the flag represents. If you have a problem with that, then I don't know what to tell you. In any case, I wish you and your son well.

You should be very proud of your son. I have long opposed the recital of any pledge in schools.

Thats a strong kid to stand up for what he thinks.

reply to post by OldCorp


I fully support your right to feel and think however you wish on this subject, and I too put my hand over my heart and pay full attention to the National Anthem.

The pledge of allegiance, however, is something that should never be forced on anyone. To pledge oneself to anything under any kind of force is crossing major ethical lines that should not be crossed.

And I won't even mention the ethical issues of pledging oneself to a flag to begin with.

Make him clean up the trash, rake the leaves, and shovel the snow at the local veterans memorial. Better yet, have him work as a nurses aid at the local V.A. Hospital.

Kudos, OP, to your son.
* He doesn't have to explain himself to anyone
* He doesn't need to recite the pledge every day to love his country
* The school has no right to make him say it
* His personal convictions are his inalienable right

I live in the US, I'm a legal immigrant, and I love living here. I'm married to an American lady. When the pledge is recited at events etc. I will stand when everyone stands, and I will put my hands behind my back and be respectful to those around me. I don't pledge. Similar to if I have to go into a church. I sit when they kneel. I stand when they stand. I remain silent and respectful. Nobody can force me to worship. Nobody can force me to pledge allegiance. Nobody ever asks me why I behave the way I do, and they really don't have any reason to. It's none of their business anyway.

I believe he should continue to stick to his personal beliefs - whatever they are (it's none of my business either) - and the school should be left to take whatever action they deem appropriate. I'm sure that their knee-jerk, non-common sense approach will backfire on them. The school districts hate bad publicity and will do all they can to make it a non-issue - once they've made themselves look completely foolish.

If your son is flexing his rights as an individual, he's being more "American" than those being part of the herd.
Good for him. I'd like to shake his hand.

Those words of Justice Jackson are worth repeating, as they define the essential quality of our unique national ethos.

If there is any fixed star in our constitutional constellation, it is that no official, high or petty, can prescribe what shall be orthodox in politics, nationalism, religion, or other matters of opinion or force citizens to confess by word or act their faith therein. If there are any circumstances which permit an exception, they do not now occur to us.


www.opednews.com...

Originally posted by Violater1
Make him clean up the trash, rake the leaves, and shovel the snow at the local veterans memorial. Better yet, have him work as a nurses aid at the local V.A. Hospital.

Children should not pledge anything.

Pledging to a country should be an adult choice.

Originally posted by captaintyinknots
reply to post by OldCorp

 

I fully support your right to feel and think however you wish on this subject, and I too put my hand over my heart and pay full attention to the National Anthem.

The pledge of allegiance, however, is something that should never be forced on anyone. To pledge oneself to anything under any kind of force is crossing major ethical lines that should not be crossed.

And I won't even mention the ethical issues of pledging oneself to a flag to begin with.

edit on 16-11-2010 by captaintyinknots because: (no reason given)

I see your valid point, but IMO, if you want to be a citizen of this country, then you had damn well better pledge allegiance to it. If you don't, there are plenty of other countries in which to live. Immigrants do it (the legal ones) and do it proudly; in fact, they study for years to have the privilege. I think that's one of the problems with our country today: many people do not care about anything greater than themselves, nor are they willing to sacrifice anything or give of themselves unless it benefits them personally.

Is a little loyalty too much to ask?

Originally posted by OldCorp

I see your valid point, but IMO, if you want to be a citizen of this country, then you had damn well better pledge allegiance to it.

I wonder what color suspenders these new "Allegiance Police" will wear.

If you don't, there are plenty of other countries in which to live. Immigrants do it (the legal ones) and do it proudly; in fact, they study for years to have the privilege.

And isn't it great that they have the choice to exercise that privilege?

I think that's one of the problems with our country today: many people do not care about anything greater than themselves, nor are they willing to sacrifice anything or give of themselves unless it benefits them personally.

You talking about the Republic that you're pledging yourself to?

Is a little loyalty too much to ask?

Some parts of the pledge would just be downright dishonest for some people to say. Forcing people to be dishonest with themselves doesn't represent anything I would want to pledge myself to. I'm not that fascist.