[FLASHBACK] Was TWA 800 Shot Down By a Military Missile?

reply to post by leo123


That Homer guy is giving you his eye witness account of the events after the incident. You then disregard his comments as hear say and yet at the same time you take other eyewitness accounts (of the plane being shot down) as fact and use them to support the shoot down argument. That doesnt really make sense.

On another note. If the aircraft was hit with an anti aircraft missile, where did the missile come from?
A shoulder launched ground attack can be ruled out, seeing as the plane was 10 miles out to see and at least 5 miles high when it got "hit". A shoulder launched anti aircraft missile has a maximum range of around 5 miles, so it wouldnt have been able to reach the plane from land.

That leaves something larger like a mobile sam or missile battery being responsible, both would be very difficult to hide in that immediate area unless extra long range missiles were used from a permanent SAM installation. These larger missiles would be quite easy to see and you would have thought there would be some pictures of a contrail of somesort. The other option is it was shot down by another plane, but again, I dont see that as feasible. Another point to mention is that the engines were not damaged (other than impact damage) and 90% of the time, the missile will hit the engine as its the source of heat.

I really dont know one way or the other, but I think there is more evidence supporting an accident than a shoot down.

reply to post by Feltrick


I was a guard at the hangar in Calverton, I had asked one of the FAA investigators where the explosion happened, he showed me and pointed the POSSIBLE point where the plane blew out, I agree it was a jumbled mess, but all I have to go on is what the investigator told and showed me. Was he lying? I dont know, I'm nod an ordy person or demo expert.

i remember this well. i grew up a few minutes away from JFK and we watched this live on the news. everyone afterwards thought it was a missile. word in "the hood" was that it was mafia retaliation for Guilianis' crack down on the mob.

some excerpts from "whatreallyhappened.com":

The New York Post, in its story of September 22, 1996, reported,
Law-enforcement sources said the hardest evidence gathered so far overwhelmingly suggests a surface-to-air missile...

The FBI interviewed 154 "credible" witnesses -- including scientists, schoolteachers, Army personnel and business executives -- who described seeing a missile heading through the sky just before TWA 800 exploded.

"Some of these people are extremely, extremely credible," a top federal official said.

FBI technicians mapped the various paths -- points in the sky where the witnesses said they saw the rising "flare-like" object -- and determined that the "triangulated" convergence point was virtually where the jumbo jet initially exploded.

The New York Times, on July 19th, 1996, reported,
" [ Witnesses reported ] a "streak of light" hitting the plane just before it blew up."

And perhaps most tellingly, from the Associated Press, on September 23, 1996,
"...a source...said on condition of anonymity... ``There's metal bent in, metal bent out. Metal you can't tell. I see a hole going in and a hole going out..."

whatreallyhappened.com...

reply to post by HomerinNC


Thanks for the honest response. That was my only point, that perhaps you were either mislead or the investigator was mistaken about the damage.

BTW, not everything is a conspiracy, but there are cover ups and we always need to seek the truth. Although, we sometimes seek our own truths and ignore facts that don't fit our own ideas of what happened.

reply to post by Pryde87


Thank you, it shows people believe what they want, they WANT to believe the CIA, the reptillians, the Illumaniti azre behind EVERYTHING that happens, that there are no accidents in the world, that there is a coverup and govt involvement in EVERYTHING

True, thats one of the main problems with ATS. Despite the Motto, it is one of the most ignorant place on the web. A lot of the time, the best explanation is very boring (i.e. spark in fuel tank - plane crashed) and doesnt give people much to talk about, so instead they blindly believe the interesting tale that makes them feel like they have uncovered some hidden secret. Some things are just tragic accidents. Poo happens. Sometimes without a greating meaning or design.

I'd have to say that in this instance you have a lot of people saying they saw a missile, and that whole story about a 747 going into a climb after an explosion, nope, not going to happen and be mistaken for a missile. And I don't think anyone was saying in this instance that reptilians shot the plane down, but you need to go over the top and bring that to the table to discredit people that don't believe the CIA story. The fact could simply be that this was an accident and our navy along with the CIA,FBI, whoever felt that covering it up, and creating a story that is kinda believable would work. I'd bet all my worldly possessions that if you asked any joe blow walking the streets about TWA flight 800 they wouldn't have any idea what you were talking about or care. So you could have a picture of a missile hitting that plane and it would be called photo shopped, CGI, what ever and we would all move along worrying about buying gold or silver and what is Paris Hiltons next move, or who got the boot on DWTS. Or that Hilary Clinton cracked a smile the other day. Once the TV sells a story, that's the story and if you don't agree your a conspiracy nut job, that lives in your moms basement.

Is it possible somebody on a Navy ship could have fired a missile up?

Debatable.

But now things have changed for the worse. A green card holder in our military used to have to serve 3 years honorably before we allowed him/her to apply for citizenship...then get a Secret Security clearance.

President Bush abolished that and ANY green card holder who joins our military now can get immediate, expedited, 100% free US citizenship and then a Secret Security clearance. It is easy now for someone to infiltrate our military from another country and do such an attack.

Since 9-11 we have lowered our standards...and security. We were more secure PRIOR to 9-11. Before Bush screwed over our military. Now all we can do is PRAY those green card holders aren't evil and use their immediate citizenship/secret security clearance in our interests.

reply to post by Pryde87


TW800 was climbing to 15 thousand, having just left 13 thousand when radio contact was lost. A stinger has a range of between 1 and 8 km (26,000) feet.stinger

A very good chronology is here: TW800

Originally posted by Pryde87
True, thats one of the main problems with ATS. Despite the Motto, it is one of the most ignorant place on the web. A lot of the time, the best explanation is very boring (i.e. spark in fuel tank - plane crashed) and doesnt give people much to talk about, so instead they blindly believe the interesting tale that makes them feel like they have uncovered some hidden secret. Some things are just tragic accidents. Poo happens. Sometimes without a greating meaning or design.

So that's your truth, then?

A spark in the middle of a tank full of liquid fuel, jet fuel, essentially kerosene, ignites explosively, just like the CIA's example, done with a tank full of hydrogen.

Poo, indeed.

Originally posted by HomerinNC
ok you want proof it wasnt shot down?
I want proof it WAS shot down
show me ONE VIDEO from that day that SHOWS a missile shooting it down

Here's a start.

Google Video Link

reply to post by leo123


Show me a video that shows this 'alleged' missile going up and HITTING the plane, since it supposedly exsists...

reply to post by habu71


Still if you factor in the distance from land (around 10km) plus the vertical distance it still puts it out of range of a stinger. (if its land fired)

Originally posted by HomerinNC
reply to post by leo123

 

Show me a video that shows this 'alleged' missile going up and HITTING the plane, since it supposedly exsists...

There doesn't seem to be much point posting further clear elements of evidence because you have already made up your mind, haven't you.

reply to post by HomerinNC


You have no pictures or videos to back up what you say so your word is just as good

believe what you want, doesnt matter, if you had the gtruth right in FRONT of you, if it wasnt a govt conspiracy, you would STILL DENY IT

reply to post by Pryde87


Pride, while I cannot prove the various eyewitness accounts, as well as the many theories, there were small watercraft sighted in Long Island Sound that night.....IF someone wanted to, a small watercraft would be the perfect waterborne delivery vehicle....many of the witnesses recounted the "trail" originated from Long Island Sound.....Now, well offshore, there is a USN restricted area, but, allegedly, the area under TW800's flight track was not restricted.

I will reiterate, I was the next JFK departure after TW800, we saw a missile track, originating from the ocean surface, (two ex mil pilots who know what missile tracks look like) I cannot say from what it originated, although I will say it looked remarkably like a SAM.

reply to post by habu71


I will also recount a conversation (no, I cannot prove it) between myself, 55 at the time, my father, a retired TWA pilot and a very senior TWA pilot (over 4000 hours in the B747).......When asked about TWA800, he asked to not be quoted, when we pressed him about the 747 center fuel tank issues, he said, and I quote, " since you are putting me on record, the possibility of a center tank explosion due to fuel vapors is extremely probable"...then he winked, and said, the rest of my comments are off the record.....

you saw this from your plane, which way were you heading? what was your destination?

here's a map of long island with JFK airport and the crash site labeled, its about 40-50 miles from each other, so I dont see how you seen a alleged SAM fly up and hit the plane

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/9614d74d1adc.png[/atsimg]

reply to post by HomerinNC


Departures for Europe from JFK are vectored practically over the same route until they either leave departure control frequencies or are cleared on course (meaning cleared to navigate via their own systems along the flight plan route). During the evening, you can see this, as most of the aircraft lights follow the same track (if they are Europe bound). We were the next Europe bound departure immediately behind TW800, approximately 5 nm behind them.