When are the OSers gonna end? Zero evidence to point to any concise conclusion.

Originally posted by Alfie1

Originally posted by CynicalM
reply to post by weedwhacker

 

Yes futile..

Another random event does not relate to all...I dont see the connection, especially now I have researched and found it was not one lucky passport but three...

I suppose these identity documents should not have survived this horrendous crash in Iran :-

news.bbc.co.uk...

Another " inside job " perhaps ?

I'm glad you posted this link to the BBC report on the Iran crash.

Now, please compare the description of this Iranian crash site with the alleged 9/11 crash site story in the OS. The BBC article reports on the Iran crash site as follows:

"I saw the plane crashing nose-down. It hit the ground causing a big explosion. The impact shook the ground like an earthquake. Then, plane pieces were scattered all over the fields," 23-year-old Ali Akbar Hashemi told AP news agency.

And, later in the same article:
'Television footage showed a massive crater in a field, with smouldering debris over a wide area.'

Now, the OS regarding Flight 93.

Flight 93 officially crashed into an empty field of a reclaimed strip-mine in Shanksville, PA at 10:03am. It reportedly had rolled onto its back before striking the ground at about a 45deg angle, traveling roughly 580mph with 5,500 gallons of fuel still onboard. Only one person actually saw the plane strike the ground. Hardly anything of a plane looked to be left. No bodies were seen. The only evidence left on the surface was a shallow 10ft-deep crater, a burned out section of forest next to the crater, and relatively few, mostly small pieces of debris scattered about. The local coroner was stunned at how small the smoking crater looked and commented that it looked "like someone took a scrap truck, dug a 10-foot ditch and dumped all this trash into it." Other debris allegedly from the crash was reported up to 8 miles away.

No-one reading/seeing the details of the Iran crash site will doubt that the plane actually did crash. Could sabotage be a possibility? Yes, sabotage could have been used to cause the plane to crash, but there seems little to no doubt that the plane did actually crash.

This is very different from the situation regarding Flight 93. The OS storyline caused surprise to local residents, members of the public, emergency service personnel, aviation experts and even the coroner - all of whom find the story inconsistent with the evidence. It doesn't add up. There are, therefore, more than reasonable grounds to question the official story line and seek a full and plausible explanation for this anomaly. Susipicions that the plane didn't actually crash, but that something else happened, are more than justified. To date, the authorities have not been willing/able to provide the full rationale behind their story. Hence, suspicion of lies and a cover up are more than reasonable, they are honest questions which MUST be asked.

Re the identity documents, you insinuate that because these documents were found at the Iran crash site, the truthers' questions about the 9/11 passports are proven to be unreasonable, and worthy of scorn.

I would again refer you to the BBC article which you quoted, specifically:

'Television footage showed a massive crater in a field, with smouldering debris over a wide area.'

The article does not report a massive fire ball, so hot that it melted steel (which only melts at 2000 degrees. The reported facts are a) consistent with what we all know and have seen of an airplane crash. 2) Consistent with the explosion on impact reported by the eyewitness.

Since no unprecedented massive inferno was reported in the Iran crash, and debris was observed, there is no reason to question how the identification objects survived virtually intact, along with the other debris which was also observed and reported. This too is consistent with the knowledge we all have of previous air crashes.

If you believe the official conspiracy theory about the absolutely massive inferno generated in the towers by the burning plane, the survivial of the passports in such an inferno, unlike the case of the Iranian crash, is completely inconsistent with the official storyline and as yet no plausible, verifiable explanation has been given.

Please also note the glaring differences in the description of the impact to the ground of the two crashes. In Iran, there was a 'massive crater', consistent with an airplane crashing into the ground.
For Flight 93, which allegedly crashed into the ground at 580mph, a mere '10 ft. ditch'

Originally posted by Myendica
reply to post by wcitizen

 

thank you wcitizen for understanding, and reiterating my OP. Just about every post has been way off topic, but I was just riding it out, and responding to bits and peices.

Originally posted by okbmd
reply to post by Myendica

 

" it makes no sense for an oser to go out of their way to tell someone they are wrong. "

Why not , that's what you guys are doing , going out of your way to say that the OS is wrong .

But why bother? No-one seems to want to answer the OP's genuine question.

Really? It's hard to believe that we were attacked because we support Israel and have troops in the Middle East? Really? It's difficult to believe that a hateful group that's led by a man we helped to fight the Soviets took years of planning to attack?

If anything, there's more evidence of the OS than the loose conspiracy theories that don't match up with each other.

Originally posted by SeventhSeal
Really? It's hard to believe that we were attacked because we support Israel and have troops in the Middle East? Really? It's difficult to believe that a hateful group that's led by a man we helped to fight the Soviets took years of planning to attack?

If anything, there's more evidence of the OS than the loose conspiracy theories that don't match up with each other.

Perhaps you would be willing to answer the OP's original question. Why do those who believe the OS bother taking part in a thread which is intended for 9/11 truthers to discuss some information?

Originally posted by GoodOlDave

Originally posted by yyyyyyyyyy
Hi goodoldave,

How can you have the Bill Clinton quote as your sig?!? Clinton saying 9/11 was not an inside job makes me question what his definition of 'job' is lol.

Really... you take Clinton seriously?!? IMHO he is a walking joke and he convinces me moreand more that the OS is total BS. .

Well, if you conspiracy people can quote Holocaust-denying Iranian President Ahmadinejad when he says 9/11 was staged, then I can quote "I never had sex with that woman" president Bill Clinton when he says 9/11 was an Al Qaida operation.

Besides, there's a difference between lying to conceal a marital affair, and lying to intentionally get other people angry over touchy subjects.

You use 'Holocaust-denier' as a disparaging term, just like the MSM, but you surely must be aware that some respected historians also seriously question the truth of the facts about the alleged Holocaust. Once again, I see you're using the typical NLP techniques used by the MSM.

Whilst I have not an ounce of faith in Ahmadinejad's integrity, his claim that the Holocaust facts are inaccurate are perfectly valid. Even Auschwitz has changed its sign, due to a downgrading of the alleged number of victims from 6 million to 2.5 million.

Clinton's 'I never had sex with that woman', was, on the other hand, a downright lie.

Your comparison is spurious, and, if examined logically and honestly, actually works against your argument and not for it.

The techniques you use in your posts, imo are slippery, and incredibly redolent of the same mind manipulation techniques used by the government propaganda machine.

Originally posted by wcitizen

Originally posted by SeventhSeal
Really? It's hard to believe that we were attacked because we support Israel and have troops in the Middle East? Really? It's difficult to believe that a hateful group that's led by a man we helped to fight the Soviets took years of planning to attack?

If anything, there's more evidence of the OS than the loose conspiracy theories that don't match up with each other.

Perhaps you would be willing to answer the OP's original question. Why do those who believe the OS bother taking part in a thread which is intended for 9/11 truthers to discuss some information?

Simple answer to a simple question: It's called a Forum where members come to discuss certain issues or matters.

The error you're presenting here is that you're claiming the towers fell at an abnormal rate when there's no way you could know such a thing. If you believe the towers fell too fast then it becomes your responsibility to show how fast the towers should have fallen, given the peculiar design, the damage from the aircraft impact, the damage from the fires, and the force of impact the collapsing floors above would have on each stationary floor below. If even ONE floor would have instantly buckled under the overpowering force of impact of the cascading structural collapse, then you'll need to concede they ALL would have instantly buckled for the same reason because every floor was the exact same design and the exact same support strength

reply to post by GoodOlDave


DAVE DAVE DAVE! COME ON !
I've made no such error. I havn't said anything to make anyone think I'm talking about the speed of the falls.
That is your error not mine pal.
How can I say how fast they should have fallen when it has never happened accept for that day?
There you have what I am saying.

The towers should not have fallen.

Please argue with someone who has worked in the trade for 25 years somemore? You need to back off cause you're wrong
my friend. That steel frame would've held period. Didn't you read my post.

I've worked that iron on buildings here in L.A. for 25 yrs. I know what that steel will do. It would have held.

Dave go to a job site you'll have to have a hard hat to even get on the Job. You might as well get a custom one
for 100 bucks cause your going to be there for along time. Even better you won't need a hard hat. Call the union local ask for some phone no.s of good solid iron workers. All you have to do is say your a General Contractor. No probs. Call the No.s Dave ask em Dave. Then you can argue with them too. Be prepared to be laughed at.

You have to tell them you are a General or you may get a fearful answer. Say I'm a General doing a study to see what they know about there own trade. Then the question. At the most they just won't say anything but they will never say the OS is even feasable.. Controled Demolition Dave. No way around that.

Originally posted by GoodOlDave

Originally posted by yyyyyyyyyy
Hi goodoldave,

How can you have the Bill Clinton quote as your sig?!? Clinton saying 9/11 was not an inside job makes me question what his definition of 'job' is lol.

Really... you take Clinton seriously?!? IMHO he is a walking joke and he convinces me moreand more that the OS is total BS. .

Well, if you conspiracy people can quote Holocaust-denying Iranian President Ahmadinejad when he says 9/11 was staged, then I can quote "I never had sex with that woman" president Bill Clinton when he says 9/11 was an Al Qaida operation.

Besides, there's a difference between lying to conceal a marital affair, and lying to intentionally get other people angry over touchy subjects.

For the record, that is a complete lie. If you care about maintaining credibility or decency, I would highly suggest you stop using such cop-outs, especially when they are based on lies.

Ahmadinejad once said that he thought the numbers reported dead *might have been exaggerated* to include more Jews, in order to justify the occupation of Palestinian land. Guess what? He's right. The Russians, who confiscated all the German records of the concentration camps, finally released them in the early 90s. It still showed a huge number of dead, but instead of 6 million, it was closer to 1 or 2 million. And the extra 4 million that was previously the official number, were almost entirely Jews.

So, guess what? He made a very reasonable suggestion, that is backed up by SOLID EVIDENCE. You pride yourself on research? Well maybe you should keep researching, it seems your sources are heavily biased. Sound like a familiar accusation? I hope so.

Edit to add - I forget to address the OTHER complete lie in your statement. Ahmadinejad never said 9/11 was staged. He said there are two major bodies of opinion in the world regarding 9/11, and he said one of those entails the involvement of the US government. He never said he believed it. Seriously, either your research etiquette, your sources, or both, are completely full of ****.

Originally posted by Myendica
Why do you OSers stick around? ... Why do you bother, to go out of your way to harras, and misinform, and disinform, on a conspiracy site, if you are just gonna try to convince anyone, that what the authorities say is true? .

Anyone? or is like I said, to pick a fight and cause contraversy, and derail any conversation of whatever idea one may have about 9/11?

Comment from: Myendica on: 063030p://f59Thursday @ 06:59 PM
Well this was all for you
www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/post.php?action=reply&fid=118&tid=613655

Well the OP stated to me in a private message that this thread was for me and he has to challenge my post. He got warned on the other thread for something that broke T@C's.

Well the OS will not go away as its the OS. Until the Truthers offer up their Official Report and Pie charts there can be no change to the OS that can be considered accurate. And as the truthers are mainly inaccurate i see no new OS on the horizon.

Originally posted by L1U2C3I4F5E6R
Comment from: Myendica on: 063030p://f59Thursday @ 06:59 PM
Well this was all for you
www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/post.php?action=reply&fid=118&tid=613655

Well the OP stated to me in a private message that this thread was for me and he has to challenge my post. He got warned on the other thread for something that broke T@C's. * Is this 9/11 nonsense going to ever go away? ZERO eveidence but still pushing on! *

Well the OS will not go away as its the OS. Until the Truthers offer up their Official Report and Pie charts there can be no change to the OS that can be considered accurate. And as the truthers are mainly inaccurate i see no new OS on the horizon.

edit on 073030p://f10Thursday by L1U2C3I4F5E6R because: (no reason given)

Correct, the OS is the OS, until a better, more proven "theory" can be obtained. Therefor, are the OS believers just scared of losing their kingship at the top of the hill, and thats why they need to show up in a discussion amongst like-minded people? To disrupt said "theory" that the like-minded are trying to obtain? Or is it that the ego in the OS, makes them need to denounce anything someone else may be interpretting, because they feel they are that much smarter? I am obsolutely, 100% curious as to the answers.

reply to post by L1U2C3I4F5E6R


Yea , I had already figured out as much . The OP got spanked in your thread , for 9/11 Madness , so he figured he had to start a thread that accuses his opposition of the things he got a warning for .

Originally posted by okbmd
reply to post by L1U2C3I4F5E6R

 

Yea , I had already figured out as much . The OP got spanked in your thread , for 9/11 Madness , so he figured he had to start a thread that accuses his opposition of the things he got a warning for .

yeah if I recall correctly, I didnt really say anything bad.. are opinions bad? possibly.. that warning system is very, VERY BIASED.


But once again, feel free to answer my questions. Just about everyone of your posts have been way off topic.


hardly got spanked. wanna know about gettin spanked, ask y... nevermind

This is the exact point I made. They come here, and derail any conversation. I had no problem with them coming to this thread. Mentioning them in the title is just asking for it. But barely were any of them on topic. I agree, truthers, and neutrals (me), can get out of line as well, but I must say, its due to your derailing of topics.

please, anyone, answer.

Originally posted by Myendica

Originally posted by L1U2C3I4F5E6R
Comment from: Myendica on: 063030p://f59Thursday @ 06:59 PM
Well this was all for you
www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/post.php?action=reply&fid=118&tid=613655

Well the OP stated to me in a private message that this thread was for me and he has to challenge my post. He got warned on the other thread for something that broke T@C's. * Is this 9/11 nonsense going to ever go away? ZERO eveidence but still pushing on! *

Well the OS will not go away as its the OS. Until the Truthers offer up their Official Report and Pie charts there can be no change to the OS that can be considered accurate. And as the truthers are mainly inaccurate i see no new OS on the horizon.

edit on 073030p://f10Thursday by L1U2C3I4F5E6R because: (no reason given)

Correct, the OS is the OS, until a better, more proven "theory" can be obtained. Therefor, are the OS believers just scared of losing their kingship at the top of the hill, and thats why they need to show up in a discussion amongst like-minded people? To disrupt said "theory" that the like-minded are trying to obtain? Or is it that the ego in the OS, makes them need to denounce anything someone else may be interpretting, because they feel they are that much smarter? I am obsolutely, 100% curious as to the answers.

edit on 23-9-2010 by Myendica because: * link to thread L1U2C3I4F5E6R mentions.

You lot have had nearly 10 years to get out an official report. 10 long years. How much time do you lot need to put your pie charts in order. I have proven that there is no proof in the theories of the truther. How ever it is still advisable that truthers get their act together. Maybe we need to set a deadline. like 2085 for the Official Truthers reports with pie charts all laminated for visual effect. The Os does not denounce anything. It is merely the OS and its the truthers who have been trying to denounce that, will huge failure all round. As far as smarter. I would imagine that the real scientists used in the OS investigation are not failed teachers college drop outs. But then again you do have the awesome mental might of Mr Avery and Alex Jones as your pillars of strength.

reply to post by Myendica


" I didnt really say anything bad.. are opinions bad? possibly.. that warning system is very, VERY BIASED. "

Apparently , you must have violated the T&C , otherwise you wouldn't have gotten spanked with a warning and post removal .

If you feel the warning system is biased , why didn't you take it up with the mods , instead of making a thread to vent your frustration ?

And , every one of my posts have been in response to your OP so , how am I off topic ?

reply to post by Myendica


" ... its due to your derailing of topics. "

You made accusations in the OP , against OSers , so , show me where I have derailed the topic of your OP .

reply to post by okbmd


I agree. the Mods are in place to regulate such behavior when things get a little tense. With a highly flammable topic such as 9/11 there needs to be Mods to keep things on track.

If you brake the T@C's you get a warning. Simple.

I have no doubt that while the OP is passionate about his beliefs in the truthers movement stories, I believe that he will resort to outlandish behavior to stress his point. I have always stated the US gov is no where near perfect but when you come cap in hand with a story of murder you need to have absolute proof with zero holes. Not zero proof and loads of holes.

reply to post by L1U2C3I4F5E6R


I must say, that it takes decades, if not centuries for the truth of present day, to really be realized. The OS is winning because people got PAID to come to THAT conclusion. I say that because, we paid money, and the only evidence and testimony allowed, was all one sided. They ignored any other avenue, which doesn't add up for me. So, once again, the OS is winning, and mainly because the OSers, try and derail any and all descussion.

Correct?