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US Citizens vs. US Fed Gov: Class Action

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posted on Jul, 29 2010 @ 06:48 PM
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US Citizens vs. US Fed Gov: Class Action



I would like to know what rights we have as a collective
citizen group to sue the US Fed Gov and it's congress
for war crimes, dereliction of duties, state's rights, etc....

Are there any lawyers out there who have
any advice in this area? Please share what our options
are in such a scenario.




posted on Jul, 29 2010 @ 06:53 PM
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I'm bored so I'll chime in. Especially seeing as I'm a big mouth about this. I think we'd have more power if we went up through the state level rather than on and individual basis.

In fact, good places to start would be dereliction of duty on the illegal immigration issue, up to and including the federal government's laundering of illegal money they can't "trace." I assume this money is in a fund somewhere? Right.

This might also be a good place to redefine and remind people of the limits and scope of the federal government, and what the states' rights and responsibilities are.

Also challenging the SCOTUS ruling about imposing term limits at the state level, as Congress is never going to vote for term limits.



posted on Jul, 29 2010 @ 06:58 PM
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While I am not a lawyer, I am a student of history, and knowing alot of different people, from what I have learned, you can not directly sue the federal government. The reason is that the odds are in the favore of the government and 99% of the time, the government wins. However, if you can find one thing that the federal government has not upheld on, focusing on that, backing it up with evidence, documentation, to include stuff in their own words, where it is the constant thing over and over, as well as show how it would violate the constitution of the US, then there is a chance to get a law or an action that the federal government has either done or not done, changed. But that takes a large amount of research and time, and then you would have to go through the different courts, being prepared to go right on up to the Supreme court of the United States. I hope this helps.



posted on Jul, 29 2010 @ 06:58 PM
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If it is like most cases, they will probably say you don't have standing.

Now state rights is another issue.

Doesn't it surprise you that Arizona has not tried to sue the Fed over State Rights?



posted on Jul, 29 2010 @ 07:19 PM
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reply to post by boondock-saint
 


There is no way to fight a tyranny within the legal system it creates for its own survival. None.



posted on Jul, 29 2010 @ 07:26 PM
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reply to post by boondock-saint
 


here is a detailed legal assessment
I hope this helps.


SUING THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT: SOVEREIGNTY, IMMUNITY, AND JUDICIAL INDEPENDENCE


www.allbusiness.com...



[edit on 29-7-2010 by Danbones]



posted on Jul, 29 2010 @ 07:28 PM
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Originally posted by mordant1
reply to post by boondock-saint
 


There is no way to fight a tyranny within the legal system it creates for its own survival. None.


Exactly. I was going to say that you'd have to have an army of lawyers - all carrying rifles. Okay, they don't ALL have to be lawyers. In fact, none of them have to be.



posted on Jul, 29 2010 @ 07:34 PM
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reply to post by jam321
 


lawyers are licensed and created by govt and outside of getting taxpayers money from it under one pretense or another, they dont seriously try attack the hand that feeds, empowers and shelters them, though they will make a show of it til your money runs out



posted on Jul, 29 2010 @ 09:06 PM
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People sue the government all the time. Bring your case to a lawyer. See where it goes from there. Be prepared for the backlash and anything that you say being video taped and put on youtube.



posted on Jul, 29 2010 @ 09:24 PM
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I'm thinking that perhaps instead of suing the government itself, why not bring individual policymakers who have proven track records (votes) that have violated thier oaths to defend the constitution to justice? state by state.



posted on Jul, 29 2010 @ 09:48 PM
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Originally posted by mordant1
reply to post by boondock-saint
 


There is no way to fight a tyranny within the legal system it creates for its own survival. None.


This is absolutely correct.

You cannot ask the same group of ppl that have lied over and over,
and helped pass the laws that allowed wall street to hide their
1,200 trillion derivatives monster on the OTC market.



posted on Jul, 29 2010 @ 09:51 PM
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actually just about everyone thinks
I'm speaking of holding this in a US
Court. I was thinking more of an
International Court or Tribunal.
Where they could not play the
advantage card.

And I'll check out that link when I get time
thanks



posted on Jul, 30 2010 @ 05:54 AM
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Originally posted by ~Lucidity
I'm bored so I'll chime in. Especially seeing as I'm a big mouth about this. I think we'd have more power if we went up through the state level rather than on and individual basis.

Luc
I like that idea
however the biggest problem
with that is we can't get the states
to stop sucking on the Federal tit
long enough to come up for air.
If the states would stop accepting
those federal monies and balance their
own budgets without assistance
that might have a chance to work.
But the states are like a junkie hooked
on the federal heroin.

Therefore I assumed the collective US
Citizens might stand a better chance

But I may be wrong.



posted on Jul, 30 2010 @ 07:53 AM
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reply to post by boondock-saint
 


You can always tell the age, maturity level and experience of someone who thinks there is a process or a word on paper or a venue somewhere that will keep a power seeking sociopath or group of them in govt from acting on their agenda or urges. The fact that those immature enough and by association, narcissistic enough to think that their special little suggestion intended for someone else to act on (mommy, daddy?) is enough of a service that they dont actually contribute to the one and only activity that sociopaths fear and that is proven to work, which fear for their own survival and direct, physical opposition to them.



posted on Jul, 30 2010 @ 11:34 AM
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reply to post by jam321
 


Great point and the last time that was challenged was that not called the civil war?



posted on Jul, 30 2010 @ 11:35 AM
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reply to post by boondock-saint
 


NEVER hire a lawyer, they are british agents, the BAR is the "British Accedited Registry". Look it up. A lawyer WILL NEVER help you win your case. This action MUST be brought forward by the PEOPLE. It has been done before, but not enough people stand behind it when the going gets tough.

Cornell Law University has all the federal code.



TITLE 18 - CRIMES AND CRIMINAL PROCEDURE
PART I - CRIMES
CHAPTER 73 - OBSTRUCTION OF JUSTICE
§ 1505. Obstruction of proceedings before departments, agencies, and committees

TITLE 18 - CRIMES AND CRIMINAL PROCEDURE
PART I - CRIMES
CHAPTER 115 - TREASON, SEDITION, AND SUBVERSIVE ACTIVITIES
§ 2381. Treason

TITLE 18 - CRIMES AND CRIMINAL PROCEDURE
PART I - CRIMES
CHAPTER 115 - TREASON, SEDITION, AND SUBVERSIVE ACTIVITIES
§ 2382. Misprision of treason

TITLE 18 - CRIMES AND CRIMINAL PROCEDURE
PART I - CRIMES
CHAPTER 115 - TREASON, SEDITION, AND SUBVERSIVE ACTIVITIES
§ 2384. Seditious conspiracy

TITLE 18 - CRIMES AND CRIMINAL PROCEDURE
PART I - CRIMES
CHAPTER 19 - CONSPIRACY
§ 371. Conspiracy to commit offense or to defraud United States


And lastly:


TITLE 18 - CRIMES AND CRIMINAL PROCEDURE
PART I - CRIMES
CHAPTER 115 - TREASON, SEDITION, AND SUBVERSIVE ACTIVITIES
§ 2385. Advocating overthrow of Government

Whoever knowingly or willfully advocates, abets, advises, or teaches the duty, necessity, desirability, or propriety of overthrowing or destroying the government of the United States or the government of any State, Territory, District or Possession thereof, or the government of any political subdivision therein, by force or violence, or by the assassination of any officer of any such government; or

Whoever, with intent to cause the overthrow or destruction of any such government, prints, publishes, edits, issues, circulates, sells, distributes, or publicly displays any written or printed matter advocating, advising, or teaching the duty, necessity, desirability, or propriety of overthrowing or destroying any government in the United States by force or violence, or attempts to do so; or

Whoever organizes or helps or attempts to organize any society, group, or assembly of persons who teach, advocate, or encourage the overthrow or destruction of any such government by force or violence; or becomes or is a member of, or affiliates with, any such society, group, or assembly
of persons, knowing the purposes thereof—.................

TITLE 18 - CRIMES AND CRIMINAL PROCEDURE
PART I - CRIMES
CHAPTER 115 - TREASON, SEDITION, AND SUBVERSIVE ACTIVITIES
§ 2389. Recruiting for service against United States

Whoever recruits soldiers or sailors within the United States, or in any place subject to the jurisdiction thereof, to engage in armed hostility against the same; or

Whoever opens within the United States, or in any place subject to the jurisdiction thereof, a recruiting station for the enlistment of such soldiers or sailors to serve in any manner in armed hostility against the United States—

Shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than five years, or both.


Now understand this, the United States is seperate from "these united states of America". The United States and it's territories and possessions DOEA NOT include the 50 union states. If you look up the defintion of that, you will be shocked. And this is where people don't get it. Every State has it's own legislature, it's own governor and so on. Each State is therefore a foreign Nation with respect to the "federal" United States and it's territories, possessions and enclaves.

It would be very difficult to put together a case against the entity which wrote the laws, ratified by the group of people responsible for the act. I can not state it any clearer than that.

We are not screwed, but only have to take the time and push our authority. WE the People do have the power and the right to correct government, if it means going to D.C. in such vast numbers and then physically removing these people from office and firing them on the spot, that is then what must be done. Just my opinion though.

[edit on 30-7-2010 by daddio]



posted on Jul, 30 2010 @ 11:41 AM
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One more thing, in the code it refers to the United States and all it's possessions and jurisdiction. It ONLY has jurisdiction over the states as a result of the Zip Code. It makes all homes then listed to be in federal territory.




Since the use of Zip codes is voluntary (see Domestic Mail Service Regulations, Sections 122.32), the U.S. Postal Service cannot discriminate against the non-use of ZIP codes, pursuant to the Postal Reorganization Act, Section 403 (Public Law 91-375).

The federal government attempts to assert jurisdiction by sending letters with ZIP codes, when jurisdiction would otherwise be lacking. The receipt and "acceptance" of mail with ZIP codes is one of the requirements for the Internal Revenue Service, in particular, to have jurisdiction to send notices. In fact, the IRS has adopted ZIP code areas as "Internal Revenue Districts". See the Federal Register, Volume 51, Number 53, for Wednesday March 19, 1986.

The federal government cannot bill a "your state here" State Citizen because such a Citizen is not within the purview of the District of Columbia, its territories, possessions or enclaves. As a group, these areas are now uniquely and collectively identified as "the federal zone”, as explained in the book entitled, The Federal Zone: Cracking the Code of Internal Revenue, San Rafael, Account for Better Citizenship, 1992.


I sincerely hope that you all understand this.

[edit on 30-7-2010 by daddio]



posted on Jul, 30 2010 @ 11:50 AM
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reply to post by daddio
 


I can only say that was really good. I'd like you better if you'd research Che as well as your post.

The bottom line is simple
If at first you dont secede, try, try again.
people dont realize that by mass action and taking control and cutting support they can nullify any illegitimate rule or authority.



posted on Jul, 30 2010 @ 11:56 AM
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I'm actually curious about this topic as well. I was thinking about a few things in particular when a US citizen is murdered by an illegal alien, could the Fed be named as a defendant in the civil case?



posted on Jul, 30 2010 @ 12:01 PM
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You kind of need to think of it this way. The gov is like the CEO of the company you work for. The company made some rather poor decisions and the company looks bad. You can't sue them for doing a crappy job. The gov is a corporation and you work for them, so your rights in that area are limited. As a shareholder you can vote them out, your only real option, but as an employee you can't sue them for doing bad job.



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