What would it take for you to accept Darwin's Theory Of Evolution ?

reply to post by nophun


I find it funny that when someone doesnt have "facts" to support their point they always inject emotion lol, sorry but its true.

Originally posted by AwakeinNM
For me, it would take a miracle.

But wouldn't that most likely argue against the theory?

reply to post by upstateman


As has been posted in other topics, here is a definition of speciation as well as observed instances of it. Furthermore,in Darwin's day fossilization was believed to be a much more common process than it actually is.

Observed Instances of Speciation

I didn't read through. Sorry. Too excited that somebody actually asked! Great Question!!

1. I fully accept his theory of "EVOLUTION." NOT CREATION!!
It is fully understood that evolution happens.

2. I will never accept that the vast diversity of life evolved from one source. Impossible. No amount of environmental anomalies could have created everything from humans to blue whales to black mambas.

3. If you want to prove it. It is easy! j I have posted a very easy test many times and nobody has debated it. If we evolved from some erect homo species of ape or chimp or whatever and the average span of a generation is say 20 years. You can use 10 years if you want. It makes a difference, buat as you will quickly see it doesn't matter much.

So, modern man evolved over say 5 million years. That is 1/2 million generations. In 250,000 generations (highly generalized) we went from basic animals to intelligent men, then that same evolution should be apparent in other species. So take a colony of bacteria or amoeba or whatever you like that has a celle division rate of several hours. Run it through 1/2 million generations with whatever external stimulus you choose, and see if it evolves significantly. It will "adapt" and it may have an ever so slight evolution, but it certainly won't be as dramatic as ape to man, or single cell to multi-cell, or any other significant improvement that Darwin's theory would have us expect. Try it. Prove me wrong. Prove evolution exists!

Rough Source for basic facts. I put this together very quickly, but you get the main idea. Somewhere on ATS is a much more complicated and detailed version of my challenge.

reply to post by nophun


I accept evolution now but I used to be, believe it or not, a Creationist. This can be blamed on the fact I was raised a fundamentalist Christian and was taught that the Bible was the infallible word of God.

Of course, even given what I'd been told, I knew that the Earth couldn't be 6,000 years old because we wouldn't see all of the stars if the Earth was so young (and we certainly wouldn't be able to look beyond our galaxy like we can with high powered telescopes). So I was an Old Earth Creationist...

Back then there was NOTHING that could have persuaded me to believe in Evolution. I was fully in deep self-deceiving myself with all kinds of Creationist propaganda on the internet.

The thing that finally awoke me was when I stopped feeding from the mouth of madness and read the Bible for myself. Once I realized it was wrong on almost everything the Creationist views fell apart. Even then, though, I viewed both Creation and Evolution/Abiogenesis as equally invalid and nonsensical - UNTIL I looked into the evidence for evolution and stumbled upon things like wikipedia articles on evolution and transitional fossils, Aronra and Thunderf00t, etc.

Sorry for going off on a personal story tangent but the point is once you stop feeding from the mouth of madness, from the propaganda, it becomes harder to deceive yourself into believing all the lies. Then you can return to the debate with a clear head and it becomes, well, clear, Evolution has the evidence to back itself up and Creationism doesn't.

The fact that we're on the internet right now means it will be harder to get through to these people, because they will read any evidence for evolution and try to immediately find an Answers in Genesis page or Kent Hovind video to negate it all and support their delusion. Its an uphill battle, I know, ever since I accepted evolution and came to my senses I've been doing my part to combat the same ignorance I'd been trapped within.

Originally posted by Rockstrongo37
reply to post by nophun

 

I find it funny that when someone doesnt have "facts" to support their point they always inject emotion lol, sorry but its true.

What are you talking about ? You came in here randomly copy and pasted a bunch of #, Made a awesome lego example and then came up with "Evolution simply doesnt work."

Do you have any idea how aggravating your ignorance is ?

How about you ask 1 question (not 5 on different topic within 2 minutes) and I will reply. Do not post 3 different quotes from three different sciences at the same time. What facts are you disputing ?

I am trying to find a way to deal with your with out dropping the F word, I really am.

reply to post by Titen-Sxull


Hey, sorry about interjecting here, but where exactly does creationism and the Bible conflict? And where are the voices of madness you speak of?

There again, I love when ignorance reaches it peak and comes forth as inlightenment.


[edit on 18-7-2010 by Rockstrongo37]

reply to post by nophun


Well im sure it is agravating to you but that isnt because what im saying here is worthless or ignorant...you simply dont like what I am saying, and you still havent provided examples of evidence where we see evolution proven....I await your examples.

I believe

As a EMT i saw many cases of Darwin's theory in action.

There is even a award for the people that test Darwin's theory and remove themselves from the gene pool.

www.darwinawards.com...

reply to post by getreadyalready


To be fair it would be impossible to recreate the conditions necessary in a laboratory. You would need a complete untouched environment. Simply just letting bacteria reproduce ignores such natural phenomena as bottle necking and genetic drift, which contribute greatly to the gene pool. Furthermore, in many cases bacteria are highly evolved and can acclimate to any environment, so any mutation that does occur will be neutral or negative and not persist through later generations.

reply to post by Rockstrongo37


Creationism and the Bible don't contradict all that much but the Bible does contradict itself. Basically I was a teenager trying to reaffirm my faith but I wanted to do so without preachers and pastors and that group psychology of being in Church. I sat down and read the Bible, skipping the boring begat begat begat genealogies of course, and found it to not be the word of God.

The Mouths of madness. I used to be quite fond of Cryptozoology, I still am to some extent but back then I had it in my head that humans and dinosaurs had co-existed. Here's one of the sites I used to go to:

Genesis Park

There were a few other Creationist websites, ones casting doubt on Carbon and Radiometric Dating, others quote mining from great scientific minds to make it look like there was a controversy amidst scientists when there isn't. Lot's of lies but I took them as truth because I thought these were men of God who were attempting to lead us out of a Godless age.

Once I realized the Bible was chocked full of BS though it was only a matter of investigating the evidence for Evolution (which Creationist sites PRETEND to give you).

reply to post by Rockstrongo37


I've already posted a link to cases where speciation has been observed under laboratory conditions. What more do you need?

reply to post by Titen-Sxull


Hey, honestly I understand your questions, I had them too, but you need to provide some real examples here.

reply to post by Xcalibur254


Hmmm not sure what your talking about but I indeed will look back and look at them, thank you.

Hey everyone, I know im ruffling some feathers in here, but my whole goal here is to require debate that is objective and not based on emotion alone.

To the thread's poster, I simply would love to see your evidence that indeed evolution is viable...I'm open to any and all information you can provide.

The original sources I provided at the beginning were viable sources for this debate, and all Ive gotten back from you is frustrations and emotions but nothing in the way of evidence.

I would honestly love to see your point proven...science is the pursuit of truth and fact not theory and conjecture.

Where ever truth may lay, I want to arrive.

Originally posted by unityemissions

Originally posted by AwakeinNM
For me, it would take a miracle.

But wouldn't that most likely argue against the theory?

You're quick, aren't you? It's not comedy if you have to explain it.

reply to post by Rockstrongo37


Examples of what exactly?

I'm not sure what you're asking me for

reply to post by Titen-Sxull


I think my reply to your last post was pretty easy to understand...besides im honestly waiting for the thread's poster to provide me some information I was asking for and have been asking for now for some time...just disreguard my request.

reply to post by Rockstrongo37


The evidence of evolution is massive, I don't even know where to start.

Simple stuff like atavisms and vestiges should be compelling enough that you want to take a few hours to understand evolution.

Why do humans have tail bones ?
Penguins have hollow bones for what reason?
dolphins and whales with hind legs.
Humans born with REAL tails.

This is not even close to the best "evidence" for evolution, but it should be interesting enough that you want to take the time to look into it.
(It is very apparent you never have before)

en.wikipedia.org...(human)
en.wikipedia.org...

I still don't know what you are looking for.
You think you stumped we asking for evidence of evolution ? seriously?