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Would the soldiers side with the citizens or the federal government.

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posted on Jul, 18 2010 @ 02:13 AM
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Before any of you Military types flame roast me please read the complete post.
There are 2 types of individuals that Join the armed forces.
Type 1 has no direction and no idea of exactly what to do with their life or how to go about it. As they cannot live with Mom and Dad forever they look to their new Daddy, The United States (Insert branch here).
Type 2 I am going to join the armed forces to defend my homeland and make life comfortable for my Mom, Dad, Bro and Sis. I will take it upon myself and accept this responsibility while I also get a GI Bill to take the college cost off of my folks.
While both are good enough one type shines head and shoulders above the rest.
Type 1 while less desireable still realizes that they must do something and get out of the house, type 2 I feel has more direction.
Along the line some in the military either before or while in service realize the sham that we have become.

Either way I do not worry about US forces harming US citizens as the brighter of the two personalities will generally sshine through the clouded few.
I know a few currently in service and several retired who are all Oathkeepers.
What we do have to worry about is the US shipping all of our active duty off to a foreign country and then activating the reserves and shipping them off too.
The US would then bring in UN troops who care not about our neighbors or 2nd Ammendment who will do the damage.
This is why Militia is important.




posted on Jul, 18 2010 @ 02:16 AM
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What realy bothers me is that if my brother feels this way so do other soldiers.. It just doesnt make any damn sense.



posted on Jul, 18 2010 @ 02:27 AM
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reply to post by g146541
 


I hate to say it but you left out a group. You left out the group that I grew up with. These were smart kids with nice families, stable homes, decent education, access to college, etc. Basically all the things the American Dream is about. Most of them are still very close to their families and doing pretty well for themselves. Of course, none of them saw conflict while enlisted but they all spent years bragging about the same reason for joining.

"I just want to frickin kill some bad guys sooo bad."
"I would love to unload a few of those weapons into a crowd of camel jockeys."
"I just want to go blow (snip) up!!!!"

One friend of mine constantly complains that he wishes this war happened before he got married and had a kid because he would like nothing better than to just go shoot at "hadjis," he would not leave his family to go do it.

These people are out there too and unfortunately, they have no problem with the idea that at least half of the other Americans outside their doorstep are expendable waste getting in the way of their American dream.



posted on Jul, 18 2010 @ 02:27 AM
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Very good point g146541.

Now if you could give me some advice on what to tell my brother that would make my day.

I have 3 brothers in the military and my younger brother is in town and leaving on sunday and I would love some help on how to talk some sense into him.

He wants to leave the military and go into the police force.

This entire Thread is about him and how he has no problem takeing orders regardless of the constitution as long as his family is taken care of.. This has me absolutely flipping out.

Again.. asking for advice?



posted on Jul, 18 2010 @ 02:28 AM
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. reply to post by madmangunradio
 


Agreed it does not make any sense, they think its about dressing in cool clothes and carrying rifles and drinking in a bar while talking of conquest for king and country.
They may have not realized they Swore an oath to defend this piece of “Property” (US)
From ALL enemies foreign and DOMESTIC.
There is a reason their oath was worded this way.
Those who will not keep their oath have no honor and I would dispatch as quickly as I would a rabid animal.
If they think this way they would be nothing more than hired guns.
Your brother may also figure out if he was willing to harm a US citizen that there are more soldiers that will do the same to his wife and kids also.



posted on Jul, 18 2010 @ 02:35 AM
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reply to post by evil incarnate
 


They may be Type 1 they are fond of the kill a commie for mommy posturing. they like to speak of their conquests.

reply to post by madmangunradio
 


Ask your brother which soldier will be putting his wife and kids into a camp? will they molest them or actually care for them?
I'm sure not all German soldiers were monsters before they became prison guards, circumstances seem to control us at times.

[edit on 18-7-2010 by g146541]



posted on Jul, 18 2010 @ 02:41 AM
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Originally posted by g146541
. reply to post by madmangunradio
 


Agreed it does not make any sense, they think its about dressing in cool clothes and carrying rifles and drinking in a bar while talking of conquest for king and country.
They may have not realized they Swore an oath to defend this piece of “Property” (US)
From ALL enemies foreign and DOMESTIC.
There is a reason their oath was worded this way.
Those who will not keep their oath have no honor and I would dispatch as quickly as I would a rabid animal.
If they think this way they would be nothing more than hired guns.
Your brother may also figure out if he was willing to harm a US citizen that there are more soldiers that will do the same to his wife and kids also.


I repeated that oath to him and he gave me one crazy angry look. Told me I dont know anything about it and that I'm no soldier and just shut the hell up.. I then made the mistake and brought his wife outside by the fire and she's an ex soldier as well.. and raised the question about the 2nd amendment.. geez guess how that turned out?! She sided with him.. family first

I didnt know how to argue with them.. I was ostracized at that point.



posted on Jul, 18 2010 @ 02:45 AM
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Originally posted by g146541
reply to post by evil incarnate
 


They may be Type 1 they are fond of the kill a commie for mommy posturing. they like to speak of their conquests.

reply to post by madmangunradio
 


Ask your brother which soldier will be putting his wife and kids into a camp? will they molest them or actually care for them?
I'm sure not all German soldiers were monsters before they became prison guards, circumstances seem to control us at times.

[edit on 18-7-2010 by g146541]


I'm just hopeing I can sit them down on their computer and have them read this thread.



posted on Jul, 18 2010 @ 02:45 AM
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Originally posted by g146541
reply to post by evil incarnate
 


They may be Type 1 they are fond of the kill a commie for mommy posturing. they like to speak of their conquests.


Respectfully, I have to disagree.


Type 1 has no direction and no idea of exactly what to do with their life or how to go about it.


There was never any lack of direction with any of these folks and most of them are quite successful at what they planned on doing. The one that wanted to kill the most just because he wanted to shoot at moving targets so badly works for a national arms dealer. I would dare say they had plenty of direction and aside from getting to server during wartime, most of them are following it just fine.



posted on Jul, 18 2010 @ 02:46 AM
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Originally posted by madmangunradio
Exuberant1.. He's my brother. I personaly wanted to slap him sideways..


I have brothers too.

Sometimes you need to give them the silent treatment.

It often works when other things don't, but you have make sure he knows why he's being shunned. ("I'm ashamed of you for what you said"...)

And make sure everyone else knows why you are shunning him. ("I'm ashamed of him for what he said he'd do"...)

*There is a price to be paid for everything we say, and that has to be reinforced.






[edit on 18-7-2010 by Exuberant1]



posted on Jul, 18 2010 @ 02:54 AM
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There is absolutely NOTHING wrong in joining the police force. Without them, we would not be able to get a peaceful night's sleep, with criminals, druggies and desperadoes around. Those who sign up do so with noble intentions and idealism, along with a salary security.

Family will ALWAYS come first. Without family, there would have not been even a nation or civilisation. It is the glue that binds us all and evolve as one unit, with common aim and aspirations.

The only problem is, idealism and noble intentions often gets corrupted along the way, sadly enough. More often than not, you see the police are there to protect the rich and powerful, and not the masses, and only do so if they had the time. The police answer to them, through their leaders who signs the checks and promotion lists. It's a practical world we live in....

When the time comes to go against the constitution, rest assured that our masters will spin it so cunningly that their bootlickers will follow, even killing his own wife and kids if necessary. Some awakened will probable strip off their uniforms than to obey, but many will follow, for brainwashing is instrumental to the retainance of power held by the rich and powerful.

There is nothing that you can do to convince him. Please do not do so, but let him have his free will and choice. He may be awakened when the times come to strip off his uniform, or he will pull the trigger and live with the consequences for the rest of his life. It is his choice to make, not yours or anyone.

But he is still your brother, a blood kin, and will need your support in order to be awaken and be reminded to be a good cop, to retain the noble intentions and idealism that compelled him to join the force besides that salary which i am sure, he would have obtain elsewhere.

Awakenings take patience and time. No matter what happens, he is still your brother, a precious being born from the same father and mother, and grew up together sharing not only sorrows but joys as well...



posted on Jul, 18 2010 @ 02:55 AM
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Originally posted by Exuberant1

Originally posted by madmangunradio
Exuberant1.. He's my brother. I personaly wanted to slap him sideways..


I have brothers too.

Sometimes you need to give them the silent treatment.

It often works when other things don't, but you have make sure he knows why he's being shunned.

*And make sure everyone else knows why you are shunning him. There is a price to be paid for everything we say, and that has to be reinforced.




I see your logic. It doesnt work for everyone. I cant shun my brother or ignore him. That wont help or change things.



posted on Jul, 18 2010 @ 02:56 AM
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reply to post by madmangunradio
 


Have fun then.

I'm sure you'll have plenty of great times.



posted on Jul, 18 2010 @ 03:01 AM
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Originally posted by SeekerofTruth101
There is absolutely NOTHING wrong in joining the police force. Without them, we would not be able to get a peaceful night's sleep, with criminals, druggies and desperadoes around. Those who sign up do so with noble intentions and idealism, along with a salary security.

Family will ALWAYS come first. Without family, there would have not been even a nation or civilisation. It is the glue that binds us all and evolve as one unit, with common aim and aspirations.

The only problem is, idealism and noble intentions often gets corrupted along the way, sadly enough. More often than not, you see the police are there to protect the rich and powerful, and not the masses, and only do so if they had the time. The police answer to them, through their leaders who signs the checks and promotion lists. It's a practical world we live in....

When the time comes to go against the constitution, rest assured that our masters will spin it so cunningly that their bootlickers will follow, even killing his own wife and kids if necessary. Some awakened will probable strip off their uniforms than to obey, but many will follow, for brainwashing is instrumental to the retainance of power held by the rich and powerful.

There is nothing that you can do to convince him. Please do not do so, but let him have his free will and choice. He may be awakened when the times come to strip off his uniform, or he will pull the trigger and live with the consequences for the rest of his life. It is his choice to make, not yours or anyone.

But he is still your brother, a blood kin, and will need your support in order to be awaken and be reminded to be a good cop, to retain the noble intentions and idealism that compelled him to join the force besides that salary which i am sure, he would have obtain elsewhere.

Awakenings take patience and time. No matter what happens, he is still your brother, a precious being born from the same father and mother, and grew up together sharing not only sorrows but joys as well...


So your saying give him some space and not hound him over his family first speach.. Give him the benefit of the doubt. Trust my brother to do the right thing?

hmm... Its better to not brow beat my brother over tonights conversation and trust he will make the right decision when the time comes.

That makes sense. I wont help matters by forceing the subject.



posted on Jul, 18 2010 @ 03:08 AM
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reply to post by madmangunradio
 


Give him your blessings, painful to you as it may seems, more so if you are one of the awakened. One can lead a horse to the river, but none can make the horse drink if it doesnt want to. Each needs to find their own truths and reality, to taste it and then decides to live in delusion or to seek for change.

It will be more lasting that way, and he will certainly see reality soon, for it is something no human can escape from, and will be in more ready position to listen to your shared advices and experiences.



posted on Jul, 18 2010 @ 03:12 AM
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Yeppers, if he will not listen to the what will become of his family, there is no help and I am sorry for him as he obviously doesn’t know that the military is there for more than just a paycheck.
My advice family or not, cut him off and if you cannot then you will deal with yourself when the time is appropriate.
Has anyone ever really wondered why the idiots are almost always officers and the wise are NCO’s or below?
Don’t get me wrong I’ve known good officers 3 I think. But the bread and butter are the underclassmen.


(Edit)
Someone please gimme a star as i have 666 and i just wanna cover the bases in case of christian rapture.
Is good now I am saved!

[edit on 18-7-2010 by g146541]

[edit on 18-7-2010 by g146541]



posted on Jul, 18 2010 @ 03:16 AM
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I have always wondered how police for instance could go out and beat the crap out of its own citizens that they are usually set out to protect. I am relating to peaceful demonstrations and peoples rights.

Cops live by the same laws as every one else after duty. I wonder if they ever have any second thoughts about their own actions.

EDIT : Well the police/army have a lot of power, because without them the politicians are powerless.

[edit on 27.06.08 by spy66]



posted on Jul, 18 2010 @ 03:21 AM
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Originally posted by g146541
Yeppers, if he will not listen to the what will become of his family, there is no help and I am sorry for him as he obviously doesn’t know that the military is there for more than just a paycheck.
My advice family or not, cut him off and if you cannot then you will deal with yourself when the time is appropriate.
Has anyone ever really wondered why the idiots are almost always officers and the wise are NCO’s or below?
Don’t get me wrong I’ve known good officers 3 I think. But the bread and butter are the underclassmen.


(Edit)
Someone please gimme a star as i have 666 and i just wanna cover the bases in case of christian rapture.

[edit on 18-7-2010 by g146541]


I feel blessed getting you out of that 6x3 situation... anyways.. I doubt my brother would go down that road when the s*** hits the fan.

I'm curious what my other 2 brothers in arms would say about what i asked my younger brother.



posted on Jul, 18 2010 @ 03:36 AM
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reply to post by madmangunradio
 


You can't argue with a mindless drone!

That is kinda mean, maybe you could explain to him everything you know about why it is important for mercenaries to see the citizen's side of the fight. They too are citizens. You should tell him how none of our rights should ever been impended on because that will only lead to more of our rights getting taken away.

They shouldn't always follow orders if they know that the orders are incredibly wrong. They have to keep their own conscience and voice by not enforcing something that will abuse every citizen including their own family down the road.



posted on Jul, 18 2010 @ 03:38 AM
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Originally posted by madmangunradio
What realy bothers me is that if my brother feels this way so do other soldiers.. It just doesnt make any damn sense.


Hell, I feel the same way as you with my brother... he been in the army for 10 years.... He wanted Bush to win, so with Obama also, and agrees on the Arizona immigration laws (we hispanic) among other things I've found out but we arent close as far with the talking goes so I wouldnt doubt for any reason he also thinks that way as well others in the military... They've been condition once they go in there, not saying all military personals would be down just cause they were told but they there and might be a lot more than those arent so conditioned




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