2 Utah State Employees Allegedly Behind Immigrant List

Originally posted by bismos

Originally posted by piddles

by the way, wouldn't you say it's hypocritical that the only way they thought they could get rid of illegals is...illegal?

You gotta fight fire with fire.

Even if it means burning down most of your house, your neighbor's house, etc?
I am just curious because I have never seen a firetruck that shoots flames.

Originally posted by slavenomore4u
You must be an illegal alien, or a operative, possibly one of thos trolls that we hear about.
or it could be that you have been brainwashed beyond all repair, whatever your defect is, it is working against this nation.
I am calling you out as a supporter of the insurection that is taking place on many levels in this nation, one of thos being the invasion of foriegn nationals. You are a traitor to your nation.

I am working against the nation because I think we should solve the problem with illegals in a way that won't harm american citizens?

let's review:

I'm a:

illegal alien, troll, brainwashed, haver of a defect, opposer of this nation, supporter of the invasion of foreign nationals, and a traitor.

because I:

don't think it's right that the people who are trying to solve this problem don't consider the rights of EVERY american. Because I think we should all have rights or none of us should.



stay classy


edit: may I add, I've said this before in other threads but it's a very good point. My mother came here when she was 12 illegally. She worked her ass off, became legal, raised 3 intelligent children, and is the most recommended craft service person in the television industry. Ever heard of Dexter? How about Glee? Maybe you've heard of NCIS? I'm sure you might have heard of CSI:Miami. All satisfied clientèle. My mother set a fantastic example to NEVER waste the opportunity my siblings and I have of being legal citizens.

I strongly disagree with your stance on what illegal mexicans are because it's not true of everyone. There are people who are here illegally who are bringing the system down. Uh, how many millions of people in the US are basically wasting their opportunity to be here? How many criminals, leeches, and media dividers of the people are literally making America an awful place to live? How many of them are illegals of ethnicities other than mexican?

you seriously speak of them like they're the only problem this nation faces. everything's going to be solved when the illegals leave!...right

[edit on 17-7-2010 by piddles]

Having read the report and the posts, and after great thought, here is my take on this:
For as nobel as what the state employees are accused of doing. I do say accused, as it has yet to be proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that they did the deed, and there are innocent until proven guilty, and those who did such an act, as nobel of an action as they have done, it does bring up several points that need to be looked at and considered. You see what the creators of the list did, was cause a politically inconvient situation.
1) If, those whose names are on the list, nothing is done to either deport them or to even check them out, then it proves that the federal government is choosing to turn a blind eye to entire illegale immigration problem, by not enforcing the laws of the country.
2) It should send a clear cut message to the illegale immigrants that the days of them hiding in the country are coming to an end, that if someone was able to compile a list, then it should tell them that anyone can do such.
3) This situation in Utah also shows that there will be mistakes made, but if the people have the documentation on hand, then it should resolve itself.

The realitiy of the illegale immigration issue and problem is that it has grown to the point of where there will be no politically correct solution to it, as the question must be asked, what to do with all of the illegale immigrants who are in the country. We can not just ignore it, nor can the people who have broken the law be allowed to continue to get off with out some kind of penality. Will mistakes be made, yes, but at the same time it needs to be done in a way that sends a message, that such actions will no longer be tolerated by the lawful citizens of the country, or its legitimate government. The problem is that too many elected officials tend to seek relelection from the first day on the job, and try to figure out how to gain a coalition of a voting bloc from one segment of the population, instead of speaking for all of the voters with one voice. The country can no longer afford to have illegale immigrants to come into the country as it is a drain on resources, and many times for those individuals in this day and age, have to resort to committing greater crimes in order to survive, from steal idenities to other more violent crimes. The situation can not be allowed to continue on.
So there you have it, I am on the fence on this, both saying it is about time that some in the government who work for me, started to do their job and report, but the way that they did such was just wrong, by reporting personal information and puting such out to the general public, bringing up memories of a past where such was done before. It was the right thing, done in the wrong way, the politically inconvient way. It was done outside of the system, but perhaps it is just something that needed to be done, to force the government to act.

reply to post by sdcigarpig


Don't think I could have said it any better than this. That was a well thought out post with common sense.

These people used their position of trust to access databases and illegally collect and distribute the personal information of over 1300 Utah residents. Many, if not most, are legal residents.

Basically, they brought up a list of people getting aid from the State of Utah, on their state owned, DWS computers, did a 'ctrl+F' typed in 'ez' and copied down every name that happened to end in those two letters.

What they did was not noble or courageous or patriotic. It was illegal and cowardly and xenophobic. If these people were so proud of their work, they would have signed the list when they sent it out.

Not really the fault of the people who stole the list if on the list of illegals the government had legals mixed in.

Don't get peeved at those trying to do the right thing, get peeved at the ones who made the mistakes on the list.

Originally posted by Mr. Tinkertrain
Not really the fault of the people who stole the list if on the list of illegals the government had legals mixed in.

COMPILED the list, not stole.

Don't get peeved at those trying to do the right thing, get peeved at the ones who made the mistakes on the list.

How about the people this story is about who clearly did the wrong thing?

I am amazed to see so many ATS members saying that they think it would be ok to include their name on a list of suspected criminals that need to be checked out.

reply to post by evil incarnate


blah blah blah.

Be amazed all you want. I'm sure I'm on a few lists already, one more won't hurt me.

Originally posted by Mr. Tinkertrain
reply to post by evil incarnate

 

blah blah blah.

So you are having a hard time understanding the difference between stealing a list already made and actually making a faulty list?

Be amazed all you want. I'm sure I'm on a few lists already, one more won't hurt me.

Obviously none of those are lists of people that read the entire sentence. Good luck with all that.

reply to post by piddles

by the way, wouldn't you say it's hypocritical that the only way they thought they could get rid of illegals is...illegal?

No more illegal than the Sanctuary Cities sheltering and protecting illegals, and the inaction of the the Federal government in enforcing existing immigration law. It has gotten so bad here in Colorado that U.S. citizens are being prosecuted for defending themselves from the criminal activities of illegals, while the illegals walk away.

If there are illegals on the roles of taxpayer funded welfare programs to help U.S. citizens, then those programs' members should be looked into, and the illegals shipped back to their home countries.

Trying to divert attention away from the underlying problem by prosecuting individuals trying to bring attention to the ongoing corruption in the system is not going to work, especially with so many people opening their eyes and raising their voices in protest.

reply to post by NotTooHappy


Indeed! Well put.
And if the list makers even view this as an act of civil disobedience, they apparently want no part in the consequences of their actions.

I would have been more interested in a list of every EMPLOYER of illegal workers. Go after who is HIRING workers ILLEGALLY.

reply to post by Ferris.Bueller.II


tell me, can you provide any sources or proof that his is happening in Colorado? I've heard all kinds of people talk about illegals cheating the judicial system but I truthfully can't find any proof of it beyond people just saying other people are doing it.

I think the federal gov't, which is either too powerful or not powerful enough apparently, needs smart, updated legislation. The current immigration laws do not do enough or consider the availability of resources the US or the Cartel. Whatever new law we come up with, the cartel will spend more than enough money to circumvent it (spend money to make money, if you will).

You're saying we shouldn't prosecute these individuals because you think people will be outraged? I'm not sure if I agree. I don't agree with always doing "whatever it takes". What if "whatever it takes" paves the way for further violation of our rights?

my opinions, of course, but I can't help but to feel like if you're going to solve a problem, you should solve it in a way that won't create more problems.

reply to post by sdcigarpig


I would agree with you that something needs to be done but not in this way.

someone else makes a really good point, why was this list sent anonymously if they were really fighting for the sake of america? Wouldn't they want to be renowned for their "heroism"?

but you present the opposing argument in a fantastic way, thank you