Atheism is a Cop-out

reply to post by mordant1

controlling moral authority

Controlling...means 'forced'.

Morals are something that evolves with age, experiences, and the observation through life to the world around you. Some believe in a controlling moral authority...some believe in a 'chosen' or 'naturally evolved' morality....not like a outside source controlling it.

reply to post by LeoVirgo


No, controlling means controlling, forced means forced.
I dont allow definitional bracket creep, the meaning of words must be fixed (or there's no reason to talk and no way to establish intellectual controls, which, d'uh is why you try it.) that's why there are so f**king many of them with their attendent shades and nuances of meaning.
Deal with it.

[edit on 11-7-2010 by mordant1]

[edit on 11-7-2010 by mordant1]

[edit on 11-7-2010 by mordant1]

Originally posted by mordant1
reply to post by LeoVirgo

 

No, controlling means controlling, forced means forced.
I dont allow definitional bracket creep, the meaning of words must be fixed (or there's no reason to talk and no way to establish intellectual controls, which, d'uh is why you try it.) that's why there are so f**king many of them with their attendent shades and nuances of meaning.
Deal with it.

[edit on 11-7-2010 by mordant1]

[edit on 11-7-2010 by mordant1]

[edit on 11-7-2010 by mordant1]

In the idea that a God sets moral rules...and you must follow them...or else....is control, is forced.

Do you always do good because a 'or else' effect' from your God? Surely not...surely you do good because its what you feel is the right way for you to be....your own choice of moral.

*Sigh*

Anyone else tired of these theist bigotry threads?

reply to post by LeoVirgo


So, then as you are controlling yourself you are forced?
Force means against your will or you will be punished. How sad you'd feel your whole life is forced upon you against your will, or are you simply out of control?

reply to post by traditionaldrummer


Some more words you can use nazi, bush ( either 1 & 2) halliburton, cheney, racist, antisemetic, McCarthty, christian, etc, jeeze, with these you can easily win any argument!

reply to post by mordant1


No...I make choices. Many choices earlier in my life did not follow my inner compass....I made choices knowing they werent the wisest of things to do.

Many things can interfere with ones 'moral compass'....and the person might choose to not follow their morals all the time. With time, we learn from feelings of guilt, feelings of regrets...and this might help us make wiser choices in the future.

This really boils donw to 'what is a persons reasons for being 'good'. If its due to a source outside of them, and a fear that they might not have 'rewards' one day...this belief shows a 'God' forcing moral to them, and if they dont follow the 'forced control' they will be punished for it. Some people might do good things, for reasons that arent so honest in good intent.

Do you go around not killing because God says to not do so? Surely you dont kill others because within you, you have found that to be a 'wrong' way to live. Do you go around not stealing from others because God left this rule unto you....or do you find within yourself, reasons to not steal from others, that it is 'wrong' to take what is not yours.

You are trying to twists this around.

If the person is doing something because its 'Gods way'.... are they doing the 'better thing' with true intent or are they doing it because they themselves find it to be 'good'.

If you are acting a certain way for a source outside of you....the intent is different....then if you are doing something, because you feel its just the right thing to do.

Do you think you have to have a source outside of you to let you know about 'good morals'? Surely not....

[edit on 11-7-2010 by LeoVirgo]

[edit on 11-7-2010 by LeoVirgo]

Originally posted by randyvs
reply to post by Amagnon

 

Then you twist the discussion, where I am claiming agnosticism is brave?

Don't feel all alone. Alot of people are catching on to this guys twisted
double speak.

While others are capable of reading.

Originally posted by Amagnon
Therefore, with respect to your charge of cowardice, I offer a counter charge - namely arrogance.

Additionally, it is easy to see that it requires more courage to live in an alien and unfamiliar place than to inhabit a familiar one.

Originally posted by Saul of Tarsus
Atheism is a cop-out. Non-belief in GOD is non-belief in self. GOD is not a dead white male in the sky. G (generate) O (organize) D (deliver) are attributes of the one reality of which we are part, therefore attributes of ourselves.

If I were to translate this material for someone who does not speak english, your acronym will not work. So how would you explain that to a spanish speaking person whose word for god is dios? Or for a croat speaking person whose word for god is bog using words in their own language?

reply to post by Katie


Maybe Atheists are brainwashed to look the other way in leu of solid foundational thinking that pertains to the spiritual? Just because Dawkins says all spirituality is a joke doesn't make it so.

This coming from an Atheist.

reply to post by LeoVirgo


Sorry, so, you control yourself and by your rationale control is force. Whew! It's gotta be tough being you. Who do you tattletale to about yourself? Is this an S&M thing with you? Kinky!

[edit on 11-7-2010 by mordant1]

Originally posted by Hydroman

Originally posted by Saul of Tarsus
Atheism is a cop-out. Non-belief in GOD is non-belief in self. GOD is not a dead white male in the sky. G (generate) O (organize) D (deliver) are attributes of the one reality of which we are part, therefore attributes of ourselves.

If I were to translate this material for someone who does not speak english, your acronym will not work. So how would you explain that to a spanish speaking person whose word for god is dios? Or for a croat speaking person whose word for god is bog using words in their own language?

Yeah and if you think it's difficult in cyrillic (do croats have cyrillic or romanized alphabet?) try it in hieroglyphs or chinese!

reply to post by mordant1


Control is a force and is not to hard to understand. To control something you must expel energy to enforce the desired effect. Without force no control could be garnered .

reply to post by mordant1


If I always controlled myself, according to moral values....I would be perfect

What is wrong with you...you just keep twisting things that you dont like to hear?

Your have not addressed by true point....some people make choices because they feel its the right choice....some make choices because its the choice they feel their God approves of.

So do you make choices because its what God tells you is right....or do you make choices because you decided it was right?

To do for a source outside of yourself...because you have been told that if you dont do right...you will be punished and not have your reward....is a system of force upon a being. Its a system of control....it does not allow people to look within and understand their own reasoning for right and wrong.

Just look at religions.....lol...they say their God says 'do not kill' but then they turn around and justify killings.

Mabey if they looked within, instead of outside....they might find there is no justifications for those killings.

But you will be punished...if you dare look to your own reasoning's...so dont dare try it.

reply to post by LeoVirgo


You would only be as perfect as your preconceived ideas about morality allowed and that would only be subjectively speaking. I doubt everyone would find you morally pleasing if you could act the way you perceived without any hindrances.

Originally posted by IamBoon
reply to post by LeoVirgo

 

You would only be as perfect as your preconceived ideas about morality allowed and that would only be subjectively speaking. I doubt everyone would find you morally pleasing if you could act the way you perceived without any hindrances.

Well yes, only in my own eyes...would I be perfect. Which I wont ever think such things

Agreed, to your point.

Originally posted by IamBoon
reply to post by mordant1

 

Control is a force and is not to hard to understand. To control something you must expel energy to enforce the desired effect. Without force no control could be garnered .

Who forces you when you want to control your temper. When you control your hand to write, who forces it?
What entity makes you control your breathing when you swim under water?
While force and control can be associated, they are not the same thing and therefore not equivalent or interchangable.
IT IS subtle, kinda like 1 is different from 2

Do all words mean to you whatever you want them to mean?
Inquiring minds want to know...

[edit on 11-7-2010 by mordant1]

Originally posted by mordant1

Originally posted by IamBoon
reply to post by mordant1

 

Control is a force and is not to hard to understand. To control something you must expel energy to enforce the desired effect. Without force no control could be garnered .

Who forces you when you want to control your temper. When you control your hand to write, who forces it?

I do , unless you are holding my hand then I would hope you to be a female.

What entity makes you control your breathing when you swim under water?

I do! I am sure you have held your breathe . Doing otherwise sux.

While force and control can be associated, they are not the same thing and therefore not equivalent or interchangable.

No one said they were... except for you right now. To have control you must use a method that uses force of some sort. Pretty easy to understand unless you want me to do that for you?

IT IS subtle, kinda like 1 is different from 2

Do all words mean to you whatever you want them to mean?
Inquiring minds want to know...

No , but obviously they do to you. You see to argue control over something with no force is silly and while they may be two different things you shouldn't embarrass yourself stating otherwise.



[edit on 11-7-2010 by IamBoon]

Thank you all for your contributions to this thread. It appears it is not such an exhausted topic after all, considering the number of posts in the short time since its posting. I will attend to your replies over the next few days. If I do not reply to your post, please reread the original thread, it is possible you have missed something. Many Blessings

reply to post by UmbraSumus


Wrong question, the question to ask yourself is, "Who am I?"