BOYCOTT: American Job Exporters!! The List

Oh I am not against typcial economic politics but especially in Germany we have about 99% of "cloned-like" economy students and 1% who are actually capable of ethics, economics, morals and have the intelligence to use it in proper ways. Most are low-brainers and incapable of fluent speech and rhetorics...ah I just don't like them.
And those people happen to get in positions where they can actually decide some things - awful.

I don't ask for revolution but maybe some ethic/moral codex like doctors have to give, that would help very much. oh - and initial tests at the universites so that not every dumbass can study economy

But that would be silly; how irritated you might be by peoples' attitudes shouldn't enter discussion of economics, should it?

My opinion is that economics has very much to do with moral and ethics, that was the reason I came up with tracing the source of the outsourcing problem back to imoral fast-career's.

[edit on 14-6-2004 by shoo]

Originally posted by df1

The problem is not free enterprise, it is the lack of free enterprise. The government has stacked the laws and regulations in favor of the large wealthy corporations resulting in the suffocation of the small and innovative.

I will agree with this to a point. As an upstart entrepeneur myself, I have personally taken advantage of many loopholes and incentives available to small business. Let's not confuse the issue. Economic modeling requires certain asumptions.

Heir and shoo,
Ethic enters the economic picture when the individual consumer looks to compare between companies. A consumer might choose coke over pepsi because of very specific relationships that each company holds dear. If we assume that the two products are identical, advertising itself having no influence, though type of adds themselves could infer moral/ethical dogma. The consumer might have information that pepsi has made questionable deals with Saudi Arabia whereas coke has no such dealings. In choosing coke, I have made a choice based upon my percieved ethical analysis of the two companies.

Maybe Drudge will expound apon his list as you have suggested. Then again, he could just start a new list. Listing companies that do not export jobs would probably be short and sweet.

I took a cursory look at the list provided by the author, and can tell you that it is very incomplete. For example, the wife of a certain presidential candidate shares the wealth of one of the missing companies.

America cannot survive by keeping jobs with high salaries at home when the same jobs can be done overseas at a fraction of the labor price. It is an economic fact of life, and part of a larger, complex problem.

(Simplistic summary follows
You can buy a pair of sneakers at WalMart for $10. Made overseas at $3/hour labor cost. To make those same sneakers here at $12 - $15/ hour would price them at about $20. Why would a consumer pay double the price for the same pair of sneakers? So, to make the US manufacturer competitive, you have to impose an import tariff. Do you really want to go down that slippery slope?

We have gone through the demise of the textile industry, the steel industry, the auto industry, and others. We will survive this latest challenge the way we have throughout our history - by being smarter.

Originally posted by jsobecky
You can buy a pair of sneakers at WalMart for $10. Made overseas at $3/hour labor cost. To make those same sneakers here at $12 - $15/ hour would price them at about $20. Why would a consumer pay double the price for the same pair of sneakers? So, to make the US manufacturer competitive, you have to impose an import tariff. Do you really want to go down that slippery slope?

Walmart is not on the list so it would not apply to them. Walmart has always had their products made over seas. I think we should only apply the tariff to companies who put american workers on the street.

No, I was not suggesting that WalMart be boycotted. My point was more of a business nature, applying to all companies. In other words, if a pair of sneakers can be manufactured for so much less overseas, how can an American company compete by employing only much more expensive American labor?

Michael Moore did a documentary where he challenged the CEO of NIKE to build a plant in the USA. NIKE currently uses overseas labor (Thai? I forget which). Moore beat down every objection that the CEO had, but in the end, the CEO just said that a NIKE plant in America was not in their plans. He also stated his (cop-out) opinion that Americans do not really want to make sneakers, even though Moore had assembled a large group of unemployed outside the building, willing to work.

The CEO didn't state the obvious - that NIKE could not compete with overseas labor costs, by manufacturing sneakers here in the US.

All CEOs ultimately answer to stockholders, who care about the bottom line.

No matter what you call outsourcing it basiclly boils down to this... The Planned Destruction of the job base infrastructure of this Nation. Someone asked is it all that important that we cultivate and maintain jobs here rather than scattered all over the world. The answer is so ridiculously easy that only a idiot could miss it. We have spent multiple billions of dollars on the business of Corporate America. To drive home my point just open up the Catalog Pages of the Thomas Registry. I have used this source to prospect businesses for years and even with all that there is in this reference source there are vast numbers of Companies disolving into thin air. Outsourcing is the mortal enemy of Corporate America. If we allow this to destroy our economic vitality all the Kings Horses and all the Kings Men will be relegated to flipping burgers for grins and a handout!

Look very closely at the Thomas Registry and learn a hard cold lesson in reality, once this is gone we have lost everything then you will get to pack a bag and go to China and work like a coolie for .30cents an hour when you could have voted out the liberals in our government and recaptured our National Heritage of living Free and Independent lives. The Socialist State must go and the sooner the better!

Originally posted by winker
Someone asked is it all that important that we cultivate and maintain jobs here rather than scattered all over the world. ...

See, I wouldn't have asked a hypothetical question like that. I would asked something more like "is it all that important that we remain competitive in the global economy," as it strikes me as having more to do with reality.

The Socialist State must go and the sooner the better!

Um, so you're advocating state intervention in the markets to protect workers from competitive forces, and you posture as being against socialism?

Socialism is the subtle enemy of every state in America and Nation in the world. It must die a quick death if we are to survive and hopfully it will take with it all the Globalist Elites; too good to work a real job. America First and only; if you think so highly of this develish plot then we who know what it is all about invite you to leave these shores and never come back. Take Michael Moore and Alec Baldwin along for grins and we cetrainly won't miss ya!

Originally posted by winker
if you think so highly of this develish plot then we who know what it is all about invite you to leave these shores and never come back. Take Michael Moore and Alec Baldwin along for grins and we cetrainly won't miss ya!

Okay, then in the same spirit I invite you to "leave these shores" and head for an economy that wasn't built up by global trade. Automation put farm workers and factory workers out of work, so I guess that qualifies as anti-worker from your point of view. You'd feel more at home in an agrarian economy where machinery and a modern standard of living don't exist, it seems.

Micahel Moore Hates America

Michael Moore Hates America is a feature-length documentary that takes you across the country -- From Moore's "hometown" of Flint to Washington, DC to LA -- in search of the American Dream and holds Michael Moore's filmmaking tactics up to the light.
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We'll deconstruct the genre of documentary film to show you how filmmakers can manipulate interviews and statistics to communicate a desired message, and then how the media runs with that message.
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While it has its serious side, Michael Moore Hates America is a hilarious romp through the myths about American life. It reduces silly conspiracy theories to rubble, challenges populist ideologies by putting them through uproarious tests and gets to the truth about Michael Moore's background, and his evolution into one of today's most prominent propagandists.

And again you've warned us all of the dangers of socialism. Are you accusing those who support outsourcing of socialism? Can you please explain how that makes sense?

It is Evil Incarnate it destroys the American Way of Life. I have worn the Uniform of the military and left these shores to fight for Freedom and Liberty to rid the world of a social disease called Socialism. I am willing to put up without an apology and fight in the open for what is right. Can you say the same ?????

The benefits are too numerous to mention but things like socialized socialist medicine is not my idea of medical care. Companies should be able to provide the medical benefits to their employees and families. Strong companies are the backbone of a nation and those for pure greed alone are Traitors of the highest magnatitude for leaving and going overseas exploiting foreign workers for profit and greed. Those on the List deserve nothing but villification for their Un-Patriotic acts of Treason, plain and simple. When its all gone we will see just how social, socialism really is; if you really ascribe to the tenets of socialism and believe "ALL" share the wealth equally you really are poor pitiful and wretched in your thinking.

Personally I think we should be boycotting companies who employ child labor. Be they american or from whichever country.

You are absolutely correct in what you say, This is what you do when you walk the walk and talk the talk. America has suffered a credibility defecit lately and we all must finally wake up to the point of owning up to our short comings. There was a time when we did what was right no matter what but now because of rampant socialism we are clouded in our thinking and strain on a gnat instead of simply doing what we know needs to be done. Our learning curve needs to be straighted as soon as possible so we can see the big picture and fix it before it gets all of us.

Originally posted by winker
...and left these shores to fight for Freedom and Liberty to rid the world of a social disease called Socialism. I am willing to put up without an apology and fight in the open for what is right. Can you say the same ?????

Okay, so just to keep track, you have yet to explain to me how (1)thinking that outsourcing in some form is good for the long term US economy equates to (2)advocating socialism. However, you have succeeded in advertising your military service. I congratulate you. I'm not even from the US, so I'm sure your opinion carries more weight than mine. However, do you think your past military service qualifies to make decisions for your country? You see, you are the one who would seem to be more at home in China, Cuba, or North Korea, where the military is in control, from the kind of thinking that being a veteran makes one's opinion signifcant enough to deport those who disagree (which is how I interpret your statement, although I specifically am not American so correct me if I'm wrong).

Do you think your opinion is more important than the opinions of the innovators and economic decision makers who pay for your wars? Do you comprehed that the ability of your country to send you overseas is dependent on your country's economic strength?

In the end this argument is about economics, and I won't be responding to more McCarthy-like rhetoric. Again, I reiterate that I am not a socialist, and that I think outlawing outsourcing is a step toward socialism. If you disagree and have economic arguments to back up your position, I'd be glad to read them.

If you boycott jobs from going to other countries then you will not have other countries bring jobs to you.

And for US thats a disaster.

US gets more jobs then it exports.

6% unemployment is not bad comparing to Germany 19% and they still have jobs coming to US and NOT boycotting them.


All in all boycoots is the dumbest thing US can do at this time about jobs.

Out,
Russian

[edit on 17-6-2004 by Thomas Crowne]

Originally posted by Russian
6% unemployment is not bad comparing to Germany 19% and they still have jobs coming to US and NOT boycotting them.

Checked statistics on pravda.ru?

Winker, step away from the bottle!

Blah, blah, uniform, blah. Same here, pal. You know what I didn't serve for? I didn't serve so that the government can tell the manufacturing companies where to have their businesses.

Russian is right, our unemployment is nothing compared to other nations, and ironically, those nations are much more socialistic than we are, but while socialism is bad, being so far to the right that you allow individuals to own business but dictate what and where they can operate is bad, too.

Russian, the Germans don't boycott us? I don't know what they do. I do know that they, along with France and Germany, decided, for under the table economic reasons, to stand against us in part of the War on Terror. Very much like a boycott, I'd say.

What we are facing seems to be typical as nations go from pre-industrial, industrial, post-industrial and then service. And, as Russian pointed out, jobs come here. My area used to be big into textile, but that has gone south of the border. Since then, though, Alabama has become a target spot for foreign auto industry, from Mercedec to Hyundai.

Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
Russian, the Germans don't boycott us? I don't know what they do. I do know that they, along with France and Germany, decided, for under the table economic reasons, to stand against us in part of the War on Terror. Very much like a boycott, I'd say.

I thought everybody has realised that the war against terror was a big bubble that has been blown up many times until now
by the way, I saw many proofs about french business related to Iraq and Iran but not much about Germany and I don't consider 2 or 3 companies being a serious influence for a political decission. The most simple explaination would be that the French and Germans knew that this whole war has no sense in it.
And why should we support a war that is just for US economic reasons? It sounds like you come from somewhere back in the past like one year before, strange opinion, very strange.

@Russian: Unemployment rate in Germany is 10%

I love calling a 'help center', for my computer, or a phone bill problem, or a mortgage lender , and getting someone from another country, with an accent so bad, I can't make out what they are saying. Companies are moving their customer service jobs overseas, to India in particular.

this backlash against outsourcing is as old as the hills. check your history books, similar things have happened many times in our past. when it becomes economically unviable for our companies to be in certain businesses they move elsewhere and other businesses take their place. its a natural occurance for our economy.

Originally posted by Skadi_the_Evil_Elf
Hate to break it to you guys, but General Electric isnt an American cooperation.

They're not? What country is General Electric from then?