Notice To all who Believe in Aliens/UFO's

reply to post by chemical_chameleon


The proof needs to be in the pudding, for me.

Before I joined the military, I bought into the whole idea that the government was some big homogeneous cache of secrets, agents, and people with a relatively single organized objective.

Oh Dear God... Was I ever under the wrong impression.

If there are people legitimately in contact with aliens - they are doing an exceptionally damned good job of keeping it quiet.

Now, I would believe we have programs aimed at recovering and analyzing alien technology (there are some contingencies on the books for how to handle and respond to discovering such oddities in place, simply because that is the point of a contingency - to have a plan for the extraordinary events), and there are probably some that have been active. However, as entertaining as the idea is that we owe much of our modern society to reverse-engineered alien technology from the shadow government; there's simply no real evidence to suggest it.

Predictability is pretty key. Quite a few whistle-blowers who try to claim to have knowledge that our technology is the result of research on alien tech, and have inside information about what 'technology our government currently has functional' have consistently failed to either identify what those technologies are, or successfully predict the civilian-equivalent.

Of course, going by that criteria, Star Wars, Star Trek, Star Gate, have a better understanding of alien technology than the people who supposedly are coming forward with inside information.

To that end, I believe that - if we have contact, and have alien artifacts - the people involved with it are well above par in their ability to keep things secret.

That said - it is hard to hear a dog fart in Time's Square. With so much fodder that ranges from genuine tales of interest and concern to deliberate and fraudulent... the little bits of true information out there are swept up in the storm, and we're looking for needles in a haystack.

In the end - I don't see how it is at all possible or productive for us to try and apply a motive or personality to aliens. With so many stories out there talking about how aliens are telepathic due to larger brains (and the false notion we only use 10% of ours) - or citing some other common urban myth; it elevates much of the 'research' that can be done on aliens to the status of an urban myth.

That's not to say their existence and visitation is an urban myth - but, I've simply not seen enough to justify trying to label aliens.

This thread is dead, due the governments of the world informing on national tv and through newspapers that extra terrestrials exist. They have been working with a special race the last 50 years +. If this is the same race that has been found through history i do not know.

I think that we can never stop believing in what's out there, we all just need to keep an open mind about things and hope that someting comes of it. If there is life outside of earth do you think it will be good or bad!? Just curious...

reply to post by yuefo

One or more of them might very well know something you don't.

If by this you mean they were abducted or so the aliens/beings with their own eyes than its just a story, on anecdotal evidence. Now for the person experiencing it it could be quite real but if they can't prove it happened to me what possible reason could I have for believing such a story? Especially when there are thousands of people who have reported what the aliens look like and most either conform to known archetypes (grays) or are totally unique to the individual drawing them.

If, however, by this statement you mean there might be people in the government who know what UFOs are. Well yeah, there could be, but we don't know if there are. So its pointless to believe that there are until evidence/disclosure.

reply to post by Titen-Sxull


There's nothing hard to understand about what I said. You said:

anyone claiming to know is lying or making an assertion of faith (or both).

How do you know that anyone claiming to know is lying?

From what I know this is a prison planet with really no hope of space flight. beyond the ISS...and that's how the ets want to keep it..there will be no meaningful contact.

reply to post by King Triad


May I ask exactly what it is that you know, which makes you think that A) this is a prison planet b) that there will be no contact and finaly c) that your sources are believable enough to make you grasp at a deeply gloomy outlook?

I've been in contact with nordics for 37 years...all attempts were made to get a treaty here but failed....they chose to stay in the dark.

reply to post by King Triad


So technicaly, there has already been "contact" of one sort or another? I mean ANY contact is in fact contact, its not just the officialy recognised incidents which qualify.
I ask again, why do you trust your source... I still dont understand exactly how it is you come to believe that this planet is a prison. Baring in mind we have the beginings of the technology to allow us to move beyond mere probes and satelites , I feel confused as to where the walls of this prison are. Please elaborate further on these points.

Contact was made 60 years ago, the ptb have chosen to side with the dracos over the nordics ...hence we are were we are today...The walls of our prison are based on our technology.

[edit on 18-6-2010 by King Triad]

reply to post by yuefo


I said they were lying OR making an assertion of faith. They might well be telling what they believe is the truth. For instance we've got lots of people on here who have never seen an alien or any evidence of one but who believe in them anyway and state just that. I think when you don't actually have the evidence and you state something as fact which is actually a faith based opinion you are lying.

That's not to say there's no one who knows about what UFOs are but they would have to show evidence of such and if they can't than they should be placed under the two categories rather than believed.

Lying OR Making an assertion of faith.

Originally posted by Titen-Sxull
reply to post by yuefo

 

I think when you don't actually have the evidence and you state something as fact which is actually a faith based opinion you are lying.

Those are two different things. You could have a faith-based opinion with admittedly no evidence, or you could know something but have no way of proving it.

Imagine you're in a murder trail as a witness, and you say, "I saw the defendant shoot that man."

And the defense attorney says, "Can you prove it?"

And you can't because you were the only person who saw the shooting and you didn't take a photo.

Then the defense attorney [you] says, "If you can't prove it, you're a liar. Your honor, this witness just lied under oath. He should be charged with perjury."

That's not to say there's no one who knows about what UFOs are but they would have to show evidence of such and if they can't than they should be placed under the two categories rather than believed. Lying OR Making an assertion of faith.

"They should be placed under the two categories" by YOU, right? Things are taken on faith, believed, all the time. When you cross the street, you believe that the car waiting at the crosswalk isn't going to run you down. You can't prove it, but you believe it. So you've made up a rule on who to believe and who not to, but it's really neither here nor there.

Now setting aside the faith-based assertion, I ask the same question: how do you KNOW that someone who claims to KNOW is lying? Isn't that just a faith-based assertion on your part? Can you prove he doesn't know as he says he does? What would be YOUR evidence to prove he's lying? Saying you don't believe someone is different from claiming that you KNOW they are liars.

Originally posted by rolls_royce_7
I think that we can never stop believing in what's out there, we all just need to keep an open mind about things and hope that someting comes of it. If there is life outside of earth do you think it will be good or bad!? Just curious...

I think it will be life.

Life is not really good or bad, it is an experience.

Of course, that's not really the type of answer you were looking for - but, I think it's safe to say that - given our observations on this planet and the way life has developed; the smarter animals tend to be the predatory ones. They need to be smart because their source of sustenance is evasive and can defend itself.

That doesn't mean we are going to be on the menu, but it means that - thinking logically, we are more likely to run into a species that will see us as a means to an end or an ant hill.

Or, just as we value life, they may value ours too - if it is not the sort of value one places upon the marvel of how a chain of ants carries food from place to place.

I believe life is fairly common in the universe - and there are plenty of life forms out there that have developed interstellar travel through some means. It's also not unlikely that they would have visited us or be visiting us. Why they don't land on the white-house front lawn and introduce themselves is something we can only speculate about.

It's like I said before - space is big. If there is an ant-hill right where you want to set up a chair and sit down, you generally just leave the ants alone and go do your own thing elsewhere.

So, I think life out there will be much the same as life here, just on a different scale. There will be predators and prey, politics and affiliations, 'wilderness' and 'urban.'

We just can't really know where we fit into all of it until we get a look at the bigger picture.

reply to post by yuefo

or you could know something and have no way of proving it

That's true BUT just because you say you know it doesn't mean that I, hearing you talking about it, should assume you are telling the truth. My default position is skepticism. If someone says they know it but can't prove it than I have a default position of assuming they are probably lying or making an assertion of faith. If they cannot show that they are not making an assertion of faith or being dishonest than I have absolutely no reason to take their story as truth - especially when its dealing with a subject as out there as UFOs and aliens and such.

For instance if I see a UFO land right in front of me and little green bug-eyed aliens step out and talk to me I might know what I just experienced is real but if I can't prove it there's no way that anyone will believe me AND THEY SHOULDN'T BELIEVE ME - because what kind of world would it be if everyone with a crackpot story was taken seriously and Tabloids became Gospel.

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

If any of this is unclear please send me a U2U and we will discuss it further (since we kinda derailed the thread a bit with our discussion).

reply to post by True-seer


isnt there a big difference between believing they exist and wishing for them to visit? sorry if i misunderstood your post in any way