Israel and Turkey Square off over Flotilla Crisis

Originally posted by dzonatas
reply to post by lpowell0627

 

Why can't Israel just learn to trust a nation like the Irish and others to send just aid to Gaza.

The Ireland is full of radicals thats why. Let someone with a reputation for peace to lose send in the aid.... like the Swiss...maybe Canada. But Ireland?.....let them send Lucky Charms and Lepricons.

reply to post by lpowell0627


Because Israel will not allow many items to go through. Cement, pencils, paper, educational supplies, these are all dangerous items that must be stopped from reaching Gaza




In addition, why should they? Gaza is not Israel. The blockade is not legal. Ships can go to Gaza if they want to.

[edit on 4-6-2010 by InvisibleAlbatross]

reply to post by da elohim


You are not helping at all.

reply to post by InvisibleAlbatross


i'm not trying to help, i don't care for isreal.

O, I can't wait for Britain, the US and Israel their response...

Originally posted by habfan1968
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

 

If Hamas was not in charge there, this may not be happening. You can go on all day about whether the blockade is legal but since you point out that law is really about precedence then you would also agree that Egypt and Israel have set the precedence over the last couple of years in controlling the borders, airspace and territorial waters.

Alright that's two nations out of how many? Further in regards to Egypt it has been ruled by Mubarak for 42 years now, and is the second largest recipient of U.S. Aide in the world next to Israel. So it's actions like Israel's have to be viewed with a grain of salt.

Further Hamas is the duely elected governing entity in Gaza, and if you want to compare the number of women and children killed by Gazan's inside of Israel and Israeli's killing inside of Gaza there is no comparisson as Israel has killed far more women and children, the epitiome of terrorist violence than the Gazans have.

The only difference is while many citizens of the world view Israel itself as a terrorist organization and rogue state the most influential politicians don't.

If it weren't for the U.S. Veto on the U.N. Security Council, Isreals status might in fact be far worse as an organization than Hamas's is.

So in my opinion, if Hamas is duely elected, they are a legitimate governing entity and the violence they have deployed pales in comparrison to the Violence many western nations have deployed.

So while people like to play the politics of word games like terrorist organization, rogue regime, enemy combatants, politically correct and conventional wisdom as the means to justify the politics of murder and war, people are in fact starving and going without every day basic necessities as a result.

The unlawful blockade of Gaza is collective punishment that effects innocent men, women and children, and in violation of every international convention that there is.

There are no acceptable political excuses for it.

[edit on 4/6/10 by ProtoplasmicTraveler]

Originally posted by Wildbob77
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

 

Currently Isreal is sending about 100 truckloads of supplies to the Gaza strip daily.

If they wanted to sabotage food and medical supplies, they already have a way to do it.

I think that your argument is not valid since the goods that are currently being brought in to the Gaza strip, for the most part, come through the border with Israel.

Well you know my friend everyone is entitled to an opinion but this is where I feel my argument is valid.

The majority of what is going into Gaza by Israel is seen as coming from Israel. The stuff coming off of those aide boats is seen as coming from other nations. So there are two additional factors you might not be considering nor want to consider.

The first is that Israel has plausible deniability then if the goods arrive tainted, it can claim that the originating aide organizations provided them with tainted goods, and in so doing drive a wedge between people that want to legitimately help and the people who could use that aide.

The second is once delivering tainted goods from one of these aide flotillas Israel has even more excuses to ‘inspect’ all cargo going into Gaza to ‘prevent’ tainted and spoiled food stuffs, and expired and tainted medicines from ‘harming’ the people of Gaza.

Regardless of these potential opportunities for Israel to inflict further damage or loss of life on Gazans the reality is that the blockade is unlawful and in violation of International law with everyone from the Head of the U.N. General Assembly to hundreds of nations around the world stating it is unlawful and should end.

Because of our unilaterally imposed veto (our being the U.S. where I live) no international action no matter how large the majority will ever be implemented by an International Body that the U.S. Controls through veto power.

So the only people who are going to lift this unlawful blockade are the people of the world, and certainly not the politicians of Israel, or the politicians of any nation that are subject to their will be subverted in the U.N. Security Council by one nation acting unilaterally in defiance of the majority.

Once again all our notions of democracy are truly false as even when the majority are permitted to vote on a specific issue, in this case the nations and the representatives in the United Nations General Assembly which number over a 150, there are 5 nations alone that can veto that resolution, and impose it’s singular will against the majority if they wish too. So it is neither democratic or effective, and as a result the unlawful blockade of Gaza remains a unlawful blockade that a nation operating in defiance of and in violation of International Law is seeking to maintain as an unlawful undeclared act of war, and an even more unlawful collective punishment on an entire society.

Your arguments are tragically flawed from a moral standpoint from start to finish.

Well the USA will be doing all it can to assist the zionists in iserail and the reason is quite simple when you look at what they are doing to Cuba.

I hope the irish fight back when borded because they have evey right in the world to enter gaza as and when they please and i would buy them all a beer if i could.

Iserail is punching above it's wait only because the USA gave them nukes and then they go around trying to police the world and telling us Iran is a terrorist nation for wanting the same tools as the zionists have.

Talk about cowards

ifthings turn bad then it's not just iserail that had better watchout for the publics backlash but also those in washington that are pulling the stings even if they are in the pay list of the international bankers because i don't think the american people will let them go much further without taking some action that is long overdue.

Well, I find that stories which cannot get their basic facts right due to shoddy research are usually poor opinion. The article tots a war which won't happen.

Turkey does not deply F-15 fighters for a starters.

Regards

reply to post by LieBuster


The USA did not give Israel nukes!

They have a reactor and built their own.

Don't just make up your facts.

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


I hadn't thought about the plausible denial ability aspect.

I think that it's about time for the world to get together and figure out how to help the mid east.

I think that the Israelis have a right to live in peace as well as the people in the West bank and Gaza.

I would love it if peace suddenly broke out. However, there are people on both sides who have so much hate in their hearts that I don't think peace will ever happen.

I don't really see a realistic way to stop the violence, do you?

If Turkey(or any other country) wants to help Hamas they should give Hamas warships. hamas can fly there flag from them.
Make sure Hamas has plenty of weapons and ammo on the ships and let them go at Israel.

It should be interesting to say the least.

I bet the only part of the warships to make Gaza would be a oil slick.

reply to post by Wildbob77


The only type of peace Israel wants is one of complete military dominance of the arab countries. There is a reason Israel needs powerful countries to support it to such an extreme extent. First it was Britain, then it was France and finally the USA. Because the crazies in Israel feel it is their right to dominate the region and the arabs, any country that threatens this is cut down to size or simply bought off. The relationship has positives for both Israel and America in the end, without the support Israel would be a modern, fairly wealthy country...but it would not have anywhere near the military capabilities able to dominate the region as it does now, this is unacceptable to the crazies, that's why the relationship with America is so critical to Israel and something they will do anything to keep a hold of. Like i said though, America gets a lot out of it as well.

[edit on 4-6-2010 by Solomons]

reply to post by Wildbob77


Actually USA did help Israel to build reactors secretly which is all documented. Israeli then secretly bought nuclear techonology from the French.