reply to post by mhc_70
It sounds like I am implying that once a state and its people reach a certain level of autonomy, prosperity and security they no longer perceive
rivals as being a threat to their existence because there are no rivals who are threat to their existence.
Right or wrong, and I happen to believe it wrong, but it is a common practice throughout the ages, the indigenous population of pre-World War I
Palestine has been slowly displaced through a violent campaign of land acquisition at their expense by Zionist Israel.
So you understand Zionist is an important distinction because Hebrew Scripture teaches that only the Hebrew Messiah can lead the Jews of the world
back to Israel. In reality less than 2% of the world’s Jews want to live in Israel and that is a big factor for not wanting to live there.
Politically it became a place of refuge primarily in the aftermath of the Second World War for displaced and refugee Jews.
As horrible as the Holocaust in Europe was, it was the pivotal factor in creating a mass enough exodus of European Jews who had no desire to move to
Palestine before the Second World War, to then finally reach a critical enough mass, where they were numerous enough to first displace the British
Governing Authorities through violence, and terrorism, and then to begin displacing the Palestinians through violence and terrorism.
This is all documented history, with the justification being proffered for it the holocaust in Europe, which the indigenous people of Palestine played
no role in.
Yet we have seen similar migratory patterns of Europeans displace other indigenous people too. It typically results in one of two things, the migrants
waging a war of complete annihilation on the indigenous population to depopulate and completely control the land, or waging a partial war of
annihilation until a critical mass that causes the remaining indigenous people to choose submission and terms on how the remainder of them can then
survive and hopefully prosper.
What we have seen through history if the new migratory entity that establishes hegemony offers a real piece and real autonomy on real secure lands
within or alongside the new entity established by the migrants and abide then by those agreements and treaties, and allow the surviving people to
prosper then the indigenous people will in fact just focus on prospering.
We see this throughout the Americas, and we see this throughout the Pacific, and Asia, so yes, at the point the belligerent migratory peoples make
real agreements that allow for the remaining indigenous population to focus on their own prosperity without threat of interference or sabotage, or
what they have been given slowly being whittled away and undermined then they will in fact choose peace and prosperity, if they no longer view the
migratory entity as a belligerent actively engaged in taking more from them.
Yet we have also seen when the migratory belligerent does not honor it’s treaties, tries to change them, and keeps whittling away at the lands and
the autonomy of the indigenous people that they will continually fight back against the migratory belligerent as there really is no alternative except
complete submission and eventual annihilation.
Yet here is where all your arguments and suppositions fail, at the beginning by the refusal of many to see a indigenous population as being indigenous
and migrants of a belligerent nature truly being migrants of a belligerent nature. It does not matter what circumstances caused the migration, what
matters is the belligerency of the migrants in relation to the indigenous population, especially considering that the indigenous population was not
responsible for the circumstances that led to the migration of other peoples intent on taking over, stealing and usurping their lands and recourses
for their own.
So the argument many choose is patently false from the onset.
The second thing you are failing to see is that Israel is not only armed but heavily armed. Are you really saying that Israel will not use its weapons
on the indigenous population that it is in fact been slowly displacing through an armed war of aggression.
Yes people who find that their lands and livelihoods are being threatened by migratory peoples do in fact fight back against them.
In reality all you are advocating is that one side should be given the absolute right of armed force to impose it’s will while the other side should
be given no right or consideration or method to protect itself.
So it really is at its core level an argument for the bullying through force, of an entire people, in a lopsided way that only allows for one side to
dominate the other side, with that one dominating side, intent on preventing the indigenous people from reaching any level of security and economic
prosperity where they would no longer feel threatened and a need to try to fight back and protect themselves.
Certainly a illegal blockade being conducted against such a society is a very real method to prevent economic prosperity and security from being
So in reality when you strip away the religious dogmas, and the propagandas and take away the coined labels, all you do have is a migratory people,
attempting to displace an indigenous population in its entirety by being the only armed force and the superiorly armed force that is intent on the
complete depopulation of the indigenous people.
If Israel was actually contained to the 48% of Palestine the Original Mandate granted them, and was peacefully and productively engaged with the
Palestinians they were tasked to live alongside with as two antonymous people that would be entirely different.
I could then say Zionist Israel stuck to its contractual obligations, and agreements and the Palestinians are 100% in the wrong.
But the truth is that the Zionist political entities have never made an attempt to abide by the accords and treaties but simply used them for a toe
hold to wage a bloody and slow war of genocide and apartheid against an indigenous people, for the sake of constantly growing and expanding their
state and making a profit through those very actions, by getting the rest of the world to fund that very slow and cruel effort, through the skilled
use of propaganda meant to obscure every basic fact.
So in reality all many people are doing is in fact promoting a might makes right concept of its ok for one migratory people to displace an indigenous
population if they can but convince everyone else that there is a legitimate reason for doing that.
Yet the truth is a big part of that convincing is through slandering the indigenous population by purporting that very natural reactions on its behalf
are inhuman and wrong, when in fact they are very natural reactions, all the while with the migratory belligerent never actually doing one thing that
would enable the prosperity and security the indigenous population requires to no longer feel threatened and in danger.
Here is a hint for you, telling people that they should not feel threatened and endangered because half measures that still leave them feeling
threatened and endangered is not going to actually make such people no longer feel threatened and endangered when that migratory entity is still
actively engaged in things and actions that do threaten and endanger them and impact their autonomy security and economic vitality.
That is the absurd part of the propaganda war being waged by Israel. Telling me I should love someone or something because they supposedly did
something that makes me love them is not going to make me love them. They actually have to do something that convinces me to love them, not that
convinced them that they should be loved, or convinced others that are not affected that they should be loved.
Bottom line is people who don’t live in Gaza and haven’t had to suffer the displacement of a belligerent migratory people, really should not be
imagining what is going on in the minds of people who have been displaced by a belligerent migratory people.
They shouldn’t be assuming that the Israeli propaganda and half measures are sufficient to give peace of mind and security to people who have been
continually displaced and watched their standard of life continuously disintegrate by a migratory belligerent people.
It’s a foolish notion, and peace if very easy to obtain.
No I can’t imagine any nation or society would feel secure with an entity imposing a blockade on it, or see that entity as anything but the
belligerent thread that it is.
Israel in fact uses its arms all the time, not just on Palestinians but peaceful humanitarian aide workers trying to help them in charitable life
The argument some people are promoting is totally flawed from start to finish and ignores most of the facts, the true reality, and the lessons from
[edit on 6/6/10 by ProtoplasmicTraveler]