Is Lucifer the God of Judaism?

www.henrymakow.com...
By Will Newman....

Is Lucifer the god of Judaism?

WILL NEWMAN, who holds a B.A. in Religion, attended Jewish synagogue, and has relatives involved in Talmudism, Cabala, B'nai Brith and Masonry.

In 1976, Walter White, Jr., "a concerned patriot," conducted an interview with a young Jew named Harold Rosenthal who was the assistant to Sen. Javits of New York.

In the interview, later published as "The Hidden Tyranny", the arrogant Rosenthal belligerently boasts (on tape) that the Jewish people have fabricated certain "falsehoods which work to conceal their nature and protect their status and power."

www.macquirelatory.com
Wallace Interview 1967.htm



[edit on 8-4-2010 by DCDAVECLARKE]

I prefer the version of Satan that is worshiped by the practitioners of Norwegian black metal, the archetype of rebellion, indulgence and individuality. He knows how to have a good time and not get hung up on trivial crap. Rock on!!!

reply to post by DCDAVECLARKE

Ridiculous, everyone knows that Lucifer is the god of gays like me, but that would include Jewish and Freemasonic men who like to embrace the serpent ever so often. Thats how we've all conspired to make a grand jew-queer-masonic conspiracy, and even the feminists are in on it, don't ask how or why but they just are.
That's why we're rich, gorgeous and secretive.

[edit on 8-4-2010 by halfoldman]

I think the idea of a devil (or at least hell) originates from Zoroastrianism, which Judaism borrows generously from. Though, I don't think Judaism itself has a real concept of "the devil" or "hell". When you die, you just go to the grave.. sheol, or something. There is "Yin and Yang" adversary to god, but some form of "obstacle" or "adversary" who's motivation is to lead man away from YHWH.


Personally, I think stories of the "devil" are just boogeyman delusions - and that "the devil" is merely the human capacity (which exists in all of us) to exert power over one another in a means (whether deliberate or accidental) that elicits pain, suffering, and torment on one another. Getting caught up in stories about god, devils, and magics merely gives us tools to condemn the evils of others (whether real or imagined), while justifying our own evils doled out as the will of god. Further, Christianity only advises that you seek repentance from god, and does not require you to try to set things right with the people you've wronged. The cost of their forgiveness does not often come so lightly as praying to the clouds or a anonymous priest. Cowardice, justified.

At least some interpretations of Christianity promote the idea of salvation through deeds, which promotes altrusim in a general sense.. even if on a false premise. Go and sin no more, as it were. Those who believe that salvation comes only through "accepting Christ" regardless of deeds leave a substantial "backdoor" open to general purpose justification through perpetual absolution. Criticize how you want the "faith" of those such individuals who use their faith as a "VIP Pass to Heaven" by just pointing to the cross and saying "It's cool, I'm with him".... everybody claims to be a "true" Christian, and claims others who disagree with them to be "false" Christians.

Since there's no real metric which provides rigid and objectively verifiable definitions for what "Is" and "Isn't" which is not open to interpretation, cherry picking, cognitive bias, and personal desire... I just consider them all equally wrong and deluded. Don't bother pleading your virtues or trying to explain your version of your flavor. I've long since given up on looking for concordance in religious stories.


If you're interested in getting a glimpse at who "the devil" really is, then look in the mirror and try to see past the angel. Or give a listen to Philip Zimbardo's talk on the Lucifer Effect. The line between good and evil cuts right through the human heart.

Link to Lucifer Effect speech. About an hour and a half long, but well worth it.

[edit on 8-4-2010 by Lasheic]

reply to post by DCDAVECLARKE


no.

satan is a symbol based on incoming fireballs from space.

yahweh is their god, its the same god as christians; which could very well be 'satan'.

if you don't follow your holy book to perfection; you are following satan, doesn't really matter how or why, its even said in every damn one of them. hypocrites

The term Lucifer comes from Latin (from lucem ferre) meaning "light-bringer," and usually refers to the planet Venus or the "day star." The word "Lucifer" in English has come to be associated with the Biblical Satan but the term is not applied to him anywhere in the Bible. In the bible it references either Venus (the planet) or a particular Babylonian king. Early Christian writers connected Lucifer with Satan.

More intriguing, I think, is how much Lucifer/Satan is like the Greek titan Prometheus, who fell from Zeus' grace and is eternally punished for the 'sin' of stealing fire/knowledge from him and giving it to mankind. To the Greeks, Prometheus was a great hero and benefactor of mankind.

reply to post by LifeInDeath

More intriguing, I think, is how much Lucifer/Satan is like the Greek titan Prometheus

Yeah, I never really understood why so many people tend to link Prometheus with Jesus when Lucifer actually correlates far better. If anything, IMO, Jesus in comparison plays the Heracles role. After all, it was Heracles (the son of Zeus) whom ultimately broke Prometheus's chains and set him free against Zeus's decree. Similarly, Jesus (son of YHWH) is proclaimed to be a redeemer who frees mankind from irredeemable eternal punishment in hell for sin. YHWH could/would not simply reverse his decree, and so became his own son to force himself/the father to offer forgiveness via a cosmic loophole.

Then again, I've never quite understood why Judas is so reviled anyhow. Based his actions, it seems to me like Judas was a close friend who was tormented by the responsibility of betraying his beloved master so that the prophecies could be fulfilled. It fits nicely with the assertions of Christ's foreknowledge and supposed predetermined destiny. Further, it seems more realistic an explanation for the mental state Judas would have been in to cast the silver upon the altar and hang himself.

It's all just mythology, I know, by I still wonder why Judas is seen as a villain rather than a tragic hero who condemned himself for the sake of enabling the sacrifice of Christ.

Originally posted by LasheicThen again, I've never quite understood why Judas is so reviled anyhow. Based his actions, it seems to me like Judas was a close friend who was tormented by the responsibility of betraying his beloved master so that the prophecies could be fulfilled. It fits nicely with the assertions of Christ's foreknowledge and supposed predetermined destiny. Further, it seems more realistic an explanation for the mental state Judas would have been in to cast the silver upon the altar and hang himself.

That is an interpretation that is gaining more popularity as of late, not necessarily among Christians but just in general. It is the version as espoused by the apocryphal/heretical Gospel of Judas and was also the version of the story used in the film The Last Temptation of Christ.

I've always found that variant of the story very compelling and even sensible. Then again, I'm not a Christian so I may be responding to it as an interesting, alternative take on the story.

Lucifer has no place in any religion.

Anyone who believes does not have the devil I say.

To have a third line, I will say that the devil is not around if you believe in Jesus.

reply to post by halfoldman


Where is this gorgeous hunk from the Illuminati? If he exists, I'd like to meet this "God of Gays" one on one.

PS: God created Satan.

[edit on 4/12/2010 by TheBloodRed]

reply to post by DCDAVECLARKE


This is a particularly loathsome nugget of antisemitism that resurfaces from time to time online. A few notes:

1) The "interview" between Rosenthal and White has never been authenticated.

2) Debunking the whole mess was complicated by the fact that the real Rosenthal was killed in a terrorist attack after the tape was supposedly made but before the tape was released. Heaven forbid I suggest anything unsavory on the part of the same loathsome bigots who circulate that vast, horrible piece of hogwash "The Protocols of the Elders of Zion," but if one were looking for a person with access to the corridors of power who was in no position to dispute your claims, who better than a recently murdered young political comer? It certainly doesn't hurt that he was an aide to Javits, who was reviled for his progressive stances on civil rights. Two birds, one stone.

3) I've personally made efforts to verify/falsify several elements of this story. In fact I've just emailed Makow for this "Newman's" credentials. I expect them to be either unverifiable or downright laughable, as have been the credentials of everyone who has circulated this myth. Apparently part of the World Jewish Conspiracy involves keeping their most diligent opponents from attending decent schools, doing decent research, or even writing coherent sentences. Crafty indeed.

To date, no one (including people and groups with significant time, money, manpower, and connections) has been able to do any of the following:


Trace the chain of custody of the tape completely

Produce said tape

Say with certainty where the tape resides

Say with certainty who "Walter White" was, other than that he was a distributor of mail order bigotry in the 70s and early 80s. At one point, Des Griffin claims to have been to the home of "Walter White" to listen to the tape (a copy) which even he notes "Sounded like a bad actor reading from a script." Entertainingly, this comment is linked on Makow's own site www.henrymakow.com... in an article in which Makow personally casts aspersions on the tape and the conspiracy (his contention is that one should substitute "Rothschild" wherever one hears "Jew").

This whole mess is such a joke that, every so often, a few far Right hatemongers will come up with the bright idea of claiming that the tape itself is a ploy by the Jews to smear believers in the "real conspiracy" by ascribing to them belief in such a crude, cartoonish, caricature.

This is embarrassing nonsense that doesn't deserve the time of day.

reply to post by TheBloodRed


ugh,control yourself.

While I love gays, I do not love totally promiscuous people.

reply to post by catwhoknows


Just the response I was looking for.

Don't worry, I have more than enough control.

reply to post by TheBloodRed


OK, I am laughing with the memories of my gay friends who I have buried.

We are all laughing with you.

Is any one good with symbolism? what do symbols that are around the image mean? the ones with the wired shapes around the cross. Also who is the man on the left of the image the one that looks like he in a penny.

yfrog.com...

to me it looks like witch craft symbols

No.

Lucifer is the god of Islam.

reply to post by Kim Jong-il


That looks like some crazy graphic from the Church of the Sub-Genius, or something.

Where the hell did you get that?

reply to post by DCDAVECLARKE


Lucifer is a fallen angel, not a God. They just like to associate his name with those types of things.

Here is an interesting link which sums it up nicely:

en.wikipedia.org...

Many questions would be answered if people use the "advanced search" page at google.com. It is a very powerful search engine.

Originally posted by DCDAVECLARKE
www.henrymakow.com...
By Will Newman....

Is Lucifer the god of Judaism?

WILL NEWMAN, who holds a B.A. in Religion, attended Jewish synagogue, and has relatives involved in Talmudism, Cabala, B'nai Brith and Masonry.

In 1976, Walter White, Jr., "a concerned patriot," conducted an interview with a young Jew named Harold Rosenthal who was the assistant to Sen. Javits of New York.

In the interview, later published as "The Hidden Tyranny", the arrogant Rosenthal belligerently boasts (on tape) that the Jewish people have fabricated certain "falsehoods which work to conceal their nature and protect their status and power."

www.macquirelatory.com
Wallace Interview 1967.htm



[edit on 8-4-2010 by DCDAVECLARKE]

I think the opposite is true. Lucifer (aka Satan) is the god waring against the god of Judaism, Yahweh. In my opinion, Lucifer is the god worthy of worship in this scenario, since it seems to me that Yahweh's purpose is keep humanity in a kind of slavery. This is my interpretation (as well as other's) of the first three chapters of Genesis.