Are all "geniuses" serverly paranoid?

Originally posted by orionthehunter
I do not believe all geniuses are paranoid. If you have a high IQ, you may take into consideration several points of views. For instance if someone says "you look nice today" you'll understand that to be a compliment on the surface. However if you analyze the different reasons for giving you a compliment, you could think why are they being nice today? What are they up to? Are they just returning a compliment for something I did or do they want something from me? Are they horny and want something from me physically? A lot of thoughts go through everyone's heads all the time but most aren't aware of too many of them. I would not say all of this is paranoia but simply analyzing different points of view.

Wow, is that how people with high IQs think? I wouldn't know, because I have a low IQ. When someone says something to me, it goes in one ear and out the other.

reply to post by Nostradumbass

And being stupid means you never could communicate with anybody effectively, nothing you said made sense to the "normal" person.

What does the Wind, say to the tree?


Different methods of structuring thoughts and accessing memories are going to perceive, and thus communicate about things of different subject matters.



This is why understanding Communication is essential in functional societies.



Our society understands reality in a linear, scripted way...

Much like theatrical productions.



I'll give you three guesses as to Why.





-Edrick

Originally posted by Nostradumbass

Originally posted by jam321

It's why the ancients seem like they were years ahead of our ways of thinking. It's because the contemplated things more, and they gave complex thought to one problem, before considering another.

Could you give a couple of examples of the above?

Thanks in advance.

"As for me, all I know is that I know nothing. "
"Be as you wish to seem. "
-Socrates

Socrates should of been a comedian instead of a philosopher. Thats one of the funniest things I have heard.

Great wits and madness are allied and thin partitions do their bounds divide...

The faster processor theory is being challenged by newer cognitive development research.

There are "slowed down" geniuses.

There are people lacking internal rhythm who are geniuses.

These are cognitive distortions that do not necessarily relate to the fundamental ability to think and do.

They can also be skills - teaching someone the skills improves their "IQ." That fundamentally toys with the belief that IQ is fixed, and that IQ is in an of itself meaningful as a singular measurement system.

Originally posted by SaturnFX
having a high IQ simply means having a faster processor.

Even a fool will eventually go through the same thinking process as a genius if focus is kept...whereas a genius may mentally go through all the questions and introspections within a few minutes pondering, the same thoughts and processes may take a fool several years to achieve the same result.

Are all geniuses insane?

I think the better question would be..how long does it take a genius to find out everyone is insane.

Originally posted by unityemissions
reply to post by SaturnFX

 

I beg to differ. I've met plenty of people who process incredibly fast that are quite dumb. Without skills like focus, persistence, and proper discernment there is no high intelligence regardless of processing speed.

Yes, having a fast processor does not make one an intellect...garbage in, garbage out.

Having a high IQ does not mean being a einstein...nor does having a fairly low IQ auto default you into rock farmer...it all depends on what you put into the system and how you further it. a person with a high IQ has more potential to contribute, but that doesn't translate into actual contributions.

Originally posted by Aeons
The faster processor theory is being challenged by newer cognitive development research.

There are "slowed down" geniuses.

I think there is a difference between a genius and a brilliant person...a brilliant person may not have a genius IQ...its just someone whom is insightful and perhaps process things differently than others, contributing some amazing results.

I dont believe a high IQ is necessarily a good or bad thing, it all depends on how its used. a person with a high IQ working to progress humanity is great...a person with a high IQ trying to find the best way to eat pringles on pizza is sort of a waste case.

I disagree with the premise that "most" geniuses are crazy.

How do you know this? Have you looked at any statistics that suggest this?



I think it's a cliche in hollywood to make "geniuses" quirky and eccentric; sometimes a little "mad." I've never met anybody like that in real life, though. Most of the truly intelligent people i've met are, i'd say, more normal than most people.

Having hung around quite a number of gifted and geniuses as adults......I gotta tell you, when you hang with them the level of crazy is rather apparent.

Originally posted by Kaytagg
I disagree with the premise that "most" geniuses are crazy.

How do you know this? Have you looked at any statistics that suggest this?



I think it's a cliche in hollywood to make "geniuses" quirky and eccentric; sometimes a little "mad." I've never met anybody like that in real life, though. Most of the truly intelligent people i've met are, i'd say, more normal than most people.

reply to post by Aeons


Are you sure you're not just hanging out with crazy people who you think are gifted and genius?

And we still need to see some real data to confirm that "most" geniuses are crazy. I really doubt this is true.. Maybe some are, but most? Where's the evidence?

Oh, I've hung out with lots of crazy people - smart and dumb.


I'll give you a hint as to what should suggest this to you even if you don't believe it. And it involves that lovely Bell Curve of IQ.

If high IQ was always a trait that had selective advantage, then being high IQ would be normal. The entire populace would sit in the same IQ and IQ would not be on a Bell Curve.

It would be like having legs - pretty much standard in the package of being mammal. Not having it would be a statistical zero. (not an absolute zero.)

But IQ isn't standard. It isn't part of the guarantee package of being human. Which means that variation in it has both selective advantages and selective disadvantages.

The disadvantages on both ends of that curve make you .... less desirable often. Not for certain, but often enough to make introduction of that trait into the populace a hard sell.

The other end of the curve are riddled with intellectual deficits that turn others away or limit their ability to bring up children and the child to survive.

The same thing happens on the other end of that curve.

Originally posted by Kaytagg
reply to post by Aeons

 

Are you sure you're not just hanging out with crazy people who you think are gifted and genius?

And we still need to see some real data to confirm that "most" geniuses are crazy. I really doubt this is true.. Maybe some are, but most? Where's the evidence?

Being a genius and someone with high IQ is something totally different. Being a genius is someone who can take things and do something different and people like that change society.
But hardly anyone with high IQ will change society.
They are not the same thing.

A person can know too much about how people work, and that could make him or she paranoid, and not being able to go with flow of situations, that life is all about.

I doubt all genius type people are paranoid, it is just that they maybe think too much, and there are so many ways of looking at things that it can be quite confusing.

On being crazy i am not sure being crazy is about relaying stuff to others. Ignorance plays a massive part in society and to function to a certain degree you need ignorance.

Originally posted by Kaytagg
I disagree with the premise that "most" geniuses are crazy.

How do you know this? Have you looked at any statistics that suggest this?



I think it's a cliche in hollywood to make "geniuses" quirky and eccentric; sometimes a little "mad." I've never met anybody like that in real life, though. Most of the truly intelligent people i've met are, i'd say, more normal than most people.

Strange Brains and Geniuses

Odd Behavior and Creativity May Go Hand in Hand

John Nash Shizophrenia

Asperger = Genius?

Mad Genius

These are just a few links that advocate some form of a theoretical mad genius, that you can check out for yourself...of course, I can lead a horse to water but I can't make him drink.

You could be onto something here.

However I would posit that there is a tendency for functional geniuses to be somewhat more liberal. A high degree of tolerance to divergence.

This could be explained if instead of being ignorant, they develop a more liberal sensibility in order to function socially.

Accepting that people vary between each, and oneself, and being able to live life all the same and function despite it.

That might explain the fact that liberal tendencies trend with IQ often.

Originally posted by andy1033On being crazy i am not sure being crazy is about relaying stuff to others. Ignorance plays a massive part in society and to function to a certain degree you need ignorance.

Originally posted by SaturnFX

Originally posted by Aeons
The faster processor theory is being challenged by newer cognitive development research.

There are "slowed down" geniuses.

I think there is a difference between a genius and a brilliant person...a brilliant person may not have a genius IQ...its just someone whom is insightful and perhaps process things differently than others, contributing some amazing results.

Actually, I think it's the other way around. A genius usually has a minimum IQ of ~120, but there's no correlation between a higher IQ than this, and genius breakthroughs. This marker (IQ>119) seems to be needed for high creative potential. There are exceptions to the rule. Andy Warhol had an IQ of 86, but was thought by some to be a genius.

Brilliant people are generally defined based on IQ, to my understanding. Genius is more about character.

Originally posted by Jean Paul Zodeaux

Originally posted by Kaytagg
I disagree with the premise that "most" geniuses are crazy.

How do you know this? Have you looked at any statistics that suggest this?



I think it's a cliche in hollywood to make "geniuses" quirky and eccentric; sometimes a little "mad." I've never met anybody like that in real life, though. Most of the truly intelligent people i've met are, i'd say, more normal than most people.

Strange Brains and Geniuses

"Filled with 200 years of eccentric geniuses, this delightful collection of profiles assembles an eclectic and fascinating sampling of scientists (as well as some artists and writers) with a far-ranging assortment of phobias, compulsions, odd belief systems and extraordinarily weird habits.

Well, yea, if you selectively pick out all the odd characters in the bunch, you end up with a book filled with geniuses that also happen to be eccentric/quirky/crazy/etc. That doesn't mean MOST geniuses are that way, though. That's a book selectively covering ONLY the crazy ones; not the majority.

Odd Behavior and Creativity May Go Hand in Hand

New research on individuals with schizotypal personalities – people characterized by odd behavior and language but who are not psychotic or schizophrenic – offers the first neurological evidence that they are more creative

Creativity and IQ aren't the same thing. If high IQ=Genius, as the OP seems to be suggesting, then high creativity != high IQ, which does not equate to genius. Two totally separate things.

John Nash Shizophrenia

Anyone who has seen A Beautiful Mind know the story of John Nash, and that he was a schizophrenic. Yes, he had a high IQ (im assuming) and he was crazy. That is 1 person out of millions, and does not prove that most geniuses are crazy.

Asperger = Genius?

The balance of this book is the presentation of 21 brief biographies of famous people who varying degrees of evidence indicate with varying degrees of reliability that varying degrees of Asperger Syndrome occurs in people with varying degrees of "genius". The authors argue that some of the 21 cases had Asperger Syndrome, others had Asperger's disorder (the differences are never precisely defined), still others had autism, and still others had something along the continuum of autism-Asperger spectrum disorder

I can not comment on this, as I have not read the book this article is referring to. But it still lacks any fundamental analysis of whether or not MOST geniuses are crazy. It goes on to list a slew of people who it contends have some form of autism or one another disease, but one wonders how they can make that diagnosis on an historical figure, especially given that such diagnoses were not possible during the lifetime of some of the people cited -- Newton, being a good example of one.

Mad Genius

Mad genius: Study suggests link between psychosis and creativity

Creativity != genius.

These are just a few links that advocate some form of a theoretical mad genius, that you can check out for yourself...of course, I can lead a horse to water but I can't make him drink.

Well, I'm insulted. I read most of your links, and after reading them I'm convinced that you haven't.




The fundamental question, for which this entire thread is based, still remains unanswered: Where is the proof that most geniuses are crazy?

reply to post by unityemissions


I tend to agree with your sentiment. High IQ is a poor indicator of anything, other than an ability to score highly on an IQ test.

In short, it doesn't seem to mean anything -- nothing that is going to act as a predictor of how successful you'll be, how much money you'll make, whether you'll find love, whether you have a mental illness, etc. It just measures your ability to score high on an IQ test.



Some people seem to have an irrational fascination with IQ -- probably because they don't understand what IQ measures, how it's measured, or what it means. Imho.

reply to post by Aeons

"However I would posit that there is a tendency for functional geniuses to be somewhat more liberal. A high degree of tolerance to divergence."

I agree with that statement from my own personal perspective. I have always been very liberal in my thinking and since my first recommended test at age of 9 (I am now 37), I have apparently had an IQ of 160.
To me, I hardly ever think about that quotient, it means nothing. What matters is what one does with their mental faculties and abilities.
I have learned a great deal from my friend (an artist) who is very "handy", but doesn't have any jaw-dropping intelligence. We both are in a band together and we seem to be of the same creative mind...

He is also by far more paranoid than I am. His multiple mediums of creativity are something I have often wondered about in regards to his paranoia. It's as though he creates the problems in his mind. I see through them. He has the "body" ability of producing great works of art on canvas, and I often think of the ideas...
The world, I think, needs teams and collaborations like this.
I also would like to say that mental illness can hit any IQ, just like cancer. I don't believe it discriminates.

reply to post by Kaytagg


The title of the thread is actually; "Are all "geniuses" severely paranoid? The thread doesn't seem to be based on whether or not geniuses are crazy, but whether they have some sort of "mental disorder".and most of the talk by the O.P. about crazy was in reference to how he/she feels when thinking considerably.

I have all ready wasted too much time in other threads actually supplying sources and doing research, and in this instance I spent enough time to read five articles and posted them. That's all you get sport. It wouldn't matter if thousands of studies supported the theory that geniuses exhibit odd behavior, you would still stick your fingers in your ears and scream at the top of your lungs..."la-la-la-la-la-la-la-la-la I can't hear you!" It really doesn't take a genius to figure that out when dealing with you. Why don't you supply some evidence to support your mindless claim? Why don't you back up some of your opinions with fact? I dare you, I double dare you. Do you think you can provide three articles that would refute the common belief that geniuses tend towards odd behavior? Well? Yeah. I thought so.

reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux


I agree with the notion that a genius has other things that we might say or odd or not common in others. We see it in sports too, where real ones like maradona or someone similar is not accepted as being normal, or what ever that means.

Maybe its like when people loose one sense they compensate with stronger other senses.

Maybe a genius is someone who puts most of everything into one thing, but cannot really balance everything that many normal humans can.