Of Black Holes and Big Bangs, page 2
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reply posted on 5-3-2010 @ 12:56 AM by ShadowLink
reply to post by Shake


Oh really?
Scientists Use Light to Create Particles
trailblazing experiment at the Stanford Linear Accelerator Center in California has confirmed a longstanding prediction by theorists that light beams colliding with each other can goad the empty vacuum into creating something out of nothing.

Or
MIT Physicists Create New Form of Matter.

The first is dated 1997, and the second 2005. I imagine they have improved these techniques even further by now.


reply posted on 5-3-2010 @ 04:39 PM by Shake
Originally posted by ShadowLink
reply to
post by Shake


Oh really?
Scientists Use Light to Create Particles
trailblazing experiment at the Stanford Linear Accelerator Center in California has confirmed a longstanding prediction by theorists that light beams colliding with each other can goad the empty vacuum into creating something out of nothing.

Or
MIT Physicists Create New Form of Matter.

The first is dated 1997, and the second 2005. I imagine they have improved these techniques even further by now.

but they have to use energy to create the matter so essentially they are just turning energy into matter



reply posted on 5-3-2010 @ 04:50 PM by Paladin327

My point is if there is a black hole at the center of every galaxy or even half of them, wouldnt all the matter in the universe ultimately be doomed to be absorbed by them over a long enough time period?


The black holes at the center of galaxies are not the normal boring black holes, but the supermassive variety. they suck in matter, yes, but in doing so, they cause this matter to speed up and heat up, a lot. when this happens, matter is ejected from our side of the event horizon. this is a quasar. when the matter/energy is ejected, it pushes other matter away from the black hole, depriving it of food. the very act of an SMBH feeding pushes its own food supply away from the event horizon the black hole at the center of the galaxy is not urrently feeding, but it has stars orbiting it, very fast.


In a singular non infinite universe could the big bang have been an ultimate black hole that had absorbed everything in the universe and exploded? If that were true then could the big bang have been one of many in an infinite loop of matter being compacted and expanded over massive time periods?


maybe, but probably not, one of the four cosmological assumptions states that there can be no center, edge, or any specific point of the universe. a black hole that sucked everything out and started everything would be a special point and theoretically can not exist.



Or is our universe one that simply started with a big bang and will end with every galaxy eventually being absorbed by its own black hole?


the expansion of the universe is increasing in speed, so, assuming a flat or open-shaped universe, the most likey possibility is that eventually, because of the expansion, that all galaxies will be so isolated from each other and fading out into blackness. but this could happen if the universe is a closed shape, but scientists havent seen evidence of any of these three possibilies of the shape of the universe.



But the leading theory i think is that the big bang was a collision of branes.


that is the the leading theory now, yes, and a new big bang could happen tomorrow, next year, a million years from now, never... we dont know



but what determines the size of a black hole? are they variable? we know black holes have immense gravity, correct? so, i would think they do "draw in" matter. does this make them larger and therefore, increase their gravity ... and their draw?


Black holes are formed after a huge star goes supernova. the more massive the star, the bigger the black hole, the bigger the black hole, the bigger gravity well. when a black hole feeds, it should get bigger.



IMHO the Solar Dynamics Observatory was recently sent into orbit to take measurements of the black hole at the centre of our sun. its infinitesimally small, but starting to make an obvious impact on the sun(the suns outer magnetic field flipped in january, but we dont yet know whats going on in the core(s) of the sun).


The sun's magnetic polarity flipping is really nothing special. it does it every 11 years. its part of the solar magnetic cycle. the solar magnetic sphere is so effed up because the poles and equartor of the sun rotate at different rates and convection on the surface of the sun causes even more tangling of the megnetic field. cos of this, we have sunspots, solar prominences, spicules, and the occasional coronal mass ejections. by the way, where did you see that there's a black hole in the middle of the sun?



Where are all the white holes?


good question, but it's a very big universe with lots of mystery remaining to be discovered.



It also just occurred to me, that if black holes suck matter in, and are in essence gravity wells, then would white holes actually be radiating gravity? That makes me think about a thing I read online awhile back, where this gal said something about a theory that our universe bleeds gravity to a parallel universe.


i think white holes would spew matter and energy more than gravity, but the byproduct is mass and energy would be gravity... as for bleeding gravity, it boils down to gravitons, one of the messanger particles for the 4 cosmic forces. it's the only one that hasn't been discovered. so scientists speculate that gravitons bleed into different universes diluting the effect of gravity. you van see how weak the force of gravity in one simple experiment: go over to a table and pick something up. you just beat the fore of gravity!

if you all think i'm nuts because im not providing links as evidence, i'm getting this info out of the notes i took in my astronomy class in college. but noone is wrong, because frankly, noone's right with all we know, stuck here on our widdle planet. but i do appreciate the friendly debate about the universe. this board lacks a lot of that

[edit on 5/3/2010 by Paladin327]

[edit on 5/3/2010 by Paladin327]


reply posted on 6-3-2010 @ 07:22 PM by predator0187
reply to post by 7minds



I do not mean to sound rude at all, but they graviton is still hypothetical. It has yet to be proven true.

en.wikipedia.org...

If we had found it, it would be a huge breakthrough. If you know something I don't then I am all ears.

Pred...


reply posted on 10-3-2010 @ 08:40 PM by 7minds
Originally posted by predator0187
reply to
post by 7minds



I do not mean to sound rude at all, but they graviton is still hypothetical. It has yet to be proven true.

en.wikipedia.org...

If we had found it, it would be a huge breakthrough. If you know something I don't then I am all ears.

Pred...



www.planet-lotb.com...

Originally measured in 2006 by the ESA. They went over it for 3 years, checked their findings for 8 months, and released that statement.

I know its not 100%. But really, we just found out that space wasn't empty last year. It took us over 50 years in space to figure out that there are evenly distributed hydrogen molecules throughout our solar system.


reply posted on 13-3-2010 @ 11:58 PM by garritynet
Originally posted by galadofwarthethird
I never really understood the whole concept of black holes, the part of them being holes that is. If a supermasive suns become unstable and compress into black holes how are they holes they can be just another element in the universe one element that is more heavy then anything we can judge with our main tool 'light', sort of like Neutron stars. How exactly are they holes then, only in the sense that we cant see the bottom, or actual holes in space. This problem seems to come from our limeted view of gravity, I cant think of one theory that has a clear understanding of what gravity really is, we all know that the more massive an object is the heavyer it is, but how does this explain black holes, or even Neutron stars, why are some element so much more heavy then others, because of there atomic composition or something all together different. What exactly is gravity. a ripple in space, a force, a compaction of matter, a electro magnetic event, or is it the smalest partical in our universe, smaller then an atom. What exactly is it I cant think of anything that would make sense in all theory's.


I will answer your last comments first. We are totally working on that one. It might be awhile. Keep in touch.

As to why they are called "black holes", well thats what you call a metaphor. Kinda like the "desktop" on your computer. Its just there to represent it in a way that is easy to say and remember.

What are blackholes?

In a very simplified nutshell blackholes started out as a function of math that allows for objects to exist that something something gravity to the degree that infinite energy is required to stop the object from further decreasing in volume under its own gravational something.

This object had a large enough amount of mass in a small enough amount of space. This amount of space is the Schwarzschild radius. If an objects Schwarzschild radius is inside itself then it is not dense enough.

From there it was decided that a big enough star had enough mass to for such an object and could possibly collapse into a small enough volume.

Then they did some more math and decided that a these big stars could possibly behave in a way that would compact them enough to occupy the correct volume to form said object and without causing any problems to all the hard work everyone had put in to the current understanding of the cosmos. Mostly everyone has since agreed to go ahead give blackholes the benefit of the doubt.

Since then lots more math has been done to investigate the properties that objects with enough density might possess and the idea of a black hole has become its own area of study. Its really very complicated, infact there are mulitple types allowed to coexist with the current model. Predictions have been made and phenomena has been observed that fits those predictions so the benefit of the doubt has been extended further.

Very far indeed. As I said, the math seems to work and the predictions have been observed so we now generally consider them to be real things that exist.

This is a vaguely correct idea of what blackholes are without using math or flowery descriptions.

What is mass?
Some things are heavier than others because they interact with the Higgs field more that others. Maybe. We don't know but we really hope that pans out. Keep your fingers crossed, it will save us a lot of work if it does.

[edit on 13-3-2010 by garritynet]

[edit on 14-3-2010 by garritynet]

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