9/11 POLL : Do You Believe a Boeing 757 Crashed in Shanksville?

Originally posted by hooper

Originally posted by Shadow Herder
reply to post by Joey Canoli

 

Let me clarify.....

The Hole In Shanksville was NOT caused by Flight 93 the Boeing 757

So glad that's cleared up. So when can we expect this earth shattering, revolutionary absolute fact to appear somewhere besides submitted by anonymous posters on conspiracy website forums???

Its sad to know that people like you think that information pertaining to the fact that the crater was not caused by a Boeing 757 has to be revealed here on ATS an exists nowhere else.

One just has to have a grade 8 level of intelligence to navigate themselves through the myriad of information that is easily available.

Your beliefs and hatred for truth is evident is quite obvious and usually ignored.



[edit on 26-5-2010 by Shadow Herder]

reply to post by Shadow Herder


Yeah, your unilateral declarations are all anybody needs to see your right.

Here let me try it:

Flight 93 did crash in Shanksville, Pa on September 11, 2001.

There, you must be wrong then. By the way, did you ever do those crater impact calculations so that maybe you could actually prove what you are saying?

Didn't think so, I know the prospect of learning the truth as supported by facts really scares you, but be brave and do the calculations.

With basic grade 3 science one can see that the crater was not caused by a Boeing 757.

The angle of the crash was less then 50 degrees not to mention it was a slope which would make the angle of attack around 40-45 degrees. If it were caused by a Boeing 757 taking into consideration speed and weight and forgetting about it ever having fuel ladened wings, the crater would of been oblong, deep and messy which is not the case.

Now, a Boeing 757 has wings and the crater does not have any evidence that wings anywhere near the span of a Boeing 757 contacted the ground. This is fact.

Deny all you want. We know the truth and and repeating your ignorance does not change fact or sway anyone.

reply to post by Shadow Herder


Sounds nice, now prove it with a little math and science. Provided you with the formulas before - what exactly are you afraid of?

And when you get finished actually proving your declarations maybe you can start working on that list of ALL the first responders at the Flight 93 crash scene that you must have. Love to see it.

reply to post by hooper




How about you find sources and use science to explain that tiny 10 foot deep hole being caused by a commercial airliner.

Explain how a 600mph massive Boeing 757 with a a 120+foot wings span can cause a crater 15-25 feet round and 10-15 feet deep.

This should be hilarious. I mean there should be tons of reports from 'ahem' official sources.

reply to post by Shadow Herder


You first. I mean, there's the photo. It is what it is, you prove that it is impossible. You've declared it so, what is the basis for your affirmative declaration?

You have none and won't dare go near anything that looks like an impact calcualtion because it would dissolve all your troll bait.

Even you disagree with you first its a tiny 10 foot deep hole then its a 10 to 15 feet deep hole. You have no clue how big or small that hole is, do you? Yet your sure it couldn't be as the result of a plane crash. Now that's a neat trick.

I havent seen enough photographic evidence to support either claim. There could have been lots of wreckage, but from video the angles you cant see anything, more pictures may help.

Yes UA 93 crashed at Shanksville. Both black boxes were recovered. The flight data recorder placed UA 93 at Shanksville and the cockpit voice recorder provided testimony as to what happened at the end.

Many, many body parts of UA 93 passengers and crew were recovered at Shanksville and identified.

This is a recording of dramatic communications or attempted communications between Cleveland air traffic control, UA 93 and other planes in the area :-

www.youtube.com...

All a fake ?

You will, if you bother to listen to it, note that UA 93 was visually identified by another pilot and that smoke was seen rising from the ground

Can anyone suggest a logical reason why evil government perps should plan to bring UA 93 down in a field in Pennsylvania ?

I have seen truther suggestions that UA 93 was destined to hit WTC 7. If so, why was it headed to Washington and why bring it down at all ?

It seems to me that, if conspiracy theorists cannot come up with an alternative hypothesis to terrorists putting the plane down as verified by the cockpit voice recorder, then all "inside job" theories fall by the wayside.

Originally posted by Alfie1

Can anyone suggest a logical reason why evil government perps should plan to bring UA 93 down in a field in Pennsylvania ?

It seems to me that, if conspiracy theorists cannot come up with an alternative hypothesis to terrorists putting the plane down as verified by the cockpit voice recorder, then all "inside job" theories fall by the wayside.

What alternative hypothesis can we
come up with that will convince you?

reply to post by ATH911


One needs not to propose a theory as to what happened or why. Lets stick to the facts.

The Crater in Shanksville Was Not Caused by a Boeing 757 (Flight 93) on 9.11. This is FACT.

Research this yourself and realize that there is a small group of willfully ignorant people that come to boards like this and say it isnt so.

Use your better judgement and investigate Flight 93 and share with friends, family and others.







[edit on 28-5-2010 by Shadow Herder]

reply to post by Shadow Herder


No its an opinion based on denial of the actual evidence.

The real fact is that Flight 93 DID crash at Shanksville. Just because you ignore every shred of evidence that supports it does not make YOUR opinion true. Just shows paranoid delusions based on ignorance.

Deny ignorance, do not embrace it.

Originally posted by Shadow Herder
After reviewing evidence and interviews conducted from the Shanksville eyewitnesses it has become very clear that whatever caused the crater was not Flight 93 the Boeing 757. The crater is too small and the lack of wreakage supports the fact that no Boeing 757 crashed in that little Shanksville crater.

Except that, if you actually reviewed the transcripts of eyewitnesses in Shanksville, you know that several witnesses SAW the airliner coming in at between 350 and 500 mph at low altitude, saw it losing pieces from the extreme acceleration and maneuvers, and SAW it belly-roll into a vertical dive just before impact.

Are you suggesting that these eyewitnesses have been compromised and have refuted their testimony? Because, to my knowledge, none of them have retracted their stories. They saw Flight 93 go down, saw the fireball rising into the sky, and felt the concussion of its impact, which broke windows up to half a mile away.

So that wasn't part of your research?

— Doc Velocity




[edit on 5/28/2010 by Doc Velocity]

Here's a collection of eyewitness accounts of people in Shanksville who SAW the plane with their own eyes, saw it dive and crash. Some of these locals were on the scene of the crash within moments:

"It came in low over the trees and started wobbling," said Tim Thornsberg, a resident of Somerset County, who was working near an old strip mine when he saw the plane.

"Then it just rolled over and was flying upside down for a few seconds ... and then it kind of stalled and did a nose dive over the trees. It was just unreal to see something like that."
www.pittsburgh.com...

Eric Peterson, 28, was working in his shop in the Somerset County village of Lambertsville yesterday morning when he heard a plane, looked up and saw one fly over unusually low.

The plane continued on beyond a nearby hill, then dropped out of sight behind a tree line. As it did so, Peterson said it seemed to be turning end-over-end.

Then Peterson said he saw a fireball, heard an explosion and saw a mushroom cloud of smoke rise into the sky.
www.post-gazette.com...


“I saw the plane flying upside down overhead and crash into the nearby trees. My buddy, Doug, and I grabbed our fire extinguishers and ran to the scene,” said Blair.
www.dailyamerican.com...

Eric Peterson of Lambertsville looked up when he heard the plane. "It was low enough, I thought you could probably count the rivets," Peterson said. "You could see more of the roof of the plane than you could the belly. It was on its side."

"There was a great explosion and you could see the flames. It was a massive, massive explosion. Flames and then smoke and then a massive, massive mushroom cloud."
www.cleveland.com... ews/plaindealer/index.ssf?/xml/story.ssf/html_standard.xsl?/base/news/100028703529429109.xml

“Normally I wouldn’t look up, but I just heard on the news that all the planes were grounded and thought this was probably the last one I would see for a while, so I looked up,” she said. “I didn’t see the plane but I heard the plane’s engine. Then I heard a loud thump that echoed off the hills and then I heard the plane’s engine. I heard two more loud thumps and didn’t hear the plane’s engine anymore after that.”
www.dailyamerican.com...

"We didn't hear that plane coming until it was right on top of us," she said. "Then there was a roar." She said the plane appeared to be gliding into the ground. "All at once it just stopped. There was no engine noise, nothing. Someone hollered, Oh my God!' and then there was a real loud thud."
www.cleveland.com... ews/plaindealer/index.ssf?/xml/story.ssf/html_standard.xsl?/base/news/100028703529429109.xml

Shortly after 10 a.m., workers on farms and scrap yards in Somerset County looked up to see an airliner flying low and erratic at an estimated 450 mph.
www.dailyamerican.com...

Bob Blair of Stoystown was driving a coal truck on state Route 30 when he saw the jet plummet "straight down." Barn windowpanes for half a mile around shattered as the jet dived into a reclaimed strip mine and exploded at 10:10 a. m.
sfgate.com.../c/a/2001/09/17/MN40630.DTL

A witness told WTAE-TV's Paul Van Osdol that she saw the plane overhead. It made a high-pitched, screeching sound. The plane then made a sharp, 90-degree downward turn and crashed. newsandviews.tripod.com...

Bob Blair was completing a routine drive to Shade Creek just after 10 a.m. Tuesday, when he saw a huge silver plane fly past him just above the treetops and crash into the woods along Lambertsville Road.

Blair, of Stoystown, a driver with Jim Barron Trucking of Somerset, was traveling in a coal truck along with Doug Miller of Somerset, when they saw the plane spiraling to the ground and then explode on the outskirts of Lambertsville.

“I saw the plane flying upside down overhead and crash into the nearby trees. My buddy, Doug, and I grabbed our fire extinguishers and ran to the scene,” said Blair. www.dailyamerican.com...

As for the debris field at the point of impact, it has been repeatedly explained by the FAA that the majority of the aircraft (about 65%) was recovered, buried up to 30 feet below the surface in the loose soil.

Regarding the bodies of passengers & crew, the largest single piece of human remains was a section of spinal column about 8 inches long. The rest of the bodies were basically blasted into confetti. Still, DNA samples were recovered to account for virtually all of the passengers aboard Flight 93.

There is no mystery here, no conspiracy, except to those who are deliberately ignoring the truth in favor of inventing a conspiracy.

— Doc Velocity

Yes, I realize that the links in my last post are, for the most part, outdated and have been long since archived over the years. These links were active in 2001 and for a few years thereafter; however, we're now almost 9 years down the road, and the links are mostly inactive today.

— Doc Velocity

Originally posted by GenRadek
reply to post by Shadow Herder

 

No its an opinion based on denial of the actual evidence.

The real fact is that Flight 93 DID crash at Shanksville. Just because you ignore every shred of evidence that supports it does not make YOUR opinion true. Just shows paranoid delusions based on ignorance.

Deny ignorance, do not embrace it.

Funny, change "DID" with "DIDN'T" and that's what we think about you.

Some evidence supports a plane crash, BUT hardly any of the evidence supports the official story. This is what happens when you STAGE of crash.

Originally posted by Doc Velocity

Are you suggesting that these eyewitnesses have been compromised and have refuted their testimony?

Why didn't any of those witnesses state they saw it crash at a 40 deg, the official story? They all said they saw it go down 90 deg. How did they all get it so wrong?

saw the fireball rising into the sky, and felt the concussion of its impact, which broke windows up to half a mile away.

All the kinds of things you'd get with a bomb too.

Originally posted by Doc Velocity
As for the debris field at the point of impact, it has been repeatedly explained by the FAA that the majority of the aircraft (about 65%) was recovered, buried up to 30 feet below the surface in the loose soil.

95% recovered with about 80% being buried.

Regarding the bodies of passengers & crew, the largest single piece of human remains was a section of spinal column about 8 inches long.

Yet not a "drop of blood" at the scene.

The rest of the bodies were basically blasted into confetti.

How could that be if most of the plane was strong enough to tunnel down into the ground?

reply to post by ATH911

Why didn't any of those witnesses state they saw it crash at a 40 deg, the official story? They all said they saw it go down 90 deg. How did they all get it so wrong?

Wow, really, that's the best you got? Nobody happen to have taken an azimuth reading on the plane before crashing so, ergo, it was an inside job? You don't say stuff like that in public do you?

And are you still insisting that there was no blood at the site because one person said he didn't see any? If I go to a football game and leave in the final three minutes, does the game never end because I didn't see the ending?

Yes, the crater that you depict is what is left of flight 93. It was blown out of the sky by a YAL-1 with the Coil laser. The only thing left would have been the fusilage and a lot of black ashes. Oh yes some other items would have survived that were not directly hit by the laser (i.e. shoes, paper, etc.) Watch proof of this by seeing the movie "War of the Worlds". Their (Hollywoods special effects dudes) depiction of people turning to ash and their clothes flying away as the alien laser disentigrated them would be correct. Are you still doubtful? Go ask Boeing for a demonstration.