Manners and Decorum... What ever happened to these principles in the REAL World?!?!?!?

Originally posted by shyster55
Theres a disease that is spreading within the U.S and its called selfishness.
[edit on 3-2-2010 by shyster55]

Oh please. This is a world wide problem. It's not just the U.S.

This seems to be a reccuring theme in threads by Jaxon. Hate americans blame americans. . . .

Let us be real here my friends. This is not a U.S. centric problem. The demoralization of the masses is global.

I find it quite amusing that your worried about manners in the states when it is common place for synonyms for words like penis and vagina are common comedic fodder on European television. Nudity and vulgarity ooze out of european entertainment.

Soap commercials showing the lathering up of fully nude models. News in the nude. . . all EUROPEAN trademarks if you will.

So stop beating the bad american drum open your damn eyes and focus on the bigger picture that is humanity all over the globe.

We must unite to fight the problems in todays world. . . .This whole piss and moan piss and moan point the finger blame the other mentality isn't fixing anything. All it is doing is showing just how much you really care about the problem.

Be proactive, say something to these people. Explain why your offended. Do not expect people who have been raised without your definition of manners to know that you are offended. You can't expect to change the world from your desk chair.

reply to post by unityemissions

It has nothing to do with socioeconomic status

I agree, I demand respect from my children, grandchildren and great grandchildren, and I get it, because I earned it.

If respect is not taught at home, what you see are the results.


[edit on 012828p://bWednesday2010 by Stormdancer777]

reply to post by 814ck0u7

Well the point I was trying to make earlier is that words are not just words. Hitler used his words to incite hatred towards the jews before and during WWII. Words can have a profound effect on people. Even if it doesnt effect you it can effect an individual and even a society as a whole.

reply to post by shyster55


it isnt the words that are the problem... its THE POINT at which words turn into actions that becomes an issue

yes, Hitler did incite an entire nation. but if it had just stayed at stirring speeches and propaganda, and the people DID NOT LET IT EFFECT THEM, then thats all it would have been.

You can thank New York City and the corporate world for all that, not television.

The attitudes and behaviors are merely the corporate world and NYC writ large. Think about the cellphone/blackberry/iphone commercials that extol the bennies of being able to do business anywhere, on the road, on vacation, at the restuarant...

Once tha capacity was there, corporate types felt it was a wasted resource and demanded its use by their employees. Once these types started abusing the public space, using the commons for their private business, the rot began. Being aggresive business types, they set the example by carving out private office space out of the commons, space they aren't entitled to. Once that begins, everyone must follow suit or be cut out: the commons no longer exist.

I live in Los Angeles. You know why I blame US. Its because eveyone looks to Our country as an example as the way theirs should be. But the problem is we are no better than them. Maybe even worse.



[edit on 3-2-2010 by shyster55]

class is a thing of the past.

As far as manners in the USA, its not that bad but it has gotten worse of the past decades. The root to this rudimentary problem, is the lack luster perplexity of the deconstrution of morals and what they mean, in essense this observation, is just a reflection, of the lack of discipline for individual growth, on many fronts. Look at our pop culture, Our Music that sells is all about how its cool to be a rebel without a cause, how the you or I, is most important in this world..

Not only is mannerism going out, so is speaking proper english.

The question should not be what happened, the question should be where did this start. Start digging up old bones and the answer is crystal clear.

Lead by example. It seems the example is hard to find.

Oh and do not be afraid to point out to someone they are being rude, like when someone cuts in front of you in line or whatever, let em know, thats the only way people learn. Lets not forget maybe allot of people just don't know what they are doing is rude.

[edit on 3-2-2010 by Bicent76]

Originally posted by JaxonRoberts



A few tables over was a rather rotund individual just talking up a storm with a mouthful of Big Mac, spraying the table, and his dining companions, with small bits of the gastanomical delight, all the while showing those of us within visual range what the begining of the digestive process looks like. It was not a socially acceptable thing once upon a time.

What did you find more objectionable?
The "rotundness" or that he was eating with his mouth open?
Sometimes the picture that you observe is hiding a lot more information than you assume.

My daughter is mentally and physically handicap who likes to have a Saturday morning routine of the local activity center followed by McD's for lunch. We often get stared at by not only other children but by parents as well because she is different and behaves differently.
Perhaps the other parents think that I am not raising my child with good manners because she sometimes has a shout.
But I won't stop going there simply because others make assumptions that I really don't give a damn about.

As long as Melissa is happy, then I'm happy

Originally posted by Bicent76
class is a thing of the pass.

As far as manners in the USA, its not that bad but it has gotten worse of the past decades. The root to this rudimentary, is the lack luster perplexity of the deconstrution of morals and what they mean, in essense this observation, is just a reflection, of the lack of discipline for individual growth, on many fronts. Look at our pop culture, Our Music that sells is all about how its cool to be a rebel without a cause, how the you or I, is most important in this world..

Not only is mannerism going out, so is speaking proper english.

The question should not be what happened, the question should be where did this start. Start digging up old bones and the answer is crystal clear.

Lead by example. It seems the example is hard to find.

Oh and do not be afraid to point out to someone they are being rude, like when someone cuts in front of you in line or whatever, let em know, thats the only way people learn. Lets not forget maybe allot of people just don't know what they are doing is rude.

there hasnt been "proper english speaking" since a generation after declaration of our independence as a nation.

after all, if you arent british....

besides that, proper grammar isnt a sign of civility. words are made up, and as such only so much serious-ness can be given to them.

This breakdown has been designed. The more we act like animals the more the government needs to help us. However, for young children who behave poorly, responsibility lies squarely on the parent. As we are expecting our first (a boy), I have procured some Emily Post etiquette books. Some for me and wifey, others for the lad.

Originally posted by 814ck0u7
reply to post by shyster55

 

it isnt the words that are the problem... its THE POINT at which words turn into actions that becomes an issue

yes, Hitler did incite an entire nation. but if it had just stayed at stirring speeches and propaganda, and the people DID NOT LET IT EFFECT THEM, then thats all it would have been.

You said it correctly words CAN turn into actions. It is usaully words that are exchanged before action occurs.

[edit on 3-2-2010 by shyster55]

The problem is you all really have no idea what you want.

You think of a simpler time when people were kind and helped there neighbor. You want people to behave this way today.

Let's look back and notice that our country was built on the backs of faith and the faithful. (before i go further please note that this is not a religion plug) Morality and manners were predicated by religion.

Jump forward a few decades and you start to get a progressive unreligious movement. This movement is embraced by many here at ATS. We all want to see the truth see the people freed from the shackles of religion and opression.

We fought hard and woke a huge number of people up. We took them out of the curch we pushed them into progressive thinking. We took god and civility and kicked him out of the public forum. Children at school are berrated for prayer and faith.

We demolished the base on which morals and principles in this country were built.

The only people here to blame are ourselves. (note im not saying anyone in particular) We took away the foundation and the walls of morality collapsed. We set out to break the chains, we just weren't prepared for the monster we unleashed.

reply to post by 814ck0u7


I guess etiquette is not part of mannerism...

taking the time out to think before you speak.. Some would argue or debate you over speaking or thinking before you speak as a form of mannerism..

I blame it on the Hippies. Do what makes you feel good. Nothing is ever wrong, unless you are a straight white male who eats meat then there is no excuse for you.

[edit on 3-2-2010 by thinline]

reply to post by constantwonder


I kind of think most of what you spoke about happened during the hippie era. Before then American society was still very conservative.

[edit on 3-2-2010 by shyster55]

reply to post by constantwonder


www.tysknews.com...

I agree constant, people fail to realize even the old one room school houses were run by Sunday school teachers, and Colleges that were founded and run by Christians.

106 of the first 108 colleges were started on the Christian faith. By the close of 1860 there were 246 colleges in America. Seventeen of these were state institutions; almost every other one was founded by Christian denominations or by individuals who avowed a religious purpose.

Harvard College, 1636 - An Original Rule of Harvard College: "Let every student be plainly instructed and earnestly pressed to consider well, the main end of his life and studies is, to know God and Jesus Christ which is eternal life, (John 17:3), and therefore to lay Christ in the bottom, as the only foundation of all sound knowledge and learning."

William and Mary, 1691 - The College of William and Mary was started mainly due to the efforts of Rev. James Blair in order, according to its charter of 1691, "that the Church of Virginia may be furnished with a seminary of ministers of the gospel, and that the youth may be piously educated in good letters and manners, and that the Christian religion may be propagated among the Western Indians to the glory of Almighty God."

Yale University, 1701 - Yale University was started by Congregational ministers in 1701,"for the liberal and religious education of suitable youth…to propagate in this wilderness, the blessed reformed Protestant religion…"

Princeton, 1746 - Associated with the Great Awakening, Princeton was founded by the Presbyterians in 1746. Rev. Jonathan Dickinson became its first president, declaring, "cursed be all that learning that is contrary to the cross of Christ."

University of Pennsylvania, 1751 - Ben Franklin had much to do with the beginning of the University of Pennsylvania. It was not started by a denomination, but its laws reflect its Christian character. Consider the first two Laws, relating to Moral Conduct (from 1801):

"1. None of the students or scholars, belonging to this seminary, shall make use of any indecent or immoral language: whether it consist in immodest expressions; in cursing and swearing; or in exclamations which introduce the name of God, without reverence, and without necessity. "2. None of them shall, without a good and sufficient reason, be absent from school, or late in his attendance; more particularly at the time of prayers, and of the reading of the Holy Scriptures."

You took God out of the schools, what do you expect?

You reap what you sow.



[edit on 012828p://bWednesday2010 by Stormdancer777]

Originally posted by thinline
I blame it on the Hippies. Do what makes you feel good. Nothing is ever wrong, unless you are a straight white male who eats meat then there excuse for you.

You have a point, that is when it started, and now they run the government.

reply to post by Signals


You are exactly right. It started with shows like Donohue and has devolved into shows like Jerry Springer.
The most offensive ill mannered unmoral people in america beamed right into your living-room every afternoon and evening for 40 years. It is only natural that with the decline of the nuclear family that people's sense of normal will be influenced by tv as more and more kids are partially raised by it. How many people grew up watching this crap, becoming desensitized until it seemed normal?

reply to post by constantwonder


We have become prisoners of our flesh, slaves to its want and to taking care of it materially through the politics of the crowd, and in doing so have eliminated the possibility of the one indefinable joy in life which is the accomplishment of intangibles.

Normal people, of normal ability, deprived of satisfaction in their inner worlds and forced to compete in an externalized group of selves, will undertake a defensive mental state in which they are both nearly sociopathic in their personal material ambition and resentful of any who appear to have risen out of the group of selves. The subculture they have created within society is joined by giving up what makes one an individual in exchange for an approval of their external selves, but this makes them an enemy of anyone who retains that inner self. As this decision is an embittered one, even if they do not recognize it, their bitterness takes the form of a revenge-orientation which opposes that which dares transcend the crowd.

reply to post by constantwonder


Why does the foundation of morality have to be religion? What about philosophy? I'm a somewhat moral person, but don't have any religious inclinations. The reason I'm a moral person is because the golden rule is not only logical, but that I've witnessed synergy in nature and humanity many times.

If the problem is that people have turned away from religion and think that morality is no longer applicable, they need to be educated. If only philosophy were taught in grade school. You don't need to have an IQ >130 to understand basic moral principals from a philosophical standpoint as a child. I think most here know this won't happen, as it's not in TPTB's interest.