Court Ordered Euthenasia In UK

reply to post by Applesandoranges


In the context of this thread nobody has murdered anyone......you may very well have your own views on abortion or whatever, but they are not relevant on this thread.

Originally posted by Bluebelle

Originally posted by Applesandoranges
Why do the people who administer the drugs because of the consent of another person think they are not murderer's?
Thats like the government bringing in a law to say ok everyone we give you consent to kill eachother but it still ends up as murder.
Just because the person thinks its the right thing to do does not make it right and is still murder.
I wonder what emotions not just for the family and the person who got ill but the person who administers their death.
The doctor who does abortion is still a murderer.

This is just my deep thoughts on this. Your profession wont save you from being a murderer.

The deep impact of giving professionals the green light can actually cause a severe and dangerous implication for the whole human race. If we give our consent to 1 or 2 different consensual murder scenarios then we are agreeing infact to the depopulation of humans.

Wow, whats it like living in a world where everythings black & white?

Its not murder at all. In this case the child would have passed away due to natural causes i.e. the condition it had.

I guess i base alot of my answers on warnings because i did die once and i went into a horrible place. Not hell but it was horrible. I'am not a murderer nor did i ever do anything horrific in my life to end up in such a place. But i know that what controls human conciousness is darkness. This is all i can say about the spiritworld i went too. I just know that earth has sunk into lower conciousness. All i cna say is that if people are searching for the Light or grace they are right. We are all one brothers and sisters in soul.

Im not a religious person at all. But if i did sin the only sin would be my anger and sex.

I cant imagine what it would be for those who commit even more horrible acts they aint concious of.

By the way im still not religious more spiritual in knowing that the world is controlled by darkness.

It is hard for me to tell people hye look i know whats on the otherside ive been there. So i tell people in warnings and give them another dimension to their thoughts so they can look at both sides of their thoughts not just an agreeable side.

[edit on 15-11-2009 by Applesandoranges]

[edit on 15/11/2009 by Argyll]

reply to post by Applesandoranges


I wouldnt say being pro-euthanasia is an agreeable side to be on at all.
Imagine you were the child in this cases parent. Would you rather risk going to hell, or let your child spend the rest of its life in pain, no quality of life and no chance of being cured?

I was that person on my deathbed. I was going through more pain then you can imagine. Im glad there was no choice for euthanasia as i would not be here today if i did not listen to my inner voice. Minds do change believe me. I wanted a way out of the pain. I do very much feel sad for those who do not make it. The pain is temporary. I believe that pain on the earth was a much beautiful experience to the the pain in the afterlife.
It saddens me to no end to know that the truth is that darkness does rule this earth. That the light is even harder to reach. This is because the conciousness of the earth is trully in darkness. I cannot explain it any other way.

I have studied hundreds and hundreds of spiritual literature to understand what happened to me. The closest to my belief after that experience is the ringing cedars books.

All the warnings about people needing to reach for the light will i believe not be for a long time unless people change their conciousness. It is not the people's fault as the darkness do control humans and humans are not concious of this.

People are indeed committing slow acts of murder and suicide everyday although not concious of it. I will not say how or through what as it does not matter. What matters is that we need to be more concious and help in changing ourselves before others.

It is very difficult at this time as we are bombarded with alot of dark imagery unaware of its impacts on our souls blue print the spiritual mind. Everything we do or say gets dowloaded into not only our brains but our soul.

I joined this site because i believe those poisoning and controlling us are giving us over to the darkness.

My concious decisions can affect those across the world. The only wrong in humanity is not being aware of it. Love.




[edit on 15-11-2009 by Applesandoranges]

Originally posted by Applesandoranges
Why do the people who administer the drugs because of the consent of another person think they are not murderer's?
Thats like the government bringing in a law to say ok everyone we give you consent to kill eachother but it still ends up as murder.
Just because the person thinks its the right thing to do does not make it right and is still murder.
I wonder what emotions not just for the family and the person who got ill but the person who administers their death.
The doctor who does abortion is still a murderer.

This is just my deep thoughts on this. Your profession wont save you from being a murderer.

The deep impact of giving professionals the green light can actually cause a severe and dangerous implication for the whole human race. If we give our consent to 1 or 2 different consensual murder scenarios then we are agreeing infact to the depopulation of humans.

Its like the elite are saying ok lets give professionals the consent to do murder so that we dont look as bad and they can be just like us and cause they are professionals people will believe its in the best interest of those they kill. Then elite turn around to humanity and say but hey you agreed to our depopulation tricks.





[edit on 15-11-2009 by Applesandoranges]

reply to post by Applesandoranges


Wow. I thought long and hard about replying to this. But here goes. As a nurse for over 30 years, mostly in ICU, I have many times been the one to either start sedation or continue the sedation of a terminal patient. I do not consider myself a murderer. To the contrary, I am there to heal those that can be healed,or comfort those who cannot. If you have never cared for someone in a terminal condition, I certainly cannot describe it enough to change your mind. But let me give you just a little idea of things I have seen and participated in: Working for hours trying to tranfuse enough blood in a patient who is "bleeding out", to keep them alive, while literally standing in inches of blood; continually doing cpr on a frail chest, feeling ribs break under my hands; suctioning a patient to keep their breathing tube clear enough so they can be ventilated, watching them grimace in pain every time; inserting iv's, catheters, stomache tubes, etc., watching those grimaces or listening to those moans of pain. I could go on for hours, but you probably wouldn't believe some of the things I have done and seen. So, to administer a sedative, NOT a lethal dose...but a strong dose to alieviate suffering when life support is removed....well, I sleep very well at night thank you. Sorry for the long post, thanks for "listening", and peace and love to you all.

I would have done the same thing. My heart goes out the the parents. That has go to be the absolute worst thing to ever have to deal with.
I'm grateful my son was born healthy.

Originally posted by niteowl
reply to post by Applesandoranges

 

Wow. I thought long and hard about replying to this. But here goes. As a nurse for over 30 years, mostly in ICU, I have many times been the one to either start sedation or continue the sedation of a terminal patient. I do not consider myself a murderer. To the contrary, I am there to heal those that can be healed,or comfort those who cannot. If you have never cared for someone in a terminal condition, I certainly cannot describe it enough to change your mind. But let me give you just a little idea of things I have seen and participated in: Working for hours trying to tranfuse enough blood in a patient who is "bleeding out", to keep them alive, while literally standing in inches of blood; continually doing cpr on a frail chest, feeling ribs break under my hands; suctioning a patient to keep their breathing tube clear enough so they can be ventilated, watching them grimace in pain every time; inserting iv's, catheters, stomache tubes, etc., watching those grimaces or listening to those moans of pain. I could go on for hours, but you probably wouldn't believe some of the things I have done and seen. So, to administer a sedative, NOT a lethal dose...but a strong dose to alieviate suffering when life support is removed....well, I sleep very well at night thank you. Sorry for the long post, thanks for "listening", and peace and love to you all.

I do very much feel sorry for what you have to do. Hard decisions we make everyday that does not always constitute the right or wrong decisions but may be crucial at the time of dispensing such action. I have lost many family members to cancer. Watched my grandmother die her last hours and also knew the exact time she was to die.

Im not speaking of murder in human terms of what is known as murder. Things go deeper then that from the perspective i adhere too. We are all actually unconcious murderer's in a sense. We weave the web we create. We know the poisons we put into our bodies is killing us and we feed those same poisons to our loved ones. So can you see why humanity has been driven into darkness, even by small actions we are unaware of. We are ll brother sand sisters in spirit we not only feel our pain but the pain of others even more so in the afterlife. Those we hurt we feel their pain not only on this earth but in the afterlife much more so.

Would we ever get out of such darkness? I cannot honestly say because not even i have remained a saint. It is based on the collective efforts of humans and the reason we cannot reach light is the collective effort of humans.

There are many secrets to how the world works humanity can have paradise if it wants to but at the moment people love the lives they lead and they lead it. As brothers and sisters we repeat those actions every generation and are not aware of those actions we cause.

Honestly those keeping away the true identity of all humans will have more consequences then those they keep it from.

How can we be like the ones who have gone to the light? It is to follow their example. A majority of humanity unfortunately not awoken to this stage of development. Not because they are sinning, alot of humanity is unaware of this.

The only thing i dont know about the place of darkness i went to is if its forever or temporary as i was not there a long time. But i now know why they are searching for eternal youth as the only last light they will ever see is day.

You feel you are doing the right thing and your line of work precludes that. You watch deeply inside the suffering humans soul. But we trully, trully do not know what is deep in their heart or where they are. But the suffering on earth is if you want to know not trully meant to happen. We are eternal beings and we had the choice long ago to turn around before darkness infiltrated you, us, them.

Your mind is not you. You have to give credence to everything you learned on earth that shaped your mind and who you are today. Children are born aware. But then life throws everything at them and we learn a new system a new system that is not us but those who shaped you.


In other words i do not believe that is your fault for the life that laid upon your hands. Just that conciousness needs to shift its attitude away from darkness. We have been in it too long and now its time for people to see the light!





[edit on 15-11-2009 by Applesandoranges]

reply to post by Applesandoranges


I was responding to your question, "why do the people who administer the drugs.....think they are not murders?' Maybe I was confused. What drugs are you referring to? We in the medical field cannot and do not administer lethal drugs to perform euthanasia. I believe the OP was referring to an article about removing life support (the ventilator), and the child receiving a large dose of sedative, not a lethal injection. This was to avoid his sufferring. Then you said in your next post you were "not speaking of murder in human terms of what is known as murder." See my confusion?

I, in the same position, would have done exactly the same thing, how long can you watch your child suffering, the sedative they gave the child was not Life Ending in and of itself but it DID make the death of the child easier, possibly not on the parents but on the child itself.
If I was in the position of having a terminal disease, being a burden to others, in constant pain or the danger of drowning in my own body fluids unless preventative steps were taken every day I would WANT members of my family to take the step and say "Switch the machines off, let him die without pain but WITH dignity!

The clinic by the the way is in Switzerland and is called "Dignitas" They do good work!

Originally posted by niteowl
reply to post by Applesandoranges

 

. . . So, to administer a sedative, NOT a lethal dose...but a strong dose to alieviate suffering when life support is removed....well, I sleep very well at night thank you. Sorry for the long post, thanks for "listening", and peace and love to you all.

I was watching through the door when a nurse gave my terminally ill mother-in-law a drug to clear out the fluid in her lungs. She had cancer, and, left to her own devices, was going to slowly drown as her lungs filled with fluid. Dot was not afraid of dying, but she was afraid of dying like that.

The trouble was, continually giving Dot the drug to stop her drowning meant that drug would kill her. The dose I saw was the dose that did. I ran in and held Dot as she died, and the nurse was pretty upset that I'd seen her. Knowing that Dot was on the brink of dying in a way that she would have hated, I thanked the nurse and told her I hoped someone like her would be on hand to help me if I was ever in that position.

Helping someone on the way out gets complicated in this mixed-up world, but if it's done purely from compassion in a situation where you are as certain as possible that the person would want that help, then it's just like holding a door open for someone.

God is not a cruel ogre who demands we suffer and suffer until our bodies finally collapse.

Originally posted by Kailassa

Originally posted by niteowl
reply to post by Applesandoranges

 

God is not a cruel ogre who demands we suffer and suffer until our bodies finally collapse.

Well said, Kailassa. And I believe that God helped us develop the medicines to help alleviate suffering.

Originally posted by Applesandoranges
I guess i base alot of my answers on warnings because i did die once and i went into a horrible place. Not hell but it was horrible.

I died once, (through a mix-up at the dentists when he gave me too much general anaesthetic,) and I went somewhere wonderful.
It was so wonderful I hated having to come back, and just remembering that place makes me happy. I look forward to the day I return there. However I'm in no hurry, because that one visit has given me a different time sense. It's though I'm there already, and living out the illusion of life on a second plane, not much more real than an RPG.

I'm not a particularly good person, and I don't call myself a Christian, but those things didn't seem to be issues. There was just this incredible love and welcoming feeling and joy and beauty. As far as I could tell everyone who wanted would be welcome there, but it would be too difficult for some people to accept, because it was a place where there were no secrets, only love. Any person whose life was built on secrets and hatred would not want to go there.

I have very mixed feelings on the subject of euthanasia - my mother was dying of cancer, in terrible pain, caught in a repetitive language loop - babbling- as often happens near death - its terrible to watch and I can only imagine what its like to experience - when the hospice nurses arrived to help her through the process they asked me if I wanted her conscious or sedated - I said sedated - this is code for morphine induced coma and death following soon after - they don't give lethal doses officially but the patient's body is already shutting down so the morphine will be absorbed but not leave the body as it would in a healthy patient - so each dose builds up until death happens - the doctors know this - though its not explained - and that is how euthanasia is practiced in most states here in the U.S. except where it has been legalized...

my mixed feelings come from situations where the patient is alive though not fully functional and someone is willing to care for them [like the parents] yet someone else [like the husband] wants the patient dead for reasons that may be dicey [like money]...there was just such a case here not too long ago and I'm sure there have been others not as widely publicized.. the potential for abuse of legal euthanasia is what concerns me as well as the sanctity of life issue which is no small thing...so I am not yet prepared to come down firmly on the side of legalization despite my own personal experience with it...

When we return to Love all pain is gone and we will no longer need to suffer. No longer will those need to resort to extreme and desperate measures of ending the temporary suffering.

I saw darkness for a reason and felt what i had to for a reason. The reason being that i have work to do on this earth. Darkness is what i believe a place of peoples fear and suffering and manifestations/beliefs in this life that people have given power too and this not known by certain individuals been brainwashed subliminally into them for millenia. This is why i speak of the vibration of the whole human planet being controlled of darkness. It exists and it is there.

I speak for the oneness whole heartedly that we are all brothers and sisters. Murder in a spiritual sense is that we severe the ties to them when the life is ended in your hands. This is a devestating task when people do not know we are all one. The light of the human spark within each human being is there and it too also feels the suffering. Though we are nto trully meant to suffer it has come about by darkness in human hearts.


Unfortunately some people do come to earth to experience the suffering. It helps them to grow and learn in the temporary afterlife. But paradise can be here and now if people choose to open their eyes to see and open their ears to listen. It has been taught over and over again by those who have come to earth to teach about paradise one being Jesus, buddha, Anastasia ringing cedars etc.






[edit on 16-11-2009 by Applesandoranges]

[edit on 16-11-2009 by Applesandoranges]