Does Cash for Clunkers Help the Environment?

Does Cash for Clunkers Help the Environment?

www.foxnews.com

Sold as an economic stimulus and an environmental salve, the "cash for clunkers" program has succeeded in jump-starting the ailing auto industry. But some environmental and national security watchdogs are now arguing that the harm caused by destroying the used vehicles -- required by the government trade-in program -- may outweigh the benefits of exchanging pollution-spewing gas guzzlers for new, more efficient cars.

"Disposing of old products, a step required by most incentive and rebate programs, also has environmental costs," Gwen Ottinger, a researcher at the Chemical Heritage Found

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Cash for Clunkers; Keeping Americans in Debt

Critics are saying that the environmental costs of destroying the old cars outweigh the possible environmental advantages of the new "more green" car!

By this reasoning then why recycle cars in the first place? Is recycling now bad, not green and earth friendly? Should we just drive the old clunkers till they go no further and then park them in a field somewhere (or push them into a back creek like we did years ago)!

The Stimulus Package is basically a total waste of taxpayer money anyway as it is just a gigantic pay off to the Unions and friends of Obama, Pelosi and Democratic smoozers. Why not take some of that money and use it to help ailing American auto makers and get some of the gas guzzlers off the road? A little relief when it is needed to the working, taxpaying Americans!

I guess everything has to be considered by the current Power elite as a CARBON emission and who will pay the cost rather than will it be bad or good for the economy or the country!

Who in the Obama administration really cares about jobs and prosperity? They've proven that by pushing Cap and Trade, Governent Health Care, etc.

IMHO if Congress really wanted to bring the country back to prosperity simply do away with Cap n Trade, Government health Care and signal that they REALLY support American business as opposed to the socialization of American business!

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IT might help the enviorment a little. It will play havoc on the used car part market for sure.

fiat cash for clunkers is a scam

it's like two people decide to sell cookies on the sidewalk
they use $200 to buy the ingredients
they make cookies, personA tells personB hey i'm hungry, here's 2 dollars for a cookie, then personA says hey i'm hungry too, here's the same 2 dollars back for a cookie and this cycle happens all day.

At the end of the day they consider it a successful day because they both ate all the cookies with the same $2 going back and forth

reply to post by plumranch



Cash for clunkers has everything to do with icreasing the revenue for the automakers by increasing demand and nothing about the environment.

Compared to buying a used car, you would have to drive a Prius for several years to offset the carbon footprint of its manufacturing process... Not to mention the recycling process to destroy some pretty decent cars.


mod edit to replace large quote of post with "reply to" code

[edit on 4-8-2009 by DontTreadOnMe]

reply to post by ModernAcademia

fiat cash for clunkers is a scam

Doesn't it make you feel better that there are at least some environmental aspects of it that are a slight shade of GREEN? Like:

"Why throw away good parts when the supply chain is in jeopardy? It doesn't make a whole lot of sense," Wilson told The Associated Press. But Jim Burton, a service manager at Randy Curnow Buick-Pontiac-GMC in Kansas City, Mo., said other parts of the vehicle besides the engine can be recycled and that will help people who can't or wont' trade in their cars.

"Doors, hoods, transmission, interior components can be reused. But a lot of people still have these cars, they can't trade them or won't, but they're in pretty sad shape. This is going to give an opportunity for salvage yards and people to sell some of the components and maybe bring the car back to better condition,"

My opinion of Pelosi, Schumer, Feinstein, and the rest is that they don't give a rats behind about being green in their hearts, its whatever gets them votes and goodness knows they will be needing them!

They know that throwing $100 bills out of helicopters in their districts will get them votes but it wouldn't look good so this is one of those popular alternatives. Money, cars, jobs, look green, support the UAW, apple pie vote for us! Remember us!

tranmision can be reused??? Thats a new one. Only an idiot woulduse a transmission he got form a junkyard..its gunna break down sooner or later, especaily if its an automatic transmission! Automatics were designed to mkae, obviously shifting gears easier,..but they do in fact, put a strain on the engine and drivetrain as well. Now if it was manual transmission, thats kinda a different story. As for a rebulit tranny..their really not worth it,,its just a quick expensive fix to borrow some more time n use out of it.
Does it help the envornemnt? not really.I mean todays cars seem to be made of more plastic, especialyl imported china plastic. with all these reports of carrcinogens and toins foudn in plastics coming form china..well you gotta wondeer, what in the plastic in my new car then! And if that new ar one days does find itself at the scrapyard, think of all the toxns, carrcinogens, gases plastic emit and going into the soil, contaminating the water table. At least if it was still miostly steel, yes it would rust, but erode and blwo away intot he wind harmlessly.
Just dont breath rust particles in

Its all a money makin scandal pure and simple. The writting is on the wall on this one. I wa reading a year or 2 ago abuot GM chevys trannys..they mostly seem to fail at around 75-80,000 miles. The culprit...a $5 plastic seal wa used in lpace of a rubber groumet seal, costing at around $13 each. So they faovred the plastic one to save cost. Apparently it ddint work well with the tranny. The know(GM) msot of the public does not do routine maintenance..ala oil chamnges, tranny flush n fills at recommnede mileage or time. They figured out, most people will siply jsut pay off thier car, and buy a new one, even if it meant the buyer in debt. i have a 95 plymouth..yes , its on the lemon side..but..... thie transmissions are known to gowell over 275,000 miles! and have really storng engines, rated at 34 mgp. That donst mean anyting mpg, as stop n go traffic DOES affect yuor mielage. that 34, 44 50 mpg is under ideal circumstances, highway traveling only, and/or uncongested streets. the more an engine stis in idle, the more ga in fact yuo are burning nad creating carbon buildup in the engine.
so, here we have, plastic toxic cars, with the knowledge of an idiotic public unwilling to take care of thier investments(car), who will never reallt see taht 44 mpg or whatever, in most circumstances. Its all a marketing lpow, so the big comapnys can get yuor $$$and sell yuo low grade kalico toys on recyceld wheels

reply to post by ziggy1706


My dad has been running a rebuilt transmission in his 71 Ford Ranger for the pass 15 years without any problems. So yes you can reuse a transmission and have it work as a long term fix.

Maybe you're just not a very good transmission mechanic?


On topic.

The Greeners will never be happy. We could make driving and shipping illegal world wide and they would complain that our farts are destroying the enviroment of some microbe in the deserts of Africa.

I have pretty much stopped listening to what they say.

Tht 71 ford ragner was way better built than cars n trucks form the 80's on...todays engines and trannys have so moany more parts and compications. IM not a tranny mechanic. Ive been told by a few, not many but a few, tranny shop guys what i posted. its really a quick fix, reagarding 'todays' cars, not the ones fomr yesteryears.

reply to post by ziggy1706


ahh so its okay to use a transmission from the 70's era, just not any from 80 on up.

What about my buddies 1985 Thunderbird. We rebuilt the engine and transmission 13 years ago . He still has it and plans on giving it to his son when he turns 16 in a few years.

You're right, you aren't a transmission mechanic and I'm going to go as far as to say you aren't any type of mechanic.

Manual transmissions get abused alot more because of bad shifting. People skipping gears or staying in a gear not long enough or to long kills a transmission very rapidly.

reply to post by plumranch


Hi Plum

Nice thread ya got starting. I would be very hesitant into buying into their claims. Here is a News Story from today that may help you in understanding why it isn't as good as Car Dealers want you to think.

news.yahoo.com...

Calculations by The Associated Press, using Department of Transportation figures, show that replacing those fuel hogs will reduce carbon dioxide emissions by just under 700,000 tons a year. While that may sound impressive, it's nothing compared to what the U.S. spewed last year: nearly 6.4 billion tons (and that was down from previous years).

I have a thread I started yesterday dealing with the Green Revolution and the bunk that people are buying into with it. If you can read through all the off-topic posts random people put, it may help you out as well.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

I personally don't buy into this Green Revolution craze. Although I care about the environment and do my best to not be wasteful, the "revolution" itself is something of silliness. If its not an intricate NWO thwart like I think, then it is a great scam that is raking in a lot of money from a lot of very naive Americans.

Best of luck Plum!

-Sliadon

ha ha ha ha ... people are so gulible aren't they... this is a pay olla scam, who owns dealerships...? and you think they didnt see this coming...?
ha ha ha ha ...

Ok, here is the scoop... the dealerships cant find anyone with a pulse to sell there wares too... and the Newly Sold Cars are coming back by the thousands... Repo's are off the scale... and used cars are non-existant because people opt to fix instead of buy... when I called my Mechanic dude, he says business is brisk but getting paid is difficult. so this cash for clunkers is just aid to dealerships... in my opinion

reply to post by BornPatriot


What are you talking about?? The government would never do something like that! Impost upon us one thing but slap a different label on it. That is just silliness.

Okay turning sarcasm off now [/sarcasm]

I agree with the possibility of a scam in the works.

-Sliadon