Does Chi realy exist?

This is a short video i put together for a bit of fun. (im an Ex-Martial arts instructor myself ).



[edit on 11-7-2009 by VitalOverdose]

[edit on 11-7-2009 by VitalOverdose]

reply to post by VitalOverdose


That video was hilarious. Pretty good proof that Chi''s only power is the power of the human imagination.

reply to post by VitalOverdose

The video kinda shows two sides of Chi, like in everything, there's the real legit stuff, and there are those who be "fakin the funk."

Chi's been around too long in Vedic and other traditions to be discounted, it's the body's potential to harness energy. The way I recently came to understand it is that the central nervous system, if you wanna think neurophysiology, mostly consists of the brain and spinal cord, straight up and down like chakra points. Through meditation and mind and body training, you can focus energy, or electricity from the hip, the brain, or the solar plexus, anywhere else, and then release that energy.

Yeah a lot of people play along or try to exploit chi, but you can't fake the funk, you can just feel it.

Chi can be used in a lot of physical activities, including bboying, board breaking, baseball, and martial arts.

[edit on 11-7-2009 by orion the bboy]

reply to post by VitalOverdose


If you are an instructor, you should no better than the average person, about Chi!!!??
What 'ARt' do you teach?

I believe Chi is real and there are people that would also exploit "chi" to make money.

I believe that Yogi's and Shaolin monks can harness the purest form of this bio energy.

I found this fascinating!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

reply to post by VitalOverdose


Chi is just a word and a concept put out there by people, to entrap other people.

I think the inner strength exists, but chi is just a name, as are all those other things - the ego, the id, the superego - OMG forget it.

reply to post by KRISKALI777


I used to teach Karate which is an external martial arts so doesn't involve internal energy training. Ive been a student of quite a few internal martial arts systems and TBH i don't think it exists as a fighting energy. There's a big difference between nerve strikes and and the concept of Dim Mak but most of the time so called world experts will use to visually prove the existence of chi.

Things like Bruce Lee's 1 inch punch are actually quite clever mind control tricks that anyone can do after 5mins of instruction.People like Bruce are so good and convincing people with these parlor tricks that they never have to get into any real fights to prove their theories.

As a healing force i couldn't really say, ive had acupuncture as pain therapy before and was amazed at how well it worked.


[edit on 11-7-2009 by VitalOverdose]

reply to post by VitalOverdose


Hi Vital,
you are correct in asserting that Nerve strikes are different from Dim mak!
Chi meriadians do not follow the passage of nerves or other vessels within the body, but rather, follow their own paths of electro-magnetic force.
If the concept of Chi were put into modern science terms, t would most probably be called: Electro-magnetic energy.
Chinese Internal Martial styles are probably what you may be interested in.
Systems such as: Ba Guazhang, Hsing-I, and Tai Chi Chuan; are internal styles that use within their regimes, methods to cultivate extraneous chi within the organs.
The concept of Chi has beeen around for thousands of years. The fact of what is stated above (the sciences of Accupuncture, accupressure); operates with the use of meridians which are independant from vessels.
Chi from China, was then developed as Ki in Japan.
Karate, being the 'watered-down' art taught to westerners, does not readily teach students these concepts (probably only at the hghest levels).
There have been many discourses written by Dr. Yang, Jwing-Ming on these three arts and their applications.
And I ussure you that Chi strikes are a real thing; the power of which is expressed in the concept of:Jin.
There are other methods and uses for the cultivation of Chi; and indeed there are applications for Chi cultivation for a purely martil purpose.

Kiai Master vs MMA Fighter One of the funniest and most viewed vids on youtube


[edit on 11-7-2009 by postmeme]

reply to post by postmeme


Dont get 'ring' sports confussed with killing arts!
Remember: even in these 'No holds barred' contests there are still no eye-gouging, no throat strikes, and no groin strikes.

I've practised chi gung on and off for quite some time now, and I'm pretty comfortable with asserting that chi is real. I really liked the video of the chi gung master posted earlier in the thread.

The mistake people make is thinking that chi will turn up somewhere on the EM spectrum. It's also true that whenever Western scientists stumble on to effects that might have to do with chi, they are attacked by their peers. The most egregious case is Wilhelm Reich, who named what he discovered orgone energy. He invented a device to trap free-flowing orgone called the orgone accumulator, and the simplest, most direct physical proof of its existence is known as the tO - t experiment.

This consists of an orgone accumulator and a control box of identical size and thermal properties. You monitor the temperature in each, and you invariably find that tO (the temperature in the orgone accumulator) is higher than the control box temperature t. This is because as the orgone is trapped in the accumulator, its kinetic energy component is converted into heat.

The experiment has been replicated countless times. And ignored by mainstream science.

My own personal experiences completely bear out the reality of chi.

I've done a chi gung retreat for a week with Bruce Frantzis. He's pretty well-known in the martial arts world and is the only Westerner ever to become a lineage holder in Taoist martial arts. A vital component of his teaching is personal transmission, which I've experienced for myself, and I can tell you it had nothing to do with suggestion.

One example: Bruce was transmitting the energies of the spine. This felt significantly different from any of his other transmissions, and was unmistakable. I felt as though a metal rod was extending from my occiput down the inside of my spinal cord. I wasn't told what I was going to feel. It was only years later that I found out that the element (in 5 element chi gung) associated with the brain and spine is... metal.

I also found during meditation that I was gradually able to feel, and then dissolve, chi blockages, which improved my health. Sadly, the discipline of practising every day is something I've since backslid on, but I'm absolutely certain that chi is "real", in the sense that, if you do the exercises, you get unmistakable results. Lack of Western scientific validation is to do with a blinkered attitude on the part of the West rather than there being nothing there.

Chi is the same as orgone energy, and for me it definitely exists. From my experience it is linked to sexual energies(i.e life energy).

Connected to the will of a person, it helps all great sports people, whether you like it or not.

Like some people have more empathy, while most do not. Or many other things, where there are people with all sorts of talents, that most do not have, just because the majority do not feel it or know it, does not mean it is not real.

reply to post by rich23

Bruce was transmitting the energies of the spine. This felt significantly different from any of his other transmissions, and was unmistakable.

Ive seen Bruce do some very impressive stuff myself when i was learning Wing Chun. But im pretty convinced some of what he does is part trickery and part hypnosis suggestion.

How much did you have to pay to pay for this week away if you don't mind me asking?

that video where the mma fighter takes him down is stupid. Reason being is because there was probably TONS of rules and the older guy probably couldnt even use all his fighting techniques.

In the real world anyone who practices what I call "pure martial arts" would take down ANY mma fighter in a second. Matter of fact I've seen it myself many times.

I donno, I just have a big problem with all these mma dudes and I hate the people who watch it, they all think they are tough guys when really they aren't crap.

All the people I know who are fans of mma or are into mma where the nerds that got made fun of in highschool and now they are all into this mma thing cause it makes them feel "tough". Its so obvious. If you don't believe me just look at all the videos of these wannabe fighters on youtube, they are ALL DORKS.

That crap isnt real martial arts.

Its the same thing as wrestling in the 80s and 90s... just some dumb fad and I hope it goes away soon.

Atleast wwf was entertaining lol.



[edit on 11-7-2009 by jeasahtheseer]

[edit on 11-7-2009 by jeasahtheseer]

Originally posted by jeasahtheseer
that video where the mma fighter takes him down is stupid. Reason being is because there was probably TONS of rules and the older guy probably couldnt even use all his fighting techniques.

In the real world anyone who practices what I call "pure martial arts" would take down ANY mma fighter in a second. Matter of fact I've seen it myself many times.

I donno, I just have a big problem with all these mma dudes and I hate the people who watch it, they all think they are tough guys when really they aren't crap.

All the people I know who are fans of mma or are into mma where the nerds that got made fun of in highschool and now they are all into this mma thing cause it makes them feel "tough". Its so obvious. If you don't believe me just look at all the videos of these wannabe fighters on youtube, they are ALL DORKS.

That crap isnt real martial arts.

It was the older guy who put the challenge out so id guess they were fighting to his rules. I think he lost half a million yen.

The younger guy wasn't using some kind of MMA freestyle it looked like Karate or taekwondo. They were made to break the instant the old guy went down.

reply to post by VitalOverdose


Chi can certainly be used for martial applications as well as healing.
Ask any chinese medical therapist wether Chi exists.
The science of Accupuncture/Accupressure could not exist without the acknowledgement that there are Chi channels or meridians throughout the body.
Herbal medicine operates with the proviso that certain herbs can either exite or calm Chi flow throughout these meridians; different herbs for different application.
The ancient Indian medical system of Ayeverda also uses similar concepts.
These systems of medicine are thouands of years old, very detailed and effective.

Wait did someone here put down Bruce Lee... Okay ill ignore that for now....

Anyways... As for the realities of Qi i think that most followers of this are way to devout to be showing off, and actually its mostly frowned upon, because vanity brings negative energy. But i would like to see someone who is able to fully us it as a real force.

If it turns out it is not true, then the world losses a possible blessing.
Imagine how wars would be fought in the futur....

Originally posted by VitalOverdose
reply to post by rich23

 

Ive seen Bruce do some very impressive stuff myself when i was learning Wing Chun. But im pretty convinced some of what he does is part trickery and part hypnosis suggestion.

Ok. I've seen Derren Brown (it's on YouTube somewhere but I can't be bothered to find it now) knock someone over with a non-contact punch. He says what he does is all trickery. I'm not sure he knows where trickery ends and actual chi manipulaton begins.

And hypnosis... again, we have no science of consciousness in the West. Hypnosis, the placebo effect, psychosomatic: these are all terms to do with mind-body interaction that we bandy about, but they explain away, they don't really offer any understanding when you look at them closely.

Remeber, I didn't find out that the brain and spine element in chi gung is metal until much later, probably about 2006 IIRC. That rules out suggestion as far as I'm concerned.

Frankly, I'm surprised you think Bruce would resort to trickery.

How much did you have to pay to pay for this week away if you don't mind me asking?

It was in 2000 and it was probably around 900 bucks, for which I got full board, a shared room, and two instructors apart from Bruce who were constantly checking my alignments and massaging me. It was an absolutely superb experience I'd recommend to anyone, and I think it was damn good value.

Ok, I'm just going to tell you the thing that made me absolutely certain that chi exists, but if you've seen the chi gung master video and still don't think it can be real, then you probably won't believe me. Nonetheless, this happened, take it or leave it.

I used to work as a musician on cruise ships and would often find a shady spot on a beach or in a park to practice Wu form and standing chi gung. One night I wound up back in the DJ's cabin and he and his cabin mate asked me what all that was about. I'd just opened my mouth to explain when Steve, (the cabin mate and one of the entertainment cast) jumped up and said, "I'll show you your third eye!" and came over and pushed his thumb rather hard into the centre of my forehead. He pulled it away and said, "can you feel that?" By this time I'd managed to be able to feel my upper tantien a bit, and this clearly was just a physical sensation, so I made basically non-commital noises.

We were all pretty drunk at this point.

Darren (the DJ) was lying on the top bunk and so I said, ok, I'm going to try something. I have absolutely no idea what, if anything, will happen. It might be nothing. I then assumed the correct standing posture and extended my right arm so that my index fingertip was touching Darren's forehead in the same place Steve had tried to affect. I tried to open my shoulder, elbow and writst joints and then I just closed my eyes and relaxed.

I stood for probably 60 to 90 seconds (maybe less, I don't know) but then something very odd happened. I felt what I can only describe as a weird squirting sensation in two distinct places: the centre of the first joint of that finger, and the centre of the fingertip bone about 3 or 4 mm beneath the skin. It was kind of like the sensation of flow you get when you're having a wee, but very brief.

Now I'm absolutely certain that I made no external move when that happened. But Darren did. He jerked his head back and said, "****ing hell!" Steve and I tried to get him to say what had happened, but we actually don't really have words for this stuff in the West. All he could say was, "it felt like the back of my head came off".

No, I couldn't reproduce it, and I wouldn't try, particularly in view of the fact that Bruce maintains that you shouldn't try dissolving exercises within your brain unless under the close supervision of a really qualified master.

At this point, I'd been practising chi gung and t'ai chi because I'd seen what had happened to a close friend who'd really got into it, and had really reaped benefits from it. I'd, up until then, been scrupulously agnostic. I'd done a chi gung course with my instructor in Brighton and he'd been transmitting during that, but the sensations I'd had were kind of on the edge of perception and hadn't been enough to bring me off the fence.

This experience forced me to re-evaluate, well, everything. I knew what I'd felt: I knew I'd given no external cue: and I knew that Darren had reacted to something that had started inside my body.

My advice is find a good instructor and start doing chi gung for a few years. You'll have some sort of experience that will bring you off the fence sooner or later, I would think.

[edit on 11-7-2009 by rich23]

Originally posted by KingAtlas
Wait did someone here put down Bruce Lee... Okay ill ignore that for now....

Not every "Bruce" in martial arts is Bruce Lee. Please keep up.