Originally posted by DeepCoverUK

I did not specifically jump you, there has been a lot of bigotry and ignorance in this thread, I guess that you just assumed that it was aimed at you because you consider yourself guilty?

well then, I apologize to you. I must be losing my edge. My 3rd apology of the day.

My original comments about baiting were regarding the person who incited your tirade of abuse against the French.

That individual probably shouldn't hold their breath waiting for my 4th apology of the day.

Despite your low opinion of France, it is a powerful country with a lot of influence, especially within the EU, just look at the subsidies their farmers get for example.

I don't see the connection between farming subsidies and "power". It could be because I'm tired. It's 4 am here. Farming subsidies here generally mean the government is paying a farmer NOT to produce, thus manufacturing a shortage.

Their substandard military is just as capable of turning Iran into a nuclear wasteland as the US, not that anyone would want that.

I dunno. It really wouldn't bother me. Probably wouldn't bother the Pakistanis either, or any one of several other Middle eastern countries where the Iranians are poking about, creating ill will. A bit drastic, though. Should be able to zap the mad mullahs without inconveniencing the general populace.

How exactly is our other great friend, the US helping out?

I think I asked the same question in an earlier post. Chalk it up to our boneheaded politicians mentioned above. I've fought beside British expats before, and I'd do it again in a heartbeat if I still could. Nothing wrong with them. But then again, they may have been 'expats' because they didn't share the same attitudes I get from some few Brits here on ATS at times. Not to generalize, as there are some Brits here I get along with rather well, and a couple I'd call friends.

Looks like Britain may be getting a dose of the "change we can believe in" that we've been putting up with since the end of January.

Originally posted by audas

Originally posted by logicalview

Originally posted by Mdv2

Not to speak of the millions of Americans and Brits whom portrayed the French and Germans as foolish cowards.

Really! Care to show us where that information came from?

The US repeatedly called for "French Fries" to be changed to freedom fries - and there are plenty of references of Senior US politicians making direct and disparaging remarks against the French - thats why the French are so arrogant at the current humiliating US withdrawal - how embarrassing for the US - just waiting for Afghanistan and Pakistan - that will make it a hat trick of failures - US - cowards who cant fight.

I think s/he was asking for the proof that the British were calling French and German as "foolish cowards", when the vast majority - and I really am talking close to the full 100% of the population of the UK here - all were against going to war in Iraq. They knew it was an unjust war and an illegal war. That Iraq had nothing to do with terrorism and that we should not be killing innocent Iraqis and we should not be sending our children to a forign country to be killed!

The British people sided with the French and German and all said that those two countries were completely right by not sending troops and that the Brits should be following their lead.

I know that Brits HATE the American mentality of calling the French cowards, because British people have a hell of a lot of experience with the French at war and we know that the French have one of the best militaries the World has ever known! That the French have a long history of amazing military victories and the Brits give the French much respect for that!

Neither does Britain accuse the French of being cowardly in WWII as it is known that they did all they can to fight them back but unfortunately the Maginot line was their downfall.
British people are also full of respect for the way the majority of the non-Vichy French acted during German occupation too and we think of the French Resistance as some of the bravest and most important fighters during the whole of WWII!!

No, Britain knows about French military honour and we have all the respect in the World for them.
It is Americans who have been calling them "cheese eating surrender monkeys" and that whole, completely obnoxious "freedom fries" debacle. It is sickening and just shows that they have no idea at all about the history of France!

France has won more wars against huge opposition than America could ever imagine!

I have seen some young Brits using that "cheese eating surrender monkey" thing and making jokes about French military but that is simply because they are drenched in American media and being young, they don't question it, they just accept it as truth, which is very sad, BUT, they are kids and they will grow up and learn, like all Britons do, of our wars against the French, the times when we won and the many times the French won. They will learn about all the amazing military victories the French had all over the World and they will soon realise that they were wrong and they will then question American propaganda (at worst), or American pomposity, ignorance and arrogance (at best).

Believe me, no one old enough to know in Britain thinks the French (or the Germans) are cowards. We know far too well what France is capable of!


Vive la Resistance!

Originally posted by nenothtu


That illustrates their value as "allies" to the Brits. As an old American saying goes, "with friends like that, who needs enemies?" The last time the French were a serious threat OR viable ally in a war was in Napoleon's day. Waterloo? Wellington? I don't think the Brits really seriously expected any French "help".

[edit on 2009/7/3 by nenothtu]

So, what was the country who were pretending to be France in WWI? Y'know, that country that fought all the way through, from start to end, instead of fighting for the 4 months that America did?

You know that WWI wouldn't have been won if it weren't for the French?

I know you Americans like to believe you won WWII, when in fact, although WWII couldn't have been won without you, it also couldn't have been won without the UK or without Russia and it certainly couldn't have been won without the real bravest of the brave, the French Resistance!

Also, you say they haven't been a viable alley since Waterloo. Well, they were pretty bloody impressive around that time, weren't they? They certainly were a greater military force than the USA could ever hope to be. It was also only around half a century after they "saved your ass" (as Americans like to say) in your war of independence. I always hear Americans tell Europeans how they should thank you for "saving your ass" in WWII but I have never, ever once heard an American thank France for winning the American War of Independence for you (although, I have never actually heard a French person feel like they need to be thanked)!


EDIT:

Originally posted by nenothtu

As an old American saying goes, "with friends like that, who needs enemies?"

Psst... Shssh! Don't tell anyone but that's actually a British saying, it was just acquired by Americans.



[edit on 4-7-2009 by triplesod]

Originally posted by SLAYER69
It just seemed a bit hypocritical to me to hear that type of rhetoric from a Frenchmen.

To be fair mate, we don't know that s/he was French. S/he doesn't have anywhere down as their location and the way they were phrasing what they said about France, it sounded to me that there was some distance there, as though they were speaking for the French, instead of as the French.

If you see what I mean I haven't phrased this very well myself, have I?

Anyway, the point is, don't presume that the person you are upset with is French and even if they are, that doesn't mean that their opinion is that of every or even any other French person.

P.s. Glad to hear your lad got back home safe and sound! Whatever anyone thinks of this war, your lad and his colleagues from around the World deserve the utmost respect! You must be very proud.

[edit on 4-7-2009 by triplesod]

FIRSTLY.
I apologise to everyone in this thread for so many long winded posts on this page. If I have to say anything else, I will edit it into one of these posts.

Originally posted by nenothtu


That being the case, Europeans shouldn't have a problem with the US pulling our armed forces out. Force is the sole purpose of armed forces, so obviously Europe doesn't need ours anymore. They've evolved beyond that. Everybody wins.

Definitely not. I don't think you'll find one European who wants American troops to remain in Europe. Why do you think they would? Do you think your troops are in Europe for the benefit of Europeans? They are not needed there and they are there only for their own benefit and for their modern ways of colonialism.

Certainly take them back but I doubt very much that the USA wants them back

Originally posted by nenothtu
After the French display of "friendship" towards the US, I'd say our time is past.

Oh give over!

"some French people said something bad about my great country! I was going to write a letter to my President, telling him to break all ties with France and to no longer consider them an ally but I have just realised that I have used all the paper in the house to dry my eyes, wah!!"


EDIT: I have just read on in the thread a bit and seen a few more of your posts. I have decided not to bother replying to them, not only because I am making a mess of this thread and I don't want me stupid posts all over the place.
I do just want to make one more comment though. This regarding your outrageous hypocrisy.

I honestly find it stunning that in every one of your posts about the French you have called them "arrogant". I didn't pick up on it at first because I know that most people who know very little of the French use the catch all cliche, that over used phrase that is safe to use at it never requires any further explanation, never mind that it is missused or used under presumption, or just because the person has just heard other people say the same.
The point is (before I drive everyone mad with my long windedness again), I sincerely suggest that you never, ever use that word in reference of another person or group of people, ever again because every single sentence you have uttered simply squirms with arrogance. A mix of obnoxiousness, self rightiousness and smugness, brewed up to make a particularly ugly (I was going to say American but that would be completely unfair as I know how wonderful American people generally are, unfortunately, America's obnoxious folk should louder than other countries obnoxious folk) arrogance!

You truly are one of the most arrogant posters I have seen on this site. Quoting your own nonsense, meaningless, faux-philosophical and pseudo-intellectual word-wrongs as your signature should be warning enough of that but I'm sure, even those who have noticed your sig will be staggered by the sheer obnoxiousness, smugness and arrogance in your posts in this thread.

I wonder if you really can't see that...

[edit on 4-7-2009 by triplesod]

[edit on 4-7-2009 by triplesod]

Originally posted by triplesod

Originally posted by nenothtu


That being the case, Europeans shouldn't have a problem with the US pulling our armed forces out. Force is the sole purpose of armed forces, so obviously Europe doesn't need ours anymore. They've evolved beyond that. Everybody wins.

Definitely not. I don't think you'll find one European who wants American troops to remain in Europe. Why do you think they would? Do you think your troops are in Europe for the benefit of Europeans? They are not needed there and they are there only for their own benefit and for their modern ways of colonialism.

Certainly take them back but I doubt very much that the USA wants them back

Well, at least ONE thing we agree on, then! It's a start, I reckon. On the subject of our "modern ways of colonialism", being British, I'd think you would have a firmer grasp on what "colonialism" is. The US hasn't got any colonies in Europe. Calling a military base a "colony" is like calling a dog a cat. It's a complete non-sequitur. They have entirely different functions.

You're probably right that the US GOVERNMENT doesn't want the troops stationed overseas back here. It could prove a very uncomfortable situation for them, considering the foolishness afoot in DC. There is a hugely growing dissatisfaction here with what the Progressives and Neocons have wrought (and are continuing to wreak), and it's being actively suppressed. This could get ugly.

Originally posted by nenothtu
After the French display of "friendship" towards the US, I'd say our time is past.

Oh give over!

"some French people said something bad about my great country! I was going to write a letter to my President, telling him to break all ties with France and to no longer consider them an ally but I have just realised that I have used all the paper in the house to dry my eyes, wah!!"

It's got nothing to do with what some French people SAID. It's got everything to do with what France DID, vis-a-vis their lackluster performance as alleged "allies".

The remainder of the quote, concerning the "letter to the president" et al, is nothing more than whiney drivel on your part. It's a ridiculous personal attack, off topic and off point.

When you don't have a valid point, throw up a smokescreen, eh?

I honestly find it stunning that in every one of your posts about the French you have called them "arrogant". I didn't pick up on it at first because I know that most people who know very little of the French use the catch all cliche, that over used phrase that is safe to use at it never requires any further explanation, never mind that it is missused or used under presumption, or just because the person has just heard other people say the same.
The point is (before I drive everyone mad with my long windedness again), I sincerely suggest that you never, ever use that word in reference of another person or group of people, ever again because every single sentence you have uttered simply squirms with arrogance. A mix of obnoxiousness, self rightiousness and smugness, brewed up to make a particularly ugly (I was going to say American but that would be completely unfair as I know how wonderful American people generally are, unfortunately, America's obnoxious folk should louder than other countries obnoxious folk) arrogance!

You truly are one of the most arrogant posters I have seen on this site. Quoting your own nonsense, meaningless, faux-philosophical and pseudo-intellectual word-wrongs as your signature should be warning enough of that but I'm sure, even those who have noticed your sig will be staggered by the sheer obnoxiousness, smugness and arrogance in your posts in this thread.

I wonder if you really can't see that...

I guess that means that you don't like me.

It's only hypocritical if I deny that I'm arrogant, and I've made no such denial. I've said before, and will say it again for your benefit, that I am, and will continue to be, as arrogant, obnoxious, and generally disagreeable as I need to be to have my points heard. I will ever and always attempt to give as good as I get, for good or for ill. When it becomes unnecessary, I stop doing that, which is part and parcel of giving as good as one gets.

So feel free to heap whatever epithets, labels and attempted insults on me you like. In the long run, that matters nary a whit, because I AM an American, and we've gotten used to that sort of thing.

None of the above changes the validity of the statement that the French are arrogant too.




[edit on 2009/7/5 by nenothtu]