The MASON Checkered Black & White Floor... What does it mean?

Originally posted by thelonious2
Anybody can apply to a lodge and take the degrees, and then go to a meeting every month and listen to old guys complain about raising dues and buying coffee filters from Sam's instead of Costco. But that doesn't mean that such masons know anything about masonry.

Please don't take this wrong, but you as self described seem to have little to no idea what it means to be a mason. I know, you served in lots of committees and did lots of grand lodge stuff, but somehow, all of that blinded you to the basics that brought us all to the fraternity in the first place. Brotherly love, charity, commitment, family.

If I never went to another meeting, but actively searched for new brothers to meet and learn from, I would feel as if I was still just as much of a mason. It's about the action part, not the talking part.

The more I hear from you, I cannot help but think, you get out what you put in, but you had no idea what you wanted to get. Again, none of that is meant derogatory, it's just my opinion based on what you have said.

Originally posted by FreedomEntered
Freemasons dont know the real meaning in Freemasonary - only what they are told and until they go through all the degrees they really dont know the hidden meanings.

This is fact

And yet, somehow YOU do know the real meaning. And you came by this knowledge from where, precicely?

And please don't tell me it's from illuminatinews or masonwatch, or those lying nutjobs like Icke, Shoenbelen, or Alex Jones. Those people are the clueleass ones, who jump to some pretty wild conclusions based on lies, misinterpretations, and mistransations.

Don't try to present "everybody knows...", conjecture or hearsay as evidence - give me proof that comes from a reliable source; real, entire documents, unaltered photographs - things that would be admissable in court, and cite the sources. But you won't be able to provide and real evidence, because it's untrue.

What you have said is NOT a fact; it's a lie that's been perpetuated by the paranoid since the beginning.

why dont you 2 guys get a room you know you want to

Originally posted by thelonious2

I was a mason for probably longer than you've been alive. My articles were published in the New Age magazine (now called "Scottish Rite Journal"), Philalethes magazine, and numerous other masonic periodicals. I served in my state's Grand Lodge, Grand Chapter, Grand Council, and Grand Commandery. I served as a regional officer for the York Rite Sovereign College of North America, and sat on national committees in masonic bodies that you probably have never even heard of.

So I challenge you to show me one single thing I've written here that shows something I've "misread", "misinterpreted", or something a fallacious nature. I know very well what I'm talking about.

edit on 13-5-2013 by thelonious2 because: (no reason given)

And just how old am I, Oh Great and All-Knowing One?

How long you've been involved with the Grand Lodge means nothing. The number of times you've been published means nothing. The fact remains that your assessment of Pikes work is out of context.

reply to post by IslandMason


Um Alex Jones has even said that Freemasons are mostly innocent and that his own family member was a freemason.

So dont try and pin this on every conpiracy theorist out there firstly.

And secondly , you only know what your told the meanings are . And unless you are at the top you know sod all about the true meaning of freemasonary so, dont pretend that u do.

Hence why there are degrees.

Originally posted by billdadobbie
why dont you 2 guys get a room

you know you want to

Why don't you contribute something useful?

Originally posted by FreedomEntered
reply to post by IslandMason

 

Um Alex Jones has even said that Freemasons are mostly innocent and that his own family member was a freemason.

So dont try and pin this on every conpiracy theorist out there firstly.

And secondly , you only know what your told the meanings are . And unless you are at the top you know sod all about the true meaning of freemasonary so, dont pretend that u do.

Hence why there are degrees.

And what degree have YOU attained? None? So you then know less than sod all. As such, you should maybe defer to those who DO know - those who are involved, especially the 32s here (you know, the ones who have done all of the degrees).

reply to post by FreedomEntered


Who has more power in masonry, a 3rd degree mason or a 14th degree mason?

using black and white flagstones is a simple little building trick, using high contrasting colours make the spaces appear bigger especially in larger spaces like cathedral main halls then going down in scale with more complex patterns and colours in smaller more personal rooms like chapels etc,
but specific colours and patterns can are used in these smaller/personal space depending on sect, family/heraldic designs or fashions of that era

Originally posted by IslandMason

Originally posted by billdadobbie
why dont you 2 guys get a room

you know you want to

Why don't you contribute something useful?

i know nothing about angels or demons and will be keeping it that way .i am on the planet for a good time not a long one if you cannot laugh then dont cry

Originally posted by network dude

Please don't take this wrong, but you as self described seem to have little to no idea what it means to be a mason. I know, you served in lots of committees and did lots of grand lodge stuff, but somehow, all of that blinded you to the basics that brought us all to the fraternity in the first place. Brotherly love, charity, commitment, family.

If I never went to another meeting, but actively searched for new brothers to meet and learn from, I would feel as if I was still just as much of a mason. It's about the action part, not the talking part.

The more I hear from you, I cannot help but think, you get out what you put in, but you had no idea what you wanted to get. Again, none of that is meant derogatory, it's just my opinion based on what you have said.

I have no doubt that you're a nice guy, and you're probably an honest one as well. But I'm certainly not the only the person who eventually woke up and left the masons. And if you're a nice and honest guy, you will too, at least eventually.

The time will come when you will be so disgusted by the hypocrisy that you'll never want to see the inside of a lodge room again. And when that time comes, you'll know that you're not alone. Regardless of how hard it seems to sever the connection, many have done it before, and many will do it again.

In the meantime, ask yourself this: if masonry is really about "making good men better", why did the grand lodges do nothing when the masons in the Shrine's Royal Order of Jesters were exposed as participating in human trafficking and child prostitution?

I know that YOU weren't involved, and none of the other masons on this site were involved either. But the grand lodges did their best to cover it up and sweep it under the rug. Bad for PR.

This is the type of brotherhood you're in, and the one you're defending. I realize that you have high ideals of it. So did I. But those ideals are fictions. The real masonic fraternity is the one where its wealthier and more influential members are criminals, sexually assaulting minors and engaging in human slavery, while the good ole boy faction in the grand lodges ignore it.

And no, this was not an isolated circumstance. I was never a Jester personally, but knew quite a few who left when they saw what it was. Men i respected and admired who left masonry completely because the grand line officers are Jesters too, and will do what it takes to cover it up.

So when you say that freemasonry is about brotherly love, commitment, charity, and family, I can respect that these are your ideals, but I can also assure you that that such belief is a bit naive. Somewhere you already know that. Somewhere in our minds we all know that if we're interested in beginning careers promoting family, charity, and love, then swearing blood oaths is not the way to begin it. And once we learn what fremasonry is really about, and what is really going on, then we are cowards if we remain there out of comfort, and if we keep our mouths closed about it.

Originally posted by thelonious2
That's true, but it goes much deeper than that. Pike also believed that freemasonry continued the lineage of the Magi, which was what he was talking about there.

They both show that Pike was mistaken as there was no purposeful misleading by the Blue Lodge and that the Scottish Rite was not the guardians of some hidden knowledge that Pike, in his scholarly endeavors, discovered.

Pike is rather irrelevant in much of modern Masonry and many Masons, Scottish Rite included, do not even know who he is.

reply to post by IslandMason


None of your business I might be like other people who have commented here and left the Freemasonary. I may feel strongly from personal experience. But then again....

Of course you know what freemasonary is all about because you are " in it" well I have news for you most people in cults and religions dont know what they are " really" about.

You are only knowing what you are told by those higher up than yourself.

reply to post by thelonious2


Yep, you did great to get out of Freemasonary

Originally posted by thelonious2
...then swearing blood oaths is not the way to begin it.

If you were a Mason for as long as you said then this is a rather disengenious tact to take since you would know they are symbolic.

Just curious, did 'finding Jesus' have anything to do with your leaving?

Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus


If you were a Mason for as long as you said then this is a rather disengenious tact to take since you would know they are symbolic.

Just curious, did 'finding Jesus' have anything to do with your leaving?

Let's just say that I had been aware for a while of various wrongdoings. Accounting fraud in the Shrine, grand lodge politics, and so on. The straw that broke the camel's back was the attempted cover up and whitewashing of the human trafficking / child prostitution scandal by all fifty-one US grand lodges.

Now, you say that my comments were disenginious. Yet the fact that they are supposedly "symbolic" is irrelevant. At the very least, they are childish.

But the problem is not necessrily with the absurd penalties, but with the obligations themselves. They make it impossible to be both a good man and a good mason. When the Jester scandal broke, masons everywhere around me were discussing it. A hypothetical question came up: what if a mason told you on the square that he was molesting children?

Obviously, a good man would turn this person in. But if he were a mason, he would be violating his obligation if he turned his brother in for sexually assaulting children. The clause in the obligation excepts murder and treason only (and if both are Royal Arch Masons, there are no exceptions at all). So in order to be a good man, he would have to be a bad mason.

So in order for him to be a good mason, he would have to keep silent. This would make him a coward. So it is impossible for a person to be a good man and a good mason. I always understood the obligation on this point and, like most masons, I dealt with it by simply ignoring it. It had never come up in my personal life.

But with the Jester crisis, in order to be honest with myself and consistent, I had to reconsider. Masonry says it "takes good men and makes them better". But as I just demonstrated, in that case, it is impossible to be both a good man and a good mason at the same time. One has to choose between them. And if someone picked being a good mason over a good man, then quite obviously the organization didn't "take a good man and make him better", it instead took a good man and made him a criminal accessory.

So "finding Jesus" isn't necessary in helping masons wake up and see freemasonry for what it is. All it takes is a little thoughtful analysis and being honest with oneself.

reply to post by thelonious2


You do "truthers" proud exposing the Freemasonary for what it is. That takes guts...

Originally posted by thelonious2
Now, you say that my comments were disenginious. Yet the fact that they are supposedly "symbolic" is irrelevant. At the very least, they are childish.

They are disengenious, and as you claim you were a Mason, then you would know it is explained to the candidates that they are symbolic. You may think them childish but it does not diminish the fact that they are symbolic in nature and nothing comes from breaking them other then the fact that you promised not to do so.

But the problem is not necessrily with the absurd penalties, but with the obligations themselves. They make it impossible to be both a good man and a good mason. When the Jester scandal broke, masons everywhere around me were discussing it. A hypothetical question came up: what if a mason told you on the square that he was molesting children?

I would encourage him to turn himself in immediately and if he did not, as a human being (forget the Masons), I would turn him in.

Obviously, a good man would turn this person in. But if he were a mason, he would be violating his obligation if he turned his brother in for sexually assaulting children. The clause in the obligation excepts murder and treason only (and if both are Royal Arch Masons, there are no exceptions at all). So in order to be a good man, he would have to be a bad mason.

There is no obligation in Masonry that supercedes that of the law of the state in which you reside. As a matter of fact, your are sworn to obey the law. You are absloutely fabricating this.

So Jesus isn't necessary in helping masons wake up and see freemasonry for what it is. All it takes is a little thoughtful analysis and being honest with oneself.

You did not answer my question. Additionally, are you a born again Christian if your answer to my question is 'yes'?

Originally posted by thelonious2
...A hypothetical question came up: what if a mason told you on the square that he was molesting children?

Obviously, a good man would turn this person in. But if he were a mason, he would be violating his obligation if he turned his brother in for sexually assaulting children. The clause in the obligation excepts murder and treason only (and if both are Royal Arch Masons, there are no exceptions at all). So in order to be a good man, he would have to be a bad mason.

Simply wrong. It is not a conflict at all. A good man and good Mason would turn him in. He's doing something criminal, and because of that is NOT to be aided or sheilded by his brethren. It's there in your little black book. And he'd be expelled from the lodge.

I submit then, that you either didn't pay attention, or you were never a Mason.

Originally posted by FreedomEntered
reply to post by IslandMason

 

None of your business I might be like other people who have commented here and left the Freemasonary. I may feel strongly from personal experience. But then again....

Of course you know what freemasonary is all about because you are " in it" well I have news for you most people in cults and religions dont know what they are " really" about.

You are only knowing what you are told by those higher up than yourself.

Maybe you are a former mason, but would you care to tell us the name of the lodge you supposedly attended so we can verify your story? No? Didn't think so.

I have news for you. If people who are "in it" know nothing, people who are not know even less. How do YOU know? I know: you've been getting your information from Illuminatinews and those other morons.

I say again: show us verifiable proof. If you can't, then your whole argument is worthless.