Air France Plane down

Originally posted by rikgrimsby
is there still no news on how it happeneed and if they have found the plane?

No news yet.

Although, I feel like Air France or whoever knows more than they are sharing...they seemed to 'lose all hope' wayyyy too quickly.

This is just a theory:-

Possibly when the avionics were repaired in March, the problem was not completely eliminated and a loose wire either finally became dislodged during heavy turbulence or another part of the circuit finally overloaded.

[edit on 1-6-2009 by blackhatchet]

reply to post by markymrk720


In all reality...once the estimated time that they would have run out of fuel expires and there has been no communication, chances are that the aircraft is lost and seeing how they were at altitude, not a very survivable situation.

reply to post by Ivar_Karlsen


Thanks, Ivar.

I don't know much about Airbuses. (I'm typed on the DC-9, B737 and B757/767)

Flew, as mentioned, many moons ago right-seat on the A-300...which was really a poor imitation of a DC-10....just missing the third engine?? AND, had the weird AIRBUS designations for the hydraulics...."YELLOW, BLUE and GREEN"??? Why not just one, two, three??? Or, "LEFT, RIGHT, CENTER"?

Well....obviously I am more of a Boeing fan.

Did not know about the APU auto-start....not even on the B777. Guess I'm an old "hands-on" type.....I like automation, as long as it doesn't intrude too much. Meaning, sometimes we just want to turn the dern things off!!!

That's why we have checklists....right? And QRHs....for to deal with the situations....well, showing my age.

Back to this story....what happened??? HOW could an experienced crew, on a modern jet, allow this to happen??

There is sure to be a major story, here. I just hope people take time to ALWAYS remember the victims. Accident investigations are conducted to prevent future tragedies, by attempting to understand what happened, and to correct whatever problem or issue is discovered, in order to prevent furthur accidents.

You have to remember they have to protect consumer confidence, so they will not tell you all the truths.

Some professional on safety and airlines was talking to CNN and he said its nearly impossible for this plane to come down due to electric failure or a lightning strike..

CNN also said that this is a new airline and it had airplane technicians on board.

this is at CNN.com just watch the video

This plane is big they have to find it ! WHERE IS NASA WITH THERE SATELLITES ??? i know they can pane threw the ocean much quicker then rescue helicopters.

This is really weird, it should not take this long to confirm the airbus last location, i mean virtually pinpoint the location and also have a first contact with debris if the plane crashed into the ocean. However search and rescue teams can not fly around at random, so i am still wondering why they can not reveal last known location with a lot more accuracy and speed.

Originally posted by solidshot

An Air France aircraft carrying 215 people has disappeared off the radar in the Atlantic Ocean off Brazil, according to reports. A source at Paris Charles de Gaulle said the Rio de Janeiro-Paris flight went missing at around 0600 GMT.

BBC

Doesn't look good makes you wonder if the recession is having an impact on the maintenance of the aircraft given the numbers of crashes we are seeing lately?

the time, money, and best mechanics, are only used on the planes of the wealthy and powerful... we peons have to know our place. we are cattle herded on planes to make profits for the wealthy, and if several hundred die..oh well.. that's the cost of doing business.

[edit on 1-6-2009 by jimmyx]

reply to post by rami2012


That's exactly what said the french pilot in the article I posted in the previous page, it is really strange, could be a bomb or could be "plane diversion" but still don't know what happened to the plane.

reply to post by reugen


Once you "COAST OUT", as we call it, for extended twin-engine over-water ops (ETOPS)....you fly, depending on the route filed, either a 'random track' or a published track. (Actually, ALL extended over-water ops, regardless of airplane, fly similar routes. I was just using the A-330 as example....) RIO to CDG, am guessing a random route, although I could be wrong.

Anyway, once on route....and off RADAR....the separation standards are 1,000 feet vertically (If the airplane is certified, otherwise it's 2,000 feet) and ten minutes in trail, if on the same route.

We make position reports, when in non-RADAR coverage.....just as was done BEFORE Radar was invented!!

We have HF radios....since VHF is limited to line-of-sight. Nowadays, most modern jets use SATCOMM.....we simply type in the position report, in the correct format. (Identity, altitude, position, and time....NEXT position and ETA, and then NEXT waypoint.)

Depending on the route, the waypoints can be as far as 60 minutes apart. (We're supposed to contact oceanic ATC at least every 60 minutes, as a minimum).

SO....one hour, at 480 knots....well, the range is not a circle, since the route is known....but, WHERE on the course?? AND, where, in the worst case scenario, would the airplane have gone down, in open ocean.

It is tremendously sad, this accident.....

Originally posted by Unit541
Coincidentally, last night I watched a documentary on the earths magnetic field.

The show described a large area in the Atlantic, off the coast of Brazil to be specific, where the magnetic field is incredibly week. Apparently the week field has catastrophic affects when satellites fly over the area, and parts of the Hubble are even shut down to avoid damage when it passes through.

They went on to explain how as time goes on, and the effects are significant at lower and lower altitudes, that planes could suffer failures, and their passengers even exposed to lethal radiation in this area.

Its called the South Atlantic Anomaly...here are some links.

www.nytimes.com...

en.wikipedia.org...

According to Reuters, this flight had been preceded safely on the same track 30 minutes earlier by a Boeing 747-400 heading to Frankfurt for Lufthansa, citing a source with access to data transmitted from jetliners for the World Meteorological Organisation.

Two hours later an MD-11 cargo plane also flown by Lufthansa passed just south of the same spot on the way to West Africa, the source told Reuters, asking not to be identified.

Neither aircraft reported any anomaly.

"You can't tie it down to lightning with the information we have; for me it's a red herring," said the source, who specialises in aviation weather. Lufthansa declined comment.

reply to post by rusty35


Interesting.....even IF a total electrical failure occured, the VHF raqdio #1 still operates...from standby power, as I've explained.

At FL350, the airplane has a good deal of VHF range for other airplanes. OTHER airplanes could be called. It was late night, so maybe traffic was sparse. STILL< we monitor the emergency frequency.....121.5

There are also air-to-air frequencies to chat on. Whatever happened, happened quickly, it seems......

WHO CARES ABOUT THE ELECTRICAL OUTLET

How hard is it to find a #ing big ass plane in the ocean cmon... it didn't sink like the titanic

They need to find that damn plane this is taking to long with all our technology these days i don't see it being that hard to find this plane isn't there a certain route planes take to get from point a to b ???

this is really pissing me off we are talking bout over 200 people here damn it

Mmm. I've joined the site just to make comment on this, which I've been following your posts since about 3pm BST today when I first heard of the incident.

What seems to be the most intriguing point is the lack of reference to a rescue ship which would be launch - it's been 22.5 hours since they lost contact and it's well within saling distance of the crash zone.

Here's my gut feeling and I apologise if this offends anyone.

This was a hostile act and is being dumbed down so as the UN are not forced to react to it and escalate into conflict. My gut feeling is it has something to do with North Korea as they seem hell bent on forcing the west's hand at the moment. Their premier is allegedly near death and has no love of the free world. I'll let you make your own conclusions. This is only conjecture on my part and a wild one at that but reading a great deal of informed comments it would appear that there are few 'easy' answers.

Positive lightning, huh - you learn something new everyday.

Oh and hello - not the best topic to introduce yourself on but hey you can't always pick these things.

Thoughts to the families and friends. x

Request for satellite interference and aid:

www.ft.com...

Peace...

reply to post by rami2012


With ya....but, calm yourself a bit, OK??

An airplane that is only a couple of hundred feet in size, in an ocean???

Think about it....it isn't likely to be floating, not from what we've been seeing. No, tragically.....magic doesn't happen, when it comes to S&R ops.

I have a feeling some government is up to dirty tricks .... and if it turns out to be the case ill gladly shoot his head off cause this pure bull# so far 20 hours passed and they cant find a #ing airplane unf***ing believable


And what in the heck does north Korea has anything to do with a plane that isn't even remotely close to its country ???? i realize u hate n Korea but cmon you need to make sense before posting over exaggerated comments .

reply to post by weedwhacker


Yes...very quickly and unfortunately that is causing a lot of speculation. As far as not locating any debris yet, the weather could have move the debris all over the place, so their estimated search area could be twice as big.


[edit on 6/1/09 by riotact1]

reply to post by rami2012


I think you're projecting - I don't 'hate' N.Korea.