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Topic started on 23-5-2009 @ 07:47 PM by SLAYER69
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Top US official warns that war in Afghanistan strengthens Taliban in Pakistan
www.telegraph.co.uk
 America's top military official warned that the US offensive in Afghanistan could end up fuelling the conflict in Pakistan by pushing more
Taliban fighters across the border.
Admiral Mike Mullen, the chairman of the US joint chiefs of staff, said the surge of 21,000 additional US troops into Afghanistan had raised the
prospect that Pakistan could face even greater turmoil in the months ahead."They want Afghanistan back," he said. "We can't let them or their al-Qaeda
cohorts have it. We can't permit the return of the very same safe havens from which the attacks on 9/11 were planned an (visit the link for
the full news article)
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reply posted on 23-5-2009 @ 07:47 PM by SLAYER69
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See I believe this confuses a lot of people who think the Taliban control Afghanistan. The proof it seems is in the pudding. Pakistan is in a pretty
nasty knife fight inside a telephone booth right now with the Taliban so to speak. The Taliban have been pushed out of Afghanistan and into Pakistan
by the US and NATO forces. Still there are many who believe the Taliban are about ready to over run Afghanistan.
Now which is it?
Are we pushing them out of Afghanistan or are we about ready to loose?
I guess that all depends on which Conspiracy theorist you believe.
www.telegraph.co.uk
(visit the link for the full news article)
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reply posted on 23-5-2009 @ 08:06 PM by whiteraven
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This war will get ugly.
The truth of the matter is the Taliban have played the game before and do not view the war in the terms that we view and measure war.
Even if we "win" the war we still have decades of " building schools and churches" before we can really win if viewed in the standard SOP of the
Brits and the Yanks.
What the Islamic Clergy are waiting for is for another front to open up and for the US to weaken from this.
If this takes place and we abandon Afghanistan again the Taliban win.
Our boys can win this easy....our Goverment can lose this easy...just like the Fall of Saigon.
I hope I am wrong.
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reply posted on 23-5-2009 @ 08:09 PM by Max_TO
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reply to post by SLAYER69
Great find !
It could also be a matter of them diverting fighters to a region that " they " deem more valid at this time . Also worth noting , there is no
shortage of people in that part of the world that arnt willing to fight U.S interests .
I have been doing some searching as to how much land the Taliban currently controls in Afghanistan and the only thing that I could find was a report
from 2007 . www.telegraph.co.uk...
Seems a bit strange that we don't have anything recent considering " we " are at war over there and can't seem to get any info on how " well "
we are doing .
If the report from 2007 is accurate can we assume that over the last two years we have made such large gains that we have pushed them back into
Pakistan ? I guess its very possible but one would think that the U.S government would have touted such progress as a huge victory , yet the current
actions of those handling the " war " would suggest otherwise .
Once again great find and I am open to the possibility that the report is accurate , however I would very much like to find a recent report on just
how much land is under " our " control in Afghanistan .
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reply posted on 23-5-2009 @ 08:35 PM by SLAYER69
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reply to post by whiteraven
Unlike Vietnam they don't have the support of another super power like the North had from the "USSR" or help from China helping them with weapons
and war material nor do they have triple canopy jungle to hide under. The Soviets took a beating while there from the Mujaheddin because the US was
it's largest supporter also people would be very surprised to find out that China was also a supporter.
Mujaheddin Supporters
United States
Pakistan
Saudi Arabia
Egypt
People's Republic of China
The majority of the Taliban are not Afghans. Nor do they have supporters like the Mujaheddin did while fighting the Soviets.
Soviet:
14,453-15,051 killed
53,753 wounded
417 missing
Compare those figures to these from the US and Coalition losses so far.
Australia 10
Canada 118
Czech 3
Denmark 21
Estonia 3
Finland 1
France 27
Germany 30
Hungary 2
Italy 14
Latvia 3
Lithuania 1
Netherlands 19
Norway 4
Poland 9
Portugal 2
Romania 11
South Korea 1
Spain 25
Sweden 2
UK 160
US 686
Total 1152
[edit on 23-5-2009 by SLAYER69]
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reply posted on 23-5-2009 @ 08:57 PM by ProtoplasmicTraveler
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Afghanistan is a quagmire and the reality is it is nothing more than a war of ideologies.
In the God Father II when Michael Corleone travels to Cuba to make an investment in their casinos and on his way to his hotel sees in essence a
suicide bomber in Fidel’s rebel band take out a couple of Cuban Officers by jumping into their staff car with a live hand grenade, it later caused
Michael to hesitate in committing his investment into the fund other U.S. Gangland Criminal Leaders were contributing to the joint effort. When asked
by the leading member of the consortium why he was hesitating he recounted the story to the man who played an elderly Jewish Crime Syndicate Leader.
Hyman Roth then asked Michael, “What does that tell you, when a man would commit himself to such an act of violence?” Michael replied “That they
could win, men like that are willing to die for their ideals, they don’t even get paid, and Soldiers get paid and won’t fight to that extent”.
Roth knew Michael was right, and simply said “I wouldn’t want it to get around why you pulled out if you pull out”. In other words he admitted
it was a huge gamble but one that was simply worth taking for him, because others were putting up the lion’s share of the money, but he would retain
the lion’s share of the power that the syndication of their joint efforts would garner and entail.
Now if Michael Corleone wouldn’t risk investing a red cent in a place like Afghanistan why on earth are we as a Nation doing something so
foolish?
We aren’t just driving the Taliban across the border, half the time we let them escape across the border so we don’t have to engage them in long
bloody ground battles.
What we are driving in the process, teamed along with our occupation of Iraq and Carte Blanche support for all things Israel to the extent of footing
the bill for all that too often is representing the so called “American Democratic Ideology” to an extent that people who don’t share it, see it
as a very threatening and potentially deadly thing to them, so what we are really driving is terrorist recruitment.
It frankly doesn’t matter how many Bibles and Korans people want to stack on this bonfire it’s been a stupid mess from day one, and our image is
so tarnished in that part of the world we practically do have to kill them all because if we just upped and pulled out tomorrow it would be
generations before the people of the region ever trust us again.
This a real mess.
Darn rebels messing up the Casinos and the swimming pools!
[edit on 23/5/09 by ProtoplasmicTraveler]
[edit on 23/5/09 by ProtoplasmicTraveler]
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reply posted on 23-5-2009 @ 10:51 PM by SLAYER69
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reply to post by Max_TO
US troop buildup in Afghanistan could be a defining moment
About 55,000 NATO troops are in Afghanistan now, about half of whom are Americans. The decision expands the total US force by more than 50
percent.
But even more US troops could be on their way. Adm. Mike Mullen, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, has indicated the Pentagon ultimately may send
30,000 additional troops to Afghanistan in the coming year or so.
"This is the beginning of an almost unending need," says one Pentagon official. Indeed, it is the first prong of a broader effort that will include
nonmilitary efforts in Afghanistan and in neighboring Pakistan, the source of much of the insurgency.
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reply posted on 23-5-2009 @ 11:03 PM by Max_TO
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reply to post by SLAYER69
It is reports such as this that make me wonder just how much land "we " control over there . As per the numbers that you have provided one is lead
to believe that they will be making moves to gain control over the land , hence the influx of troops .
Could this also be linked to a possible future attack against Iran ? Geographically its a great location .
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reply posted on 23-5-2009 @ 11:08 PM by Max_TO
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Ok just found something ....
70% of Afghanistan outside government control: US Thu, Feb 28 2008. 10:44 AM IST
www.livemint.com...
"Washington: The Afghan government under President Hamid Karzai controls just 30% of the country, the top US intelligence official said Wednesday.
Director of National Intelligence Michael McConnell told the Senate Armed Services Commitee that the resurgent Taliban controls 10 to 11% of the
country and Karzai’s governemnt controls 30 to 31%. But more than six years after the US invasion to oust the Taliban and establish a stable central
government, the majority of Afghanistan’s population remains under local tribal control, he said. "
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reply posted on 23-5-2009 @ 11:27 PM by SLAYER69
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reply to post by Max_TO
Contrary to popular belief I don't think so.
There is a bigger game to play.
The new Great Game
Crude oil, once seen as a wealth-creating blessing for mankind, is fast turning into the “devil’s tears”. The struggle to control the
world’s remaining energy reserves increasingly culminates in bloody conflicts and the killing of innocent civilians, with the war in Iraq only being
the latest example.
In The New Great Game, Lutz Kleveman gives us a fearless, insightful and exacting portrait of a new battleground in the violent politics and passion
of oil: Central Asia, known as the "black hole of the earth" for much of the last century. The Caspian Sea contains the world’s largest amount of
untapped oil and gas resources. It is estimated that there might be as much as one hundred billion barrels of crude oil in the former Soviet republics
of Kazakhstan and Azerbaijan alone.
www.youtube.com...
The Great Game.
The Great Game was a term used for the strategic rivalry and conflict between the British Empire and the Russian Empire for supremacy in Central
Asia. The classic Great Game period is generally regarded as running approximately from the Russo-Persian Treaty of 1813 to the Anglo-Russian
Convention of 1907. Following the Bolshevik Revolution of 1917 a second, less intensive phase followed.
[edit on 23-5-2009 by SLAYER69]
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reply posted on 23-5-2009 @ 11:30 PM by SLAYER69
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Originally posted by Max_TO
Ok just found something ....
70% of Afghanistan outside government control: US Thu, Feb 28 2008. 10:44 AM IST
www.livemint.com...
"Washington: The Afghan government under President Hamid Karzai controls just 30% of the country, the top US intelligence official said Wednesday.
Director of National Intelligence Michael McConnell told the Senate Armed Services Commitee that the resurgent Taliban controls 10 to 11% of the
country and Karzai’s governemnt controls 30 to 31%. But more than six years after the US invasion to oust the Taliban and establish a stable central
government, the majority of Afghanistan’s population remains under local tribal control, he said. "
Yes of course almost 70% is controlled and ran by regional chieftains who don't care for the Taliban or the New Government.
They were the ones who helped the US over throw the Taliban in the first place. They remembered when we helped them fight off the Soviets. So they
returned the favor. The problem is that many of our generals and troops dont know that history and end up making new enemies of the ones who helped us
in he first place.
[edit on 23-5-2009 by SLAYER69]
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