The United States Military.

Originally posted by Wehali
The only enemies the USA has now, are the ones they created themselves
by unnecessary, cruel and especially illegal, military actions. If you people
would just stop attacking countries using bogus reasons, you would not be
in this situation where you are hated by the entire world.

Consider some natural catastrophe will happen in North America, do you
think you will receive any foreign help? I don't think so.. everyone will see
to their own affairs and think that you deserve it. You have created so much
hatred through your actions, that your chance of survival as a nation, is
becoming smaller and smaller.

Start promoting a policy of benevolence and peace, before it is too late.

It's hard not to agree with your statement that the United States would be on our own,suffering from some disaster. The U.S. should become a more isolationist body.Tending to our own business and leaving other countries to do the same. Time and time again whenever there has been a disaster anywhere in the world,there are those with their hands out begging for help from the U.S.. When the shoe is on the other foot however,there are a sorry few that would offer help to us.
Why should we envolve ourselves in the muddled affairs of others? What benefit is there to rendering aid to peoples that would show no gratitude or respect,or worse burn our flag in effegy.
The United States needs to withdraw from the business of bolstering other countries. Charity begins at home,see to our needs before we extend a hand of sympathy to other countries.
But there you have it. The United States is in a damned if you do,damned if you don't situation.If we help other countries we are interfearing. If we don't help we are thought of as heartless asses. Please make up your minds!!!!!

You don't need an army,
you need a heart.

I fully back EVERYTHING the USA has done. Anyone who thinks the world will be a better place if the USA removed itself from foreign affairs is straight up delirious. The resentment they feel towards the US is JEALOUSY, whether they realize it or not.

Peace isn't the path for progress and new technological advances. Peace brings happiness, and happiness brings passiveness. Competition and the desire to be the best brings advancement. Fact it, some people/countries just won't cut it. Ruthless, but extremely practical.

With that out of the way, I do agree that for the immeditate future, the USA should fall back, regroup, and get stronger. But in NO WAY should this be a permanent thing.

Originally posted by jjkenobi
I really hate to go the isolationist route but lately the idea of pulling everyone back inside our country and putting them on the borders and cutting off all the ridiculous aid we are sending out is growing on me.

The U.S. has it's OWN problems let's leave the rest of the world to it's own problems and genocides and protect our own citizens and spend our aid money here on our starving jobless people.

Even though it pulls at my heart when I see other nations people being stomped on and starved out I must agree that this should be a focus for the short time. We should completely withdraw and fortify. Focus all of the trillions going overseas to feed and arm our wars on the homeland itself. At least for a few years.

Yeah, I know, many will say that it will allow for 'terrorists' to get out of hand. Well, aren't terrorists out of hand now? I mean, every time I read a news release I see that a new form of 'terrorist' is developed by our intelligent politicians. Hell, we have so many terrorists living among us now we SHOULD pull our troops back home. I mean, as far as the government is concerned, if you are far left or far right or someone who likes what Ron Paul says or someone who carries their wealth around in cash you are a TERRORIST!

It's getting out of hand and the only people truly profitting off of this are the ones in the arms dealing business. Oh, and the ones LENDING THE MONEY TO THE WARRING NATION.

reply to post by f4rwest


My point exactly. You kind of touched on some finer details that I left out. We SHOULD be involved in the world and its affairs. I just feel that right now the focus should be on restructure and restabilization. Come home and focus the money here for a few years. Keep a pulse on the happenings in the world but simply come home.

Edit to add: well, not exactly my point. I don't believe that I think that EVERYTHING the U.S. has done is right. Or even legal.

[edit on 14-4-2009 by dariousg]

Originally posted by f4rwest


With that out of the way, I do agree that for the immeditate future, the USA should fall back, regroup, and get stronger. But in NO WAY should this be a permanent thing.

Exactly I feel that because of the misjudgments of our government that it has put the US military into a steep dive we need to pull up and back off.

Originally posted by dariousg

Yeah, I know, many will say that it will allow for 'terrorists' to get out of hand. Well, aren't terrorists out of hand now? I mean, every time I read a news release I see that a new form of 'terrorist' is developed by our intelligent politicians. Hell, we have so many terrorists living among us now we SHOULD pull our troops back home. I mean, as far as the government is concerned, if you are far left or far right or someone who likes what Ron Paul says or someone who carries their wealth around in cash you are a TERRORIST!

Oh But remember everything is a "CIA/American" plot. So there will be those who see it as nothing more than that.

Originally posted by f4rwest
I fully back EVERYTHING the USA has done. Anyone who thinks the world will be a better place if the USA removed itself from foreign affairs is straight up delirious. The resentment they feel towards the US is JEALOUSY, whether they realize it or not.

Peace isn't the path for progress and new technological advances. Peace brings happiness, and happiness brings passiveness. Competition and the desire to be the best brings advancement. Fact it, some people/countries just won't cut it. Ruthless, but extremely practical.

With that out of the way, I do agree that for the immeditate future, the USA should fall back, regroup, and get stronger. But in NO WAY should this be a permanent thing.

Haha spoken like a true kool aid drinker. You in NO WAY represent what America is all about nor what our founding fathers envisioned when they created this country. We are an empire plain and simple. Empires never last, NEVER! Our country is broke. Do you understand that? Do you understand what is looming on the horizon for your kids and grandkids? This country has gone down the #ter and a major cause is the military industrial complex that has been bleeding the American people dry to pursue unfettered/vulture stat corporatism all across the world. We have over 700 bases in 100+ countries. And sorry we are not the best at everything nor the strongest. Our military can't even handle a bunch of ragheads running around in sandals, gowns, and IED's. You have no clue what #ing war is like. To promote it and defend our disgustingly militaristic foreign policy and overall ideology flies in the face of being "American". Hell our FBI is so #ing incompetent, just look at 9/11. Many western countries are dying. Europe i.e. England is going to hell in a hand basket. US will follow. Our liberties are being stripped away from us day in and day out in the name of fear. Our wallets are bled dry in the name of fear and sheeple like you keep buying it hook line and sinker. You're pathetic and in no way represent what America is all about!

Originally posted by SLAYER69

Originally posted by dariousg

Yeah, I know, many will say that it will allow for 'terrorists' to get out of hand. Well, aren't terrorists out of hand now? I mean, every time I read a news release I see that a new form of 'terrorist' is developed by our intelligent politicians. Hell, we have so many terrorists living among us now we SHOULD pull our troops back home. I mean, as far as the government is concerned, if you are far left or far right or someone who likes what Ron Paul says or someone who carries their wealth around in cash you are a TERRORIST!

Oh But remember everything is a "CIA/American" plot. So there will be those who see it as nothing more than that.

Not everything is a CIA plot but the CIA is responsible for a lot of # that is going on in the world right now. And not just the CIA but every other western intelligent agency i.e. MI6 etc. CIA is a direct cause of just about every failed Islamic state from Iran to Iraq to Afghanistan. Our kids are dumber than ever and lazier than ever and all you can do is post about how we need to spend billions of dollars on a jet for which there is no direct threat. Maybe we should start increasing how many FBI agents speak Arabic instead of buying a trillion dollars of jet fighters. That would do more to confront the looming threat of terrorism. You wanna venture a guess as to how many management level FBI agents speak fluent Arabic post 9/11? I'll let you do the research on that one. I already have.

Originally posted by dariousg
reply to post by f4rwest

 

My point exactly. You kind of touched on some finer details that I left out. We SHOULD be involved in the world and its affairs. I just feel that right now the focus should be on restructure and restabilization. Come home and focus the money here for a few years. Keep a pulse on the happenings in the world but simply come home.

Edit to add: well, not exactly my point. I don't believe that I think that EVERYTHING the U.S. has done is right. Or even legal.

[edit on 14-4-2009 by dariousg]

And do you realize what would happen if we just "came home"? Do you have any clue how invasive and powerful and far reaching our military industrial complex is? You think our economy is bad now just imagine if we closed down bases and drew down troops from all the countries we are in. Talk about sky high unemployment and grinding our economy to a halt. You like most Americans are very naive about how the world works which is funny because you're on a site like this. Why do you think our economy hasn't completely fallen apart at the seams yet? It's because our military industrial complex is operating at record levels. Has been ever since WWII. America produces absolutey nothing noways except military #. Bombs, weapons, etc. is what keeps our economy churning a long even in times of recession. If there was no ominous threat constantly looming over our country and foreign assets and the world was at peace you probably would be out of a job just like millions of others. It disgust me to see so many arrogant and outright naive people calling themselves Americans.

Zosynspiracy,

You can't keep your economy going at the cost of so many innocent lives
that are destroyed by your war machine.. if you can't keep your country
running without murdering people, then it is better it collapses entirely, so
it can be rebuilt into something different and better.

That post of yours really disgusted me.

[edit on (14/4/09) by Wehali]

Originally posted by Zosynspiracy
It's because our military industrial complex is operating at record levels. Has been ever since WWII. America produces absolutey nothing noways except military #. Bombs, weapons, etc. is what keeps our economy churning a long even in times of recession. If there was no ominous threat constantly looming over our country and foreign assets and the world was at peace you probably would be out of a job just like millions of others. It disgust me to see so many arrogant and outright naive people calling themselves Americans.

This exactly what Eisenhower was warning us about all those years ago and nobody has or wanted to pay attention and now we find ourselves presently in this exact situation.

Originally posted by Wehali
Zosynspiracy,

You can't keep your economy going at the cost of so many innocent lives
that are destroyed by your war machine.. if you can't keep your country
running without murdering people, then it is better it collapses entirely, so
it can be rebuilt into something different and better.

That post of yours really disgusted me.

[edit on (14/4/09) by Wehali]

NO I AGREE WITH YOU! That's exactly what Im sayiing. We are a militaristic economy. If we didn't have our huge $650 billion dollar defense budget churning out equipment for more wars our economy would be worse than it is now. Wars keep America going! I'm disgusted by it myself but I'm telling it like it is.

Originally posted by SLAYER69

Originally posted by Zosynspiracy
It's because our military industrial complex is operating at record levels. Has been ever since WWII. America produces absolutey nothing noways except military #. Bombs, weapons, etc. is what keeps our economy churning a long even in times of recession. If there was no ominous threat constantly looming over our country and foreign assets and the world was at peace you probably would be out of a job just like millions of others. It disgust me to see so many arrogant and outright naive people calling themselves Americans.

This exactly what Eisenhower was warning us about all those years ago and nobody has or wanted to pay attention and now we find ourselves presently in this exact situation.

Eisenhower was the last American President. Everyone since (possibly with exception to JFK) has been a globalist.

Good thread, as I see it our military is stretched to the limits.

There has been a huge increase in enlistments recently due to the recession, and they have lowered the standards for enlisting now.

As I see it, the majority of our budget goes to the military, at the expense of the general public. I do not believe we need or should keep spending the amount of money in that one area. Our economy is hurting, the military needs to downsize, get out of Iraq and the government needs to focus on the citizens of the U.S as a whole.

But will that happen? No, because at this point, just has history has shown us, the way out of depressions and recessions is by war.

There is no way, we should be spending any more money on new planes etc.

reply to post by f4rwest


Ah the old jealousy argument. Too bad that doesn't work on rational Americans that can tell this country is ransacking the planet and burning through it's credit limit. Not because we are evil but because we are ignorant and/or submissive to our power-hungry overlords.

NO I AGREE WITH YOU! That's exactly what Im sayiing. We are a militaristic economy. If we didn't have our huge $650 billion dollar defense budget churning out equipment for more wars our economy would be worse than it is now. Wars keep America going! I'm disgusted by it myself but I'm telling it like it is.

Oh I'm sorry then, I must have misread your post, I apologize.
I thought you agreed with the situation you described, sorry!

Originally posted by parrallel
Why all the sudden rants against Americans?
Yes they have done wrong but people of the world must not judge the American people because of what they see in the media!

I am British and have never been to the US but have worked with US Marines and have meet many Americans in my lifetime and 90% of them are hard working peace loving people so why do people hate Americans?

Its all down to the media and the corupt goverment that they have ..............Brits are no angels.......we tried ruling the world once and look where that got us!

Anyways i will shut up now and let you lot get on with it!

God bless America

Why do people hate Americans.
1 word......Envy
We are a military and economic superpower.
Some of our liberals here in the USA have a
"blame America first" attitude.
Some of our celebrities like to go to Europe and trash the USA
because it's kind of a cool thing to do.
Whatever.
The planet Earth would sink into a disaster if the USA would
just go away tomorrow.
Think about it.

reply to post by SLAYER69


I'm glad you brought up the B-2 Stealth bomber.
Do you REALLY think it costs that much to build just 1 B-2 bomber?
I don't believe it. No way.
I think a B-2 costs maybe $100 million max.
We are using the rest of the money to build something else
that we don't have a need to know.
I'm guessing Area 51 Starships, shuttlecraft maybe even
a spacestation. Think Star Trek.
That F-22 is a toy. So is the B-2 Stealth Bomber.


[edit on 14-4-2009 by Eurisko2012]

This is a good thread, I'll toss my opinion in.

Here's what I think. America needs to pull away from the world. But, just for a few years. The situation in Iraq and Afghanistan is not going to just disappear over night due to troop withdrawal. We're talking 18 months at least before almost all of the combat troops are out of Iraq, and thats if President Obama decided to start pulling them out tomorrow. Even then, we're talking about moving a good percentage of those troops into Afghanistan. Thats another probably 5 years at least before we start pulling them out of there.

So lets say we deal with what we have on our plate now, we clean up the freaking pirate situation, we get the troops where they need to be, and by 2015, we quit messing with everyone else's crap. This is a slow process.

In the mean time, we cut unnecessary spending. We don't immediately need 163 F-22s. We could stop at 80 or 90, and that would be plenty. That saves billions of dollars. Thats gonna be a good chunk of money. If you use that to start rebuilding things at home and you're off to a good start.

This is just my theory, and like all theories it has holes in it, so I'll think about it and elaborate later.

Originally posted by Eurisko2012
reply to post by SLAYER69

 

I'm glad you brought up the B-2 Stealth bomber.
Do you REALLY think it costs that much to build just 1 B-2 bomber?
I don't believe it. No way.
I think a B-2 costs maybe $100 million max.

B-2

US$2.1 billion per aircraft in 1997 dollars.


A USAF B-2 Spirit in flight.
Role Stealth bomber
National origin United States
Manufacturer Northrop Corporation
Northrop Grumman
First flight 17 July 1989
Introduction April 1997
Status Active service: 20 aircraft
Primary user United States Air Force
Number built 21[1][2]
Program cost US$44.75 billion (projected through 2004)[3]
Unit cost $737 million (1997 air vehicle cost per aircraft)[3]

[edit on 15-4-2009 by SLAYER69]