Mexico Retaliates With Tariffs on U.S. Products

Originally posted by Pellevoisin

Instead of continuing the Bush/Cheney policies in foreign policy as the Obama has decided to do

, perhaps he should redirect that entire war mentality by invading Mexico and all of Central America and give all those countries a shot at being Commonwealths of the United States.

Why the need to invade? Why not for once let the US stop meddling in other countries? Close the border, that will be fine with everyone. Then the drugs will start coming in by maritime routes from SE Asia and Afghanistan.

reply to post by DJones


The real reasons that I find illegal immigration disturbing is because jobs are tight enough as it is right now, and the last thing we really need here in AZ is more competition for the few jobs that are out there... and with someone who is willing to work for less than minimum wage to boot! I'm sure you see my point.

The major issue to me though is the narcotics trade, if we were to legalize marijuana alone that would pretty much kill most of the drug trade, as it is the most highly trafficked and most profitable narcotic for the cartels.
And I can't believe that the one guy said earlier "that's Mexico's problem", it is clearly our problem as WE are the market they are selling to....Our own government won't shore up it's borders, likely because they are making a killing off this whole business and cheap labor combined, and meanwhile the Mexican people and people living in the border states have to suffer the consequences.

I don't agree with cutting off food shipments though, that's just wrong.

reply to post by crawgator406

that will never happen just as much food comes from mexico or through mexico to the U.S. as food from the U.S. goes to or through Mexico.





reply to post by jdub297

they've been denied access to US highways because of safety concerns. They'd have to offload their cargo at the border or just past it.

your mostly right.

Yes they have been denied access to U.S. Highways because honestly their trucks are unsafe!

They are only allowed to operate in a 20 mile zone from the border. No they don't offload their cargo at the border. Part of the agreement was that any shipment coming in to the united states from mexico that had a destination outside the mexican operating zone had to be cosigned to U.S. trucking companies.

The typical process for shipments coming out of mexico for the U.S. and Canda was this. the mexican drivers would bring the trailors out of Mexico, cross the border and go thru customs. once cleared from customs the drivers would take the trailors to a drop lot within the mexican operating zone owned by the U.S. trucking company that was cosigned to the load. the Mexican drivers would then either pick up an empty trailor or pick up a loaded trailor bound for mexico.

What Mexico doesn't say in this article is they are just as quilty of denying U.S. trucks access to Mexico. they only allowed a hand full of U.S. trucking companies to operate in mexico.

reply to post by jam321


Have you ever seen a Mexican truck? I'll try and find a few of the pictures i have from when i was a driver, of Mexican trucks while waiting on a Mexican drive to bring my load through customs.

Believe me if you did you would not want them on U.S. highways! lets put it this way all of our old trucks end up in Mexico and they are not maintained. they are buckets of rust. and they would not pass the federal safety inspection for commercial vehicles in the U.S. not to mention they do not comply with the hours of service regulations that U.S. and Canadian drives do.

[edit on 3/17/2009 by Mercenary2007]

well, even within the agreement, wouldn't mexico have the obligation to ensure that thier trucks and the drivers meet american standards, or that american officials could turn away trucks that didn't meet those standards...

and, well, if yous think you are gonna get american truckers to work for near minimum wage, I think you are nuts!!! it would probably kill another vital industry in america...

can we retaliate by slapping tarriffs on their illegal immigrants, charge the mexican government for each one we catch here in the states?

reply to post by Bunch


Mexico has every right to retaliate. This is purely an economic and political issue. And it's not like they care for their illegals in your country. The Elite of Mexico want nothing less than to dump them into your country.

Still, it's great that Mexico is into tariffs. Just as the center of the smallest particle must have a focal point of spirit or it would simply dissipate and with it, the larger creations of matter. A country needs a strong center of it's own or it will dissipate into nothingness. The US should make and buy it's own food and goods first and accept imports only with high tariffs. We should take care of our own first. We should not be importing workers, taking jobs away from people born this country. We shouldn't import workers unless we can not foresee a specific need being filled anytime in the near future. The only real period of prosperity in the US was during a period of this country having high tariffs. Tariffs are a good thing, let Mexico lead the way.

Originally posted by jam321

How many unsafe trucks did they find in the pilot program?

The real questions are how many drivers met the qualifications? Could they pass a CDL test? Did they met random drug testing requirements? Was there an accessible database or any records kept? Did they they follow hours of service properly or did they fake a logbook?

We do know that one driver had an accident in Colorado. Lost control, crashed into a building and some people died. It was said that it could have happened to any driver, so I won't pretend to debate if it was a driver problem of being Mexican or a rookie.

What I will point out is since this recession has started, there has been 20% job loss in the OTR drivers in the US. This includes both company drivers and Owner/Operators. That is more than twice the rate of the national average for all unemployment. And due to the difference in the standards of living, Mexican drivers can work for a far lower pay rate.

Now consider this, nearly every tangible product that you can buy in a store in the US has spent some time on a truck at one point or another. So the transportation industry is the true key to the US economy. Would you really feel comfortable leaving it to standards outside of US control? I mean look at the recent fiasco with Swift's training facility in Tennessee. The DoT in California was pulling Swift trucks over left and right checking licenses. Any driver with a TN CDL was placed out of service until their qualifications could be checked and verified.

Yes, I used to drive OTR. I still retain my CDL and follow all the rules to retain it. Such as one beer means I can not legally drive any vehicle as my BAC is over the limit of .02. In fact, I still follow the 8 hour rule when it comes to being able to work after doing any drinking even though I haven't worked a job that was ruled by such regulations in two years. And by driving, it means any vehicle including a bicycle or lawnmower.

Originally posted by Ahabstar

Originally posted by jam321

How many unsafe trucks did they find in the pilot program?

- From the OP-

"The argument was that the trucks did not comply with their safety rules, despite the fact that during the pilot program there were more than 46,000 crossings without any significant incidents," Ruiz Mateos said. "The Mexican trucks even exceeded the U.S. safety standards in some cases."

Brady said that another 800 Mexican trucks have been shipping throughout the U.S. since the 1990s with safety records equivalent to U.S. trucks. The trucks were grandfathered in when NAFTA was signed.

Originally posted by mpriebe81
reply to post by DJones

 

The real reasons that I find illegal immigration disturbing is because jobs are tight enough as it is right now, and the last thing we really need here in AZ is more competition for the few jobs that are out there... and with someone who is willing to work for less than minimum wage to boot! I'm sure you see my point.

The major issue to me though is the narcotics trade, if we were to legalize marijuana alone that would pretty much kill most of the drug trade, as it is the most highly trafficked and most profitable narcotic for the cartels.
And I can't believe that the one guy said earlier "that's Mexico's problem", it is clearly our problem as WE are the market they are selling to....Our own government won't shore up it's borders, likely because they are making a killing off this whole business and cheap labor combined, and meanwhile the Mexican people and people living in the border states have to suffer the consequences.

I don't agree with cutting off food shipments though, that's just wrong.

blog.laborlawtalk.com...
The New Mexico Minimum Wage Act allows employers to pay some employees less than the minimum wage. Workers in domestic service in or about a private home are exempt from the state minimum wage.

I'm also looking for where our Gov Richardson also exempted the agricultural buisness particularly the chile pepper industry down in Hatch,N.M..
The problem here was if they couldn't hire cheap immagrant workers for the fields it wouldn't be profitable for the farmers. So we allowed the exemeption thus we're promoting illegals to come over the border.

And as far as legalizing drugs-
The mark up from the manufacturer to the street price is enormous. The Cartels profit margin takes in account the shipping cost, bribes and confiscation cost. Leagalizing and taxation would not hamper their profit margin. As a result there would be more product readily avalible at a lower cost to the user. The pharmacy companies would price accordingly to demand.
Living down here in N.M., it's a very common occurance to "run across the border" for cheaper perscriptions, dental and healthcare.

reply to post by Pellevoisin


They're not continueing them... they're modifying them.

A continutation would be much worst. Think about the worst case scenario and that's what Bush and Co. would be doing.

And this whole truck situation is a LOT more complicated than just "an agreement" and the Mexican Government that signed these agreements with America is crooked. We don't want their freaking trucks in our country. I don't care about drugs coming through as much as I care about people with guns and masks coming through.

And in reply to another post, there aren't enough jobs anymore for the illegal immigrants.

I am not saying I agree with Americas choice, but Mexico is so far in the red that I certainly don't agree with anything they've done.

The fact that their cartels are sending people across the border and killing American citizens, I feel like that's where we draw the line.

Don't be mad at Mexico, this the bad policies of corrupted politicians been lobbied by corporate America.

This the policies of NAFTA, FREE TRADE and the WTO.

Yes people this policies accepted by our congress and Presidents are the ones that now are telling US what they can do or not when Regulations are broken.

And Americans think that US is still a sovereign nation, well I bet the WTO is laughing right now on our own faces.

reply to post by mpriebe81


I agree,

As some others have already stated the problem is that the market for such workers exists, which then puts the problem to the employers. Who are motivated by nothing except greed,(as in the couldn't care less about the families of both Americans and Mexicans).

Same could be said about the drug trade, the most civil part of their organizations are the drugs. Why not except a lesser evil if it contributes to a diminishing of greater ones, not to mention jobs. With that in mind could anyone verify the truth of this link:
blogs.salon.com...

If that is the reason why Weed is illegal, that is sad.

reply to post by geo1066


Exactly. The real bone of contention was not with the trucks themselves in the pilot program. It was a foregone conclusion that great effort would be made to make sure the trucks were in compliance.

The issues are the need for the extra drivers in the first place along with the question of their qualifications. Keep in mind, there are no minimum wage laws for drivers unless they are paid by the hour. The majority of drivers are paid by the mile and even then, not actual miles driven but by the Mover's Guide mileage charts. In other words, you could make five stops in Jacksonville, FL; rack up 200 actual miles there, yet receive no credit for the mileage because you never left Jacksonville. Now, you should make $100 for multiple drops at $25 per extra drop (first one is always free). Now $100 might seem to be fair but at $.40 per mile you could have made $286 driving. And you lost $80 for those 200 miles you did drive between stops.

Because of the cost of living differences, the Mexican drivers can afford to drive for $.15-$.20 per mile. Of course these pay rate are for company drivers that are non-union. Teamsters usually make $.78 per mile with big outfits like Roadway. Owner/Op rates are much higher and usual average between $1.80-$2.40 per mile although $1.20 per mile is not unheard of for Owner/Operators doing consistent light loads with plenty of mileage.

When it comes to the safety of our highways, then no, the Mexican trucks should not be allowed on our roads. Heck, the majority of the illegal population here don't even have drivers' licenses and insurance, you read about them in the paper all the time. Even the ones who do have licenses are habitual offenders of some sort. The teamsters were very instrumental in stopping the Mexican trucks from using our highways. In fact, I know Yellow freight took a 10 percent decrease in pay and Conway took a 5 percent cut, and there were others I was told of, and this is by a Yellow driver. On top of losing pay, they surely don't need to be losing miles to non-citizens of this country.

They can keep their trucks and their illegal immigrants over there. Maybe if they didn't depend on our products, they would have to put their people to work producing them instead and instead of ours being shipped out of the country, they would stay here and they might be more affordable. Who knows.

reply to post by opal13


But you're missing the point, in that illegal immigration is NOT just a problem that Mexico should be dealing with! If we really wanted to stop illegal immigration in a big way, we could easily up the ante on our southern border and create some kind of infrastructure and/or beef up the border patrol agency. It'll never happen with our current government though, as like i stated before they are making far too much money off of the current system. It is quite well known that our own government is profiting from the narcotics trade, and that businesses here in America are saving a TON of money with cheap labor.....especially in the agricultural markets here in the southern United States. Let's get real here, there is no easy solution but our government is basically guaranteeing jobs to illegal immigrants who will work for much cheaper. As stated earlier by someone else, there are even provisions that basically condone this type of behavior. If we erase the incentives that allow illegals to come into this country and work, we erase a huge part of the problem.

reply to post by mpriebe81


No, I agree with you. It's a problem all the way around. I don't think they realized how much of a problem it would turn out to be. Funny how we sent all our factories down there for cheap labor and put Americans out of work, then they won't work for cheap wages, so they come here and undercut Americans, and many are still out of work because of it. Where I live, they had a couple of busts in some factories and alot left, but they cried, what about our families?? Sorry, no sympathy, you knowingly broke the law, knowing the possible consequences, so you knowingly put your family in the middle of it. Off topic I know, but I could write volumes because the whole thing just makes me mad, so I'll shut my mouth.

reply to post by opal13

Heck, the majority of the illegal population here don't even have drivers' licenses and insurance, you read about them in the paper all the time.

Kinda hard to condemn people for something they can't get. Most states don't allow illegals to get driver license and without a driver license there is very little chance of them getting insurance.

reply to post by jam321


Again, knowingly breaking the law. If you are illegal, you should not get the same privledges as a citizen. If you come here legally and go thru the process, you can get one.

Just think, if you were to go to Mexico and do half of what they get away with here, you'd end up in a Mexican prison and probably never see the light of day.

reply to post by DJones

I have a question for anyone interested. Why is that you in anyway feel more entitled to a job than someone who happened to be born 100 miles south of you. I'm Canadian and am more open to immigration to most but still. I guess what I'm trying to say is that I don't love Canada for the land it consists of I love it because of what it stands for, if someone wants to come here, work hard, obey the law I have absolutely no problem with them providing for their family.

This is not about geography. It is about whether we should control the number of people coming into this country. All countries HAVE to control the number of immigrants, or you would have huge problems with hunger, unemployment, housing, and law enforcement. A country cannot outgrow the ability of the infrastructure to expand, or mass chaos ensues. For the same reason that you don't build a 3 bedroom home, and place 20 families in it, you cannot just allow an unlimited number of immigrants in, at a time.

The audacity of the Mexican's!!!!

How dare they expect the U.S. to keep their word on Free Trade!!!

What right do they have to expect the States to keep their word? Yup, you guys should just bomb them for that.