Total economic collapse is unavoidable at this point

Anyone who actually believes this is just a US problem is clearly living in a dream world. This is a Global problem, with Global ramifications. And anyone who really thinks this is all the US's fault is looking to pass the buck. This problem stems from globalization without taking the time to put proper systems in place.

All the countries of the world are to blame for the problems we now face. The only thing is, will the governments of the world wake up in time to try and fix this problem by getting over petty differences and working together? Or shall we continue to point fingers at each other?

Never forget that old saying.....

"Divded we fall"

Thats basically whats happening. Countries will contiue to ignore the real problems and continue to try and push the Global economy without fixing it first. One by One countires are going to start to fall. When that happens we will be faced with a choice, because it won't be hard to see that someone is going to do something stupid on thier way down.

Will governments keep a cool head or will we blow up and cause another great war? One that noone could survive once the bombs start dropping.


I may be crazy but I do think there is a capacity for good in Humans. The question will the rest of the world see it in time?

reply to post by xoxo stacie


I agree that Mexico has been in desperate trouble for a long time. That said it can get a lot worse. What I see in the next few months is much worse than just a corrupt but semi-functioning gov't. I see total utility and services failure, leaving the population without heating, a/c, running water ect. Chaos that will bleed north. I live way to close to the Mexican border, and I will be affected by this. I plan on keeping ATS updated on this situation. It is worse in El Paso, and San Diego. I am less than 50 miles from El Paso.

It could be a controlled demolition and thus no immediate run out of the dollar or us treasuries. If we deflate the debt then we could even see gold go down not explode from the 1000 area...everyone that chased it and needs cash would have to (or at least want to) sell as that asset loses value, too. Then TSHTF and the game changes but first, TPTB could run the market down to make weak holders panic and sell out. Be careful as this scenario leading up to a bust could take 3 years not 6 months.

reply to post by xbranscombex


Given your understanding and the reality that this is NOT just a recession which is only a belch in the economy as this is a "you are doubled dam dead sucker". How much time until "excuse me but you are totally f***ed". I say six months at the most and probably a hell of alot sooner. Cough, belch, fart and fart again.

reply to post by downtown436


Hope to here from you soon partner becuase this sh** "will bleed north" south, east, and west. I see alot of individuals going into the survival mode, only human I guess but even that is worthless give the magnitude of this feasco.

reply to post by Anonymous ATS


I would say that 3 years is a pretty good guess. The things that happen to get to that point will be shocking.

reply to post by gaslaugh123


When you say survival mode, exactly what do you mean?

reply to post by downtown436


That`s kind of pesimistic isn`t it? depends of the point you are looking at. people who have power are trying to find a solution methinks. Give credit.

reply to post by downtown436


I live in El Paso, and yea I can agree to the craziness going on in Juarez alone, I used to go there for my asthma inhalers, but not anymore. Hell, not even my friends with family in Juarez will go across the border anymore. There is a full fledged drug war going on there, and its starting to pour over into El Paso. I have been here long enough to see past drug wars there, but none have ever gotten this bad.

It took 3 years from 1929 to the 1932 bottom and then, despite the market bottom, the economy languished for another 8-10 yrs (WWII).
So far we have not seen a "crash" per se....air pockets w speed bumps with the PPT in there to provide support at those levels...and yet we dropped as much as 50% on average. So far China has committed to keep buying our bonds and the us dollar remains king (cash is king during a recession/depression also). The problem is that this is not a typical cyclical recession but rather a Depression...and it will likely last a decade or more. But unless we get a nuke Terror Attack this controlled demolition (to prevent panic until the low) could take some time. What is an extra 3 years on something that has been developing for a generation?
(Rhetorical question).
PS On Gold I wouldnt be surprised to see it hit $1000 and then (coincident with a stock market rally next month a la 2003) have a swift break back to $850 with the possibility of a retest of the 2008 lows. Then we go up and dont stop til we hit $1850 but that could take some time.

Originally posted by Anonymous ATS
It could be a controlled demolition and thus no immediate run out of the dollar or us treasuries. If we deflate the debt then we could even see gold go down not explode from the 1000 area...everyone that chased it and needs cash would have to (or at least want to) sell as that asset loses value, too. Then TSHTF and the game changes but first, TPTB could run the market down to make weak holders panic and sell out. Be careful as this scenario leading up to a bust could take 3 years not 6 months.

Its likely to go much higher first. I think it could hit $5000. Your right though, when everyone is trying to sell it for survival, the price will collapse again. When the new currency is forced on us and it is illegal to own gold, it won't be worth Sh%$(*

reply to post by Trayen11

Fixing an old car maybe more expensive than buying a new one.

COLUMBUS, Ohio – Oil prices slid closer to a new multiyear low Thursday because of growing doubts that the $789 billion stimulus package will reinvigorate the economy and demand for energy.

Replacing the junk with a brand new car would be a radical solution to the problem. But the mistake is buying the same type of car. So if the sky-hi stimulus package is reserved for fixing the old car, the junk can puff a few miles more before it quits again -- and that seems to be the case. But even if the money are pumped into a political/economic system that folks like Ron Paul is trying to sell, the situation is akin to buying brand new Chevy Impala designed in 1959.

The excerpt says that there are "growing doubts" about the effect of the economic stimulus seen as another can of power steering fluid poured into a car with failed master cylinder. But "growing doubts" means that no one is able to run a model on the effect of the stimulus and tell ahead the effect of it with much higher degree of certainty than "doubt." That means, there is no one out there who could design a brand new car for the new century.
It will be a very long century. . .




[edit on 2/12/2009 by stander]

Originally posted by downtown436
When you say survival mode, exactly what do you mean?

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Prepare for the worst folks!

Buy gold now if you can, explore survival options and plan for it as best you can.

The indecision in Washington, finger pointing blame games etc. along with economic expert forecasts are your final warning.

Do not underestimate how bad things can get and end up trapped, unprepared in urban chaos.

'Hope' for the best, but prepare for the worst, especially if you live in a large American city.

reply to post by rightuos

I went to NMSU, and we would frequently go to Juarez to party and drink, when we were less than 21 because the drinking age in J-town was 18.

Last time I went I was scared for my life as a riot started on the U.S. side of the border as the port of entry was overwhelmed and people started going crazy. I decided at that point that I would never go back.

It's nice to meet another neighboring ATS'er!!

Originally posted by SailorinAZ
reply to post by mpriebe81

 

For many years I planned to escape to the mountains/out of the city. However, these days, I am thinking I will stay put in the city when the SHTF.

Everyone will be escaping out of the city.

No, they won't. Unless there's news of an impending attack they will stay where they are because they were unprepared.

reply to post by downtown436

You are just paranoid. I think you are just taking this from your own mind of what you would like to see happen. God will prevail and who knows him will not have to worry.

To all of the people who are saying we should all run to the woods with our guns. What are you waiting for?

Shouldn't you get going now?

During the great depression people were starving, your neighbors were starving and there were no gangs going around like in the "Mad Max" movie.

Why would it happen now?

reply to post by Electro38


Well I'm not going to run anywhere, as there is nowhere to run. Nowhere to hide either.

Nobody can really predict how bad or how soon it will get bad, but I know it will be pretty bad pretty soon.

Trying to make as much money as I can will the lights are still on.

Originally posted by Electro38
To all of the people who are saying we should all run to the woods with our guns. What are you waiting for?

Shouldn't you get going now?

During the great depression people were starving, your neighbors were starving and there were no gangs going around like in the "Mad Max" movie.

Why would it happen now?

Don't you think that people back in the 30's were more incline to respect authority, or their churches or belief system, while spoil me-myself-and-I people of today who see a conspiracy in everything, have an attention span of a nano-seconds won't be reacting quite differently.

I think today, the social fabric (providing there is one) will degrade much faster than before.

What scares me more is how many people seem almost eager for the economy to fail. They can't wait to break out their weapons, and "defend the homestead." Had that BoB packed for 10 years, woot.. finally a chance to USE it!

I think this mentality hurts the situation more than helps it. It's never good when a large segment of people want for the system to fail just because it's something 'exciting and new.'