It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Lawsuit: Florida Clinic Botched Abortion, Threw Out Live Baby

page: 1
4
<<   2  3 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Feb, 5 2009 @ 03:55 PM
link   

Lawsuit: Florida Clinic Botched Abortion, Threw Out Live Baby


www.foxnews.com

TAMPA, Florida — Eighteen and pregnant, Sycloria Williams went to an abortion clinic outside Miami and paid $1,200 for Dr. Pierre Jean-Jacque Renelique to terminate her 23-week pregnancy.

Three days later, she sat in a reclining chair, medicated to dilate her cervix and otherwise get her ready for the procedure.

Only Renelique didn't arrive in time. According to Williams and the Florida Department of Health, she went into labor and delivered a live baby girl.

What Williams and the Health Department say happened next has shocked people on both sides of the abortion debate: One of the clinic's owners, who has no medical license, cut the infant's umbilical cord. Williams says the woman placed the baby in a plastic biohazard bag and threw it out.

(visit the link for the full news article)




posted on Feb, 5 2009 @ 03:55 PM
link   
All I can say is, "Are you -Snip- serious?" This is a crime. Period. Some may know my stance on the topic of abortion but this is murder. No way around it. They murdered that baby.

I realize that many will say that abortion is murder but this was a live birth. Period. A HUGE DIFFERENCE!

Completely disgusting.

www.foxnews.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

Mod Edit: Do Not Circumvent The Automatic Censors.

[edit on 5-2-2009 by MemoryShock]



posted on Feb, 5 2009 @ 04:03 PM
link   
I agree!!!!!! if this really happen it is murder and I hope that the people involved get prosecuted for such criminal act.

I am pro choice but waiting 23 weeks to have an abortion is right criminal and horrible.

To made matters worst the baby even had taken its first breath of air.

Very sad story.



[edit on 5-2-2009 by marg6043]



posted on Feb, 5 2009 @ 04:13 PM
link   
it makes me want to cry, it is awful and sad, when they find him they should throw the book at him



posted on Feb, 5 2009 @ 04:13 PM
link   
I agree. This is very disturbing. The person who did this should be charged with murder. I went to the article and read the whole thing and what I don't understand is why the woman watched this happen to her baby and said nothing at the time? It was a week later when they got the dead baby that they ran tests on it. I know she was young at 18, but still, she should have said something at the time.



posted on Feb, 5 2009 @ 04:13 PM
link   
Yeah... this has NOTHING to do with the Pro-Choice, Anti-Abortion debate....


This is just old fashioned IDIOCY!



posted on Feb, 5 2009 @ 04:18 PM
link   

Originally posted by marg6043
I am pro choice but waiting 23 months to have an abortion is right criminal and horrible.


I'm sure you men't 23 WEEKS... edit: and yes that is bad... what they make the women wait untill the pregnancy is more than 5 months gone?? WTF? over hear there is an upper limit and I'm sure it's less than that... Only special in special circumstances will they perform an abortion after that.

Yhea that is shocking, that clinic should be throughly looked at by professionals (I won't say closed down instantly - not nearly enough info) But defiantly that 'owner' (who didn't have a medical licence
) should face charges. I'm assuming all this is private care - the world should learn from our NHS - it's far from perfect but at least there are standards repeated up and down the country.

[edit on 5/2/2009 by Now_Then]



posted on Feb, 5 2009 @ 04:18 PM
link   
I don't even know what to say.

This goes beyond a screw up. This is just disgusting.



posted on Feb, 5 2009 @ 04:21 PM
link   
I believe it's a baby, not a dehumanizing 'choice', but at least I am left with some shred of hope for humanity after seeing that even the 'pro-choice' crowd is by and large disgusted by this act. It should be sickening to hear the defense try to say that the baby was going to be terminated anyway, so no crime was committed.



posted on Feb, 5 2009 @ 04:23 PM
link   

Originally posted by Now_Then

Originally posted by marg6043
I am pro choice but waiting 23 months to have an abortion is right criminal and horrible.


I'm sure you men't 23 WEEKS...



Thanks I see my mistake, I am very sad with this, I also can not imagine this girl sitting there and looking at the fetus been born alive and toss in plastic bag, unless she had not clue it was alive due to her been sedated during the procedure.

Still I am surprised that this clinic will dispose of remains in such a care fee manner.

[edit on 5-2-2009 by marg6043]



posted on Feb, 5 2009 @ 04:25 PM
link   
What the F are you all crying about?

Your all happy to let the baby get killed inside the womb, then taken out and call it an "Abortion".

But when the exact same happens in reverse, somehow you have morals about it?

You want the baby dead, it ended up dead, do not come crying after you decided to have it killed. If it was shot, beaten or given a drug, it still will die. One form of murder does not rank above another, they are all still just that "Murder".

Funny how those of you who support abortion, never consider if the baby can feel it is dying, heck you have little to no way of knowing if it felt pain, distress and other emotions associated with dying, yet as long as it happens inside the womb, your all fine and dandy about it.

Like they say, out of site, out of mind!



posted on Feb, 5 2009 @ 04:27 PM
link   
reply to post by marg6043
 


Without trying to start an unwinable from either side argument, Marg, why does that surprise you in any way? In order to support and perform an abortion, these individuals rationalize it by viewing the baby as nothing more than a growth needing to be removed. The instant they start 'properly' viewing the baby as having been a human life deserving of respectfull and careful post mortem handling and 'disposal' (God I hate using that term here), they can no longer sit on a high horse and continue to relegate the lives of the unborn as nothing more than a choice.



posted on Feb, 5 2009 @ 04:33 PM
link   
OK we are debating here what the clinic has done in this abortion issue, not the morals and personal opinions of the some.

So lets get a chill pill and debate the deplorable conditions that the fetus found its ultimate death.

After been born alive.

Plain and simple, do the finger pointing in the religious threads.

This braking news.

I will happily debate the OP topic only but will ignore the baiting and the self righteousness.



posted on Feb, 5 2009 @ 04:44 PM
link   

Originally posted by marg6043
OK we are debating here what the clinic has done in this abortion issue, not the morals and personal opinions of the some.

So lets get a chill pill and debate the deplorable conditions that the fetus found its ultimate death.

After been born alive.

Plain and simple, do the finger pointing in the religious threads.

This braking news.

I will happily debate the OP topic only but will ignore the baiting and the self righteousness.


Your obviously trying to dodge the bullet, but ok lets discuss the OP.

The baby was prematurely born after enduced labour. The doctor failed to turn up in time to kill the baby before it was born.

A very sick individual, the clinics owner (face it, to deal in death, you must be very twisted and evil) decided to cut the umbilical cord, bag it up while it was still alive, then throw it in a bin and allow it to die slowly.

I agree, it is disgusting what happened, but back to my above post point. What gives you the right to question the death? The mother opted to have it killed, she just decided to grow a concience after seeing the baby was a real life human and not some toy doll she no longer wanted! If the baby was killed inside her, then handled in the same way, there would have been no story, because the mother would have still seen it as a lifeless object (obviously it would have been at that point) and had little to no remorse.

Look at it this way, if the mother never had the abortion in the first case, non of this would have happened! So she is more to blame then the clinic owner, in my eyes. The clinic owner done exactly as it said on the tin "we kill babies".



posted on Feb, 5 2009 @ 04:50 PM
link   
As I read the article I wonder why the ownerwas doing in the room where the girl was having the procedure and why he had anything to do with the procedure at all when he didn't have a medical license.

It's laws out there that takes care of checking out this places including medical facilities to make sure that they are in compliant with state and local laws?

Still one of the only things that I agree with is that late term abortions should be banned unless is clear that they will present a mortal danger to the mother.

As usual choice should always be preserved.



posted on Feb, 5 2009 @ 05:00 PM
link   
I'm calling hoax right now. There are tons of restrictions for third trimester abortions where a baby is likely to be born healthy. You need state permission to get one. And doctors would lose their licenses if they were caught doing anything other than that. If a doctor had agreed to give her an abortion, the baby would NOT be delivered healthy, even if it was botched, and definitely not three days later. Three months, maybe, if he just didn't do it at all. It wouldn't be three days. She probably wouldn't have gone into labor and even if she did, if she went into labor that early (23 weeks) and the baby was premature by a trimester at least, they would have given her medication to postpone labor until the baby was more developed.

So where did this story come from? Confusion and facts.
en.wikipedia.org...

Partial Birth abortions used to be legal. They took two days, required D&C, and the fetus was "delivered." My mom is a midwife, it's really often for patients to see their stillborn babies (these are cases that she saw, not abortions) or late miscarriages and think that the baby was okay and the doctors killed it after birth.

I've heard these stories on the news and sometimes a baby is born through NORMAL labor, not abortion, and accidently thrown out. But the facts are just wrong here, abortions late enough for a healthy baby to be born are illegal unless the mother is at risk of dying or something horrible happened.

Also, most pregnancies last around 40 weeks. That would still be a second trimester baby.




en.wikipedia.org...

In the normal human fetus, several organ systems mature between 34 and 37 weeks, and the fetus reaches adequate maturity by the end of this period.
...
By gestational age, 5% of PBs occur at less than 28 weeks (extreme prematurity)

James Elgin Gill (born on 20 May 1987 in Ottawa, Canada) was the earliest premature baby in the world. He was 128 days premature (21 weeks and 5 days gestation) and weighed 1 lb. 6 oz. (624 g). He survived and is quite healthy


If that baby was 23 weeks old and healthy and developed, then THAT would be impressive. Usually babies that premature die. The chances of the above case happening are so small.

The sad reality is that many women get abortions without knowing what it will entail. They don't know what is happening to them or the fetus sometimes and confusion happens.


[edit on 2/5/2009 by ravenshadow13]

[edit on 2/5/2009 by ravenshadow13]



posted on Feb, 5 2009 @ 05:07 PM
link   
reply to post by ravenshadow13
 


This was not a third trimester abortion.


First trimester pregnancy is the early stage of pregnancy from conception to 12 weeks gestation, or about 14 weeks from the first day of the last normal menstrual period (LNMP).

This second trimester of pregnancy lasts until the end of the seventh month.

The third trimester of pregnancy generally spans weeks 28 through 40.

She was 23 weeks pregnant, making it a second trimester.



posted on Feb, 5 2009 @ 05:08 PM
link   
reply to post by Clark W. Griswold
 


Yeah, sorry. I noted that and edited my post accordingly ^_^
Thank you.



posted on Feb, 5 2009 @ 05:08 PM
link   
reply to post by marg6043
 


It is impossible to debate the OP without stating that these clinics have an inherent lack of caring for human life. I am not surprised this happened, as it has been documented that many aborted babies have come our of the womb alive (depending on the method used) and have merely been tossed into a trashcan lined with a medical waste bag. Does it really make a difference whether the child was forcibly removed or whether it slipped right out at that point?

The background to stories like this is exactly the reason that the United States wallows in a culture of death like pigs in cool mud. It is freaking beyond comprehension that we've got mass protests over a bunch of grown men who took up arms against our troops and set up ambushes for them in some God forsaken catbox in the middle East being locked up in Gitmo, yet the same people orchestrating those supports laws which remove any sort of protection of those among us who are the most innocent and least able to defend themselves.

There is a good reason why it is impossible to discuss the OP without also discussing the morality of abortion. The two aren't separable. The standard defense used by pro-choice people is to try to set rules on the debate that restrict arguments they have no defense for. I hope to God that the criminal trial these pricks face doesn't set the same rules for their trial.



posted on Feb, 5 2009 @ 05:08 PM
link   
Even in our liberal Netherlands the physician wouldn't have aborted the baby. You can only abort until the Baby is able to live outside the womb wich is week 21. Abortions during or after week 21 are only legal if the mothers live is otherwise threatend. So in this case the abortion would've been illegal and the physician send to jail.
Surely there is a abortion law with a maximum time where this has happend?

[edit on 5-2-2009 by HEroX]



new topics

top topics



 
4
<<   2  3 >>

log in

join