Some info about the 13th sign....
en.wikipedia.org...
I find it most interesting that the story of the Serpent and man go way way back to old times and now the new 13th sign who entered the zodiac (I
think a couple thousand yrs. ago) is a 'Serpent Handler'.
Another interesting find is that all the constellations are NOT in the rising of the sun for the same amounts of time like the tropical zodiac
portrays, for example, Scorpio is the background to the sun for only 8 days, some constellations are the background to the sun for much more time then
the other signs, like Virgo.
Peace to all,
LV
Did you know there are 13 constellations?, page 1
Topic started on 7-1-2009 @ 11:34 AM by LeoVirgo
I know there are many here that are aware that there are officially 13 signs in our zodiac....but Im sure there are some that dont.
My findings of this last yr. actually changed my birth sign from Virgo, to Leo...hence, my ATS name.
The sun might not of rose in the sign you think it did when you were born...its worth checking out if you are not aware of this...your sign might not be what you think it is.
On the link below, you can scroll down to see the differences of the zodiacs and where the sun actually rose when you were born.
en.wikipedia.org...
Peace to all,
LV
My findings of this last yr. actually changed my birth sign from Virgo, to Leo...hence, my ATS name.
The sun might not of rose in the sign you think it did when you were born...its worth checking out if you are not aware of this...your sign might not be what you think it is.
On the link below, you can scroll down to see the differences of the zodiacs and where the sun actually rose when you were born.
en.wikipedia.org...
Peace to all,
LV
reply posted on 28-1-2009 @ 12:15 PM by TheRepublic
reply to post by LeoVirgo
very intresting, im a gemini either way but it still is confusing. i wonder which is correct. is it really based of the seasons on earth like the season of may being gemini or the movement through the stars like the sun being in the gemini constellation? who knows.
by the way i like your icon. i love fractals as nerdy as that sounds. i believe fractals are one of the secrets of the univers, and partially responsible for how astrology works. just endless patterns repeating endlessly.
that brings to mind, have you ever read the Pistis Sophia? its a little enigmatic and esoteric but i think it may speak to what you are reffering. i too have had questions about the 13th zodiac sign, which has been hidden and the esoteric symbolism of that sign. in the Pistis Sophia i think it talks about it.
he speaks about the 13th aeon:
jesus then exsplains how he altered the patterns of the horoscope to drain power away from the evil forces present in our time. he speaks of the alterations he made in chapter 21:
www.gnosis.org...
like i said its real esoteric and im not sure i truley comprehend exactly what was being reffered too, but i feel that somehow the 13th sign ties in with an alteration made in nature some time in history that corresponds with the disaperance of the 13th sign.
another thing to think about technically the missing sign would be the "9th sign" being between scorpio and sagitarius. that would in turn make pisces the 13th sign. like i said i dont really know what all this means but i felt i just wanted to put these thoughts out there and it looks like you are intrested in some of the same stuff i am.
very intresting, im a gemini either way but it still is confusing. i wonder which is correct. is it really based of the seasons on earth like the season of may being gemini or the movement through the stars like the sun being in the gemini constellation? who knows.
by the way i like your icon. i love fractals as nerdy as that sounds. i believe fractals are one of the secrets of the univers, and partially responsible for how astrology works. just endless patterns repeating endlessly.
that brings to mind, have you ever read the Pistis Sophia? its a little enigmatic and esoteric but i think it may speak to what you are reffering. i too have had questions about the 13th zodiac sign, which has been hidden and the esoteric symbolism of that sign. in the Pistis Sophia i think it talks about it.
he speaks about the 13th aeon:
Jesus answered and said unto Mary: "They will not accomplish them as they accomplished them from the beginning, because I have taken away a third of their power; but they will raise a loan from those who know the mysteries of the magic of the thirteenth æon. And if they invoke the mysteries of the magic of those who are in the thirteenth æon. they will accomplish them well and surely, because I have not taken away power from that region, according to the command of the First Mystery
jesus then exsplains how he altered the patterns of the horoscope to drain power away from the evil forces present in our time. he speaks of the alterations he made in chapter 21:
And it came to pass, when Jesus had finished saying these words, that Mary continued again and said: "My Lord, will not then the horoscope-casters and consulters from now on declare unto men what will come to pass for them?"
And Jesus answered and said unto Mary: "If the horoscope-casters find the Fate and the sphere turned towards the left, according to their first extension, their words will come to pass, and they will say what is to take place. But if they chance on the Fate or the sphere turned to the right, they are bound to say nothing true, for I have changed their influences and their squares and their triangles and their octagons; seeing that their influences from the beginning onwards were continuously turned to the left and their squares and their triangles and their octagons. But now I have made them spend six months turned to the left and six months turned to the right...
...I have made them spend six months turned to the left and accomplishing the works of their influences and all their configurations, in order that the rulers who are in the æons and in their spheres and in their heavens and in all their regions, may be confounded in confusion and deluded in delusion, so that they may not understand their own paths."
www.gnosis.org...
like i said its real esoteric and im not sure i truley comprehend exactly what was being reffered too, but i feel that somehow the 13th sign ties in with an alteration made in nature some time in history that corresponds with the disaperance of the 13th sign.
another thing to think about technically the missing sign would be the "9th sign" being between scorpio and sagitarius. that would in turn make pisces the 13th sign. like i said i dont really know what all this means but i felt i just wanted to put these thoughts out there and it looks like you are intrested in some of the same stuff i am.
reply posted on 30-1-2009 @ 07:25 AM by LeoVirgo
reply to post by TheRepublic
Hello Republic!
It excites me to know there are like minds here willing to ponder in those deeper realms.
You brought up some great things and I appreciate you adding to the context of this thread! You are exactly right, the hidden constellation is often mistranslated as the 13th sign, but it is not literally.
Im not sure how long the 13th sign has been a part of the zodiac. Ive studied somewhat on the movements and how over time, the constellations do change. We only have a small part of the Ophiuchus in the zodiac, but it is longer then Scorpio, so its defiantly a part of it.
I have read that Virgo and Scorpio used to be considered ONE constellation. And I dont imagine that through all of Earths past, Ophiuchus was always a part of the zodiac. But it has been for at least a couple thousand yrs and it is very misleading.
The sidereal zodiac, the one that acknowledges Ophiuchus, shows us where the sun really does rise. If I look at the tropical zodiac (the one that makes our silly horoscopes in the news papers and such) it does not show us where the sun really is and the amounts of time the sun is in those signs is wrong also.
Very interesting what you found in the Gnostic gospels. I have never noticed that before and that intrigues me to go read them again in full context.
BTW, the stories of Sophia are some of my absolute favs. If there ever was a fall, at will, to offer a self for the use of a creation....I think Sophia did this...offering herself (wisdom) to men....I also look at this like the Harlot who is misunderstood....the spirit within all that is usually used and abused, taken advantage of....but will one day, be in her rightful place again. Christ, being her counterpart, is trying to save the harlot, the spirit, the wisdom of the ONE.
I bable and often make no sense to others
I also find it interesting that all the great stories of a great teacher seem to revolve around a 12 and a 1 in the center of the 12. Some think the 12 tribes, 12 disciples ect....are the 12 signs....if so , then would that make the great teacher the 13th, the serpent handler? They say Horus also had 12 followers....course all of that is assumptions of some eccentric history....but who knows.
Im curious, how many months are in a moon calendar...is it still 12?
Peace to you,
LV
[edit on 30-1-2009 by LeoVirgo]
Hello Republic!
It excites me to know there are like minds here willing to ponder in those deeper realms.
You brought up some great things and I appreciate you adding to the context of this thread! You are exactly right, the hidden constellation is often mistranslated as the 13th sign, but it is not literally.
Im not sure how long the 13th sign has been a part of the zodiac. Ive studied somewhat on the movements and how over time, the constellations do change. We only have a small part of the Ophiuchus in the zodiac, but it is longer then Scorpio, so its defiantly a part of it.
I have read that Virgo and Scorpio used to be considered ONE constellation. And I dont imagine that through all of Earths past, Ophiuchus was always a part of the zodiac. But it has been for at least a couple thousand yrs and it is very misleading.
The sidereal zodiac, the one that acknowledges Ophiuchus, shows us where the sun really does rise. If I look at the tropical zodiac (the one that makes our silly horoscopes in the news papers and such) it does not show us where the sun really is and the amounts of time the sun is in those signs is wrong also.
Very interesting what you found in the Gnostic gospels. I have never noticed that before and that intrigues me to go read them again in full context.
BTW, the stories of Sophia are some of my absolute favs. If there ever was a fall, at will, to offer a self for the use of a creation....I think Sophia did this...offering herself (wisdom) to men....I also look at this like the Harlot who is misunderstood....the spirit within all that is usually used and abused, taken advantage of....but will one day, be in her rightful place again. Christ, being her counterpart, is trying to save the harlot, the spirit, the wisdom of the ONE.
I bable and often make no sense to others
I also find it interesting that all the great stories of a great teacher seem to revolve around a 12 and a 1 in the center of the 12. Some think the 12 tribes, 12 disciples ect....are the 12 signs....if so , then would that make the great teacher the 13th, the serpent handler? They say Horus also had 12 followers....course all of that is assumptions of some eccentric history....but who knows.
Im curious, how many months are in a moon calendar...is it still 12?
Peace to you,
LV
[edit on 30-1-2009 by LeoVirgo]
reply posted on 30-1-2009 @ 07:37 AM by LeoVirgo
reply to post by muzzleflash
I just wanted to add to the comment you made, even if ancient men drew lines to make signs in the sky....many many many different cultures used the same signs! Also, they didnt find them important for horoscope, the found them important because they show the 'age of time'. Every 2000 yrs, give or take, we enter a new age....its like a clock that has been followed for a very very long time.
Like now for example, is it just happenstance that we see a huge change in beliefs and this 'new age' stuff while we are in between ages? To me, it seems this happens every time human kind is in between ages. We can clearly see in the past of mankind being aware that they were in the time of a changing age and their religions seem to adjust according to that new age. Some think that the sphinx was built on the cusp of Leo and Virgo....which would mean the sphinx might have been a lion and a woman. The sphinx means...to bind together....so mabey there was more importance then what we might think. Mabey it is a cosmic clock...
LV
I just wanted to add to the comment you made, even if ancient men drew lines to make signs in the sky....many many many different cultures used the same signs! Also, they didnt find them important for horoscope, the found them important because they show the 'age of time'. Every 2000 yrs, give or take, we enter a new age....its like a clock that has been followed for a very very long time.
Like now for example, is it just happenstance that we see a huge change in beliefs and this 'new age' stuff while we are in between ages? To me, it seems this happens every time human kind is in between ages. We can clearly see in the past of mankind being aware that they were in the time of a changing age and their religions seem to adjust according to that new age. Some think that the sphinx was built on the cusp of Leo and Virgo....which would mean the sphinx might have been a lion and a woman. The sphinx means...to bind together....so mabey there was more importance then what we might think. Mabey it is a cosmic clock...
LV
reply posted on 30-1-2009 @ 08:58 AM by wycky
reply to post by LeoVirgo
I am starting to develop an interest in this topic, im finding it very interesting. One thing i find odd about it is that, its always referred to as "New Age" when this method of reading the stars, whether it be for to understand the universe, determine the years, seasons, ages etc or religion its one of if not the oldest ways of doing them all, so why is it "New Age".???
I am starting to develop an interest in this topic, im finding it very interesting. One thing i find odd about it is that, its always referred to as "New Age" when this method of reading the stars, whether it be for to understand the universe, determine the years, seasons, ages etc or religion its one of if not the oldest ways of doing them all, so why is it "New Age".???
reply posted on 30-1-2009 @ 09:53 AM by LeoVirgo
reply to post by wycky
Hello wycky
I too wonder this. I think its the way the former unite consciousness does this when its hard to concept that there is a change going on, and it might not be a negative change like the religions want to believe.
2000 yrs ago, Im sure the Christians, Essene, ect....were considered new age also, the former having trouble accepting the change of a knowledge or wisdom....each age contains a wisdom, I believe. And we should not fear them...but learn from them.
I kinda laugh because I bet this is not the first time the words 'new age' has been a part of mankind and the changing/evolving of the whole unit of us.
Another new age I see as example was when the people made the golden calf, under Moses, they were having trouble accepting a 'new age'.
And I dont take lightly that great teachers were often related to the path or sight of a star. So really, what is the ancient knowledge of a star prophecy about....is it not following the stars? And then the ones that dont understand it....run wild with it, molding it into a orthodox belief system.
Am I rambling...
LV
Hello wycky
I too wonder this. I think its the way the former unite consciousness does this when its hard to concept that there is a change going on, and it might not be a negative change like the religions want to believe.
2000 yrs ago, Im sure the Christians, Essene, ect....were considered new age also, the former having trouble accepting the change of a knowledge or wisdom....each age contains a wisdom, I believe. And we should not fear them...but learn from them.
I kinda laugh because I bet this is not the first time the words 'new age' has been a part of mankind and the changing/evolving of the whole unit of us.
Another new age I see as example was when the people made the golden calf, under Moses, they were having trouble accepting a 'new age'.
And I dont take lightly that great teachers were often related to the path or sight of a star. So really, what is the ancient knowledge of a star prophecy about....is it not following the stars? And then the ones that dont understand it....run wild with it, molding it into a orthodox belief system.
Am I rambling...
LV
reply posted on 30-1-2009 @ 11:52 AM by Indellkoffer
I used to do astrology.
The sky is divided into 12 sections, and they are named after the constellations. They aren't actually matched up with the constellations in the sky because some are bigger and some are smaller.
In order to figure out your sun sign, you actually need to look at a real astrological chart. You could have your sun on the cusp of Aries-Taurus (like mine) but have a significant clump of planets in Aquarius (as I do), which means you're more an Aquarian than a Taurean.
Try this page. It's pretty good:
astro-software.com...
The sky is divided into 12 sections, and they are named after the constellations. They aren't actually matched up with the constellations in the sky because some are bigger and some are smaller.
In order to figure out your sun sign, you actually need to look at a real astrological chart. You could have your sun on the cusp of Aries-Taurus (like mine) but have a significant clump of planets in Aquarius (as I do), which means you're more an Aquarian than a Taurean.
Try this page. It's pretty good:
astro-software.com...
reply posted on 30-1-2009 @ 11:56 AM by Indellkoffer
Originally posted by wycky
reply to post by LeoVirgo
I am starting to develop an interest in this topic, im finding it very interesting. One thing i find odd about it is that, its always referred to as "New Age" when this method of reading the stars, whether it be for to understand the universe, determine the years, seasons, ages etc or religion its one of if not the oldest ways of doing them all, so why is it "New Age".???
Because the "methods" date back to the 1970's, when there was a sudden upswing of interest in it. We were all looking for a "new enlightenment" and a "new age" of prosperity and peace. Listen to (or read) the music from "Hair" sometime... you'll "get it."
I'll be honest... some of it is just really lame and some of it is made up. They try to "channel" new knowledge, but (if you're into things like Pagan Reconstructionism) it quickly becomes obvious that they're just making it all up.
The idea of universal harmony is wonderful, but the "flowers and bunnies and fairies and sparkles" philosophy just... doesn't work. And after awhile, the very thin and sugary inspirational concepts (called "glurges") are tiresome.
reply posted on 30-1-2009 @ 12:11 PM by LeoVirgo
reply to post by Indellkoffer
Im not following what you are saying. Are you talking about methods of horoscopes, or the ancient ways of keeping time of ages.
1970? What are you talking about that started in 1970....I think we are discussing something going back alot further then 1970.
There is nothing new about new age....was the point being made. And new age stuff happens every couple thousands yrs. It just so happens that before this flop of time happens, we witnessed the hippie movement ect....allowing people to look outside of the box.
There is nothing new though about looking at the zodiac as a cosmic clock.
No one said anything about flowers, fairies or fluffy stuff...oh, I mean sparkles....
can you clarify where your coming from on that pls...
thanks LV
Im not following what you are saying. Are you talking about methods of horoscopes, or the ancient ways of keeping time of ages.
1970? What are you talking about that started in 1970....I think we are discussing something going back alot further then 1970.
There is nothing new about new age....was the point being made. And new age stuff happens every couple thousands yrs. It just so happens that before this flop of time happens, we witnessed the hippie movement ect....allowing people to look outside of the box.
There is nothing new though about looking at the zodiac as a cosmic clock.
No one said anything about flowers, fairies or fluffy stuff...oh, I mean sparkles....
can you clarify where your coming from on that pls...
thanks LV
reply posted on 30-1-2009 @ 12:19 PM by LeoVirgo
reply to post by Indellkoffer
HI ya again,
I think as a whole unit, mankind has always been seeking for growth spiritually, its not so much you gain knowledge, but realize your a part of everything.
Its easy to take certain groups that claim a channeling and label then all seekers with this same perspective, but some people are simply seekers, without the sparkly stuff.....
I think by looking back through history, we see how man has always felt connected to the stars. Its no biggie, unless you make it that way.
Some really believe, as above, so below....and mabey it all ties together to show a timeline of sorts.
Just thoughts,
LV
HI ya again,
I think as a whole unit, mankind has always been seeking for growth spiritually, its not so much you gain knowledge, but realize your a part of everything.
Its easy to take certain groups that claim a channeling and label then all seekers with this same perspective, but some people are simply seekers, without the sparkly stuff.....
I think by looking back through history, we see how man has always felt connected to the stars. Its no biggie, unless you make it that way.
Some really believe, as above, so below....and mabey it all ties together to show a timeline of sorts.
Just thoughts,
LV
reply posted on 10-2-2009 @ 11:22 AM by LeoVirgo
reply to post by wycky
xpress.sfsu.edu...
science.nasa.gov...
www.geocities.com...
www.glyphweb.com...
www.constellationsofwords.com...
Ill express again that I believe there is more to constellations then horoscopes. I believe the zodiac can be like a clock, showing ages of time and a cycle of happenings in the Universe. I think this is why many ancient cultures built their stones relating to a place in the sky, knowing that over time, the ages slowly change. Mabey its happen stance, or mabey as above so below really has some meaning in the stars.
Even though I dont take to horoscopes, it was really strange finding out that the sun did not rise in Virgo like I thought it did on my birth....
Ophiuchus is now seeing many religious beliefs and new age thoughts trying to work Ophiuchus into the prophecies and 2012. Not sure what I think about all of that....but interesting nothing less that it has been within the zodiac range for over 2000 yrs. and I just now learned of it within the last few yrs. of my life.
Is it a coincidence that Jesus is related to the fish, in the age of the fish...or the golden calf was made in the days of Moses, while the people were adjusting between two ages.....are we today, seeing the change in humans and their consciousness awareness because we are in between ages again?
Interesting to me...
LV
xpress.sfsu.edu...
science.nasa.gov...
www.geocities.com...
www.glyphweb.com...
www.constellationsofwords.com...
Ill express again that I believe there is more to constellations then horoscopes. I believe the zodiac can be like a clock, showing ages of time and a cycle of happenings in the Universe. I think this is why many ancient cultures built their stones relating to a place in the sky, knowing that over time, the ages slowly change. Mabey its happen stance, or mabey as above so below really has some meaning in the stars.
Even though I dont take to horoscopes, it was really strange finding out that the sun did not rise in Virgo like I thought it did on my birth....
Ophiuchus is now seeing many religious beliefs and new age thoughts trying to work Ophiuchus into the prophecies and 2012. Not sure what I think about all of that....but interesting nothing less that it has been within the zodiac range for over 2000 yrs. and I just now learned of it within the last few yrs. of my life.
Is it a coincidence that Jesus is related to the fish, in the age of the fish...or the golden calf was made in the days of Moses, while the people were adjusting between two ages.....are we today, seeing the change in humans and their consciousness awareness because we are in between ages again?
Interesting to me...
LV
reply posted on 10-2-2009 @ 11:28 AM by LeoVirgo
If we look at the zodiac, ages, starting with Leo and ending with Virgo....Aquarious sits in the middle...which is the cusp of the age we are on. Are
we at a half way point? If so, does that mean something for the evolving of the Earth or species?
ancientegypt.hypermart.net...
ancientegypt.hypermart.net...
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