My mothers near death experience-video

Look Imago...

The only reason I told you to go back and re read was you assumed that Badmedia was talking about you attacking him/her and Badmedia was not saying no such thing...

When I debate in a thread....usually I try to make sure I am debating in a thread that has a topic that is up for debating.

I am not pointing fingers...I know we all agree on staying on topic in threads....I know this...it is all good and I look forward for many great talks.

I never said it was any ones fault or whatever....all I am saying is there are many opinions going on here and before I get myself into giving my own opinions as well and really go off topic myself as well...I figured we could all regroup.

It just so happens that I disagree with many things you say....if I was going to join in the discussion I would of likely been responding to you...so I posted my concern to you.

No biggie

I have thought about her experience some recently. I don't think I've posted this yet, but excuse me if I hadn't. I went over the thread and didn't see, but I stopped looking once the arguments started.

The 2 parts of the experience that struck me as having the most meaning were the cleaning up of the blood, and Jesus building the house alone.

Matthew 9
13 Go and learn what this means, ‘I desire mercy, not sacrifice.’ For I have come to call not the righteous but sinners.

He is of course quoting Hosea 6.

Hosea 6

5Therefore have I hewed them by the prophets; I have slain them by the words of my mouth: and thy judgments are as the light that goeth forth.

6For I desired mercy, and not sacrifice; and the knowledge of God more than burnt offerings.

7But they like men have transgressed the covenant: there have they dealt treacherously against me.

8Gilead is a city of them that work iniquity, and is polluted with blood.

I think up until that point Grandma had desired sacrifice rather than knowledge of god. She desired blood, and so it was blood that she got. Obviously she did not desire the blood to get the blood, but she got what she desired. The cleaning up of the blood IMO represents that she needed to clean up the errors.

This I think in combination with the 2nd point. The building of the house by Jesus. Well, we all know that Jesus was a "carpenter". Most people assume that means working with wood and building physical houses. That is also what you saw in your experience. However, he actually builds houses of a different manner. Him being a carpenter represents more than just a job/career/skill etc.

The last super with Jesus is a repeat of Proverbs 9. A reenactment. In proverbs 9, it is "wisdom" that is the carpenter that builds the house.

Proverbs 9

1Wisdom hath builded her house, she hath hewn out her seven pillars:

2She hath killed her beasts; she hath mingled her wine; she hath also furnished her table.

3She hath sent forth her maidens: she crieth upon the highest places of the city,

4Whoso is simple, let him turn in hither: as for him that wanteth understanding, she saith to him,

5Come, eat of my bread, and drink of the wine which I have mingled.

6Forsake the foolish, and live; and go in the way of understanding.

7He that reproveth a scorner getteth to himself shame: and he that rebuketh a wicked man getteth himself a blot.

8Reprove not a scorner, lest he hate thee: rebuke a wise man, and he will love thee.

9Give instruction to a wise man, and he will be yet wiser: teach a just man, and he will increase in learning.

10The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom: and the knowledge of the holy is understanding.

11For by me thy days shall be multiplied, and the years of thy life shall be increased.

12If thou be wise, thou shalt be wise for thyself: but if thou scornest, thou alone shalt bear it.

With the last super, we see the house, the table, the bread and the wine, and Jesus says his flesh and blood represents those things. What he is doing there is helping those people build their house by giving them wisdom and understanding, which he does in the flesh with an example etc.

Thus, I think this is what Jesus building that house represents. He is trying to help people build their houses(churches), which is built out of understanding and wisdom.

As such, we are back full circle to the Matthew 9 and Hosea 6 quotes. Seek the knowledge of god - helping Jesus build that house rather than desiring the sacrifice and blood - that which you were cleaning up.

Oddly enough it seems the experience itself did exactly that for you, as by default you started to question that which you believed and started to seek knowledge of god on your own. But for some reason those 2 things just kind of jumped out at me in meaning.

reply to post by badmedia


badmedia:

Wow, I was so moved by how you broke down my NDE in these two areas. The cleaning up of the blood well, it still makes me afraid and it feels like it will never be cleaned up. And when I saw Jesus building the house alone, I felt so sad.

You have helped me understand what I experienced much better, and I thank you.





Shalom,
Grandma

reply to post by Grandma


I hope it is helpful. I think it's a great metaphor and what made me think about it was every time I would quote those verses or debate on that topic - I kept thinking about your experience in this manner. It's like your experience is ingrained in my head, and I even can somewhat "see" it. For whatever reason those things stuck with me.

I don't like the way people treat Jesus.

Just wanted to chime in within a thank you to Grandma and her family. This thread came and went "before my time" here at ATS, and so I wasn't aware of these videos until now.

It was very interesting to see Grandma explaining her experiences, and generous of everyone involved to share them here. Thank you.

reply to post by badmedia


Very nicely said there Badmedia...thanks for sharing your thoughts here

And to eightbits....Your very welcome, from the 'family'. Its nice to know others are glad we have shared this.

My best to all
LV

A very moving video, and it's great that you have faith in what shes saying.

As a non-believer i'd have to say that your mother is using her 'visions' as a way of painting her own version of what she thinks she'll be going to in the afterlife, which is great.

But do i actually believe that she, or anyone has 'near death experiences' that lead them to see Heaven and God? No, sorry i just don't, as sweet as her portrayal was.

reply to post by Lister87


Thanks for adding thoughts Lister87!

I think that each person is on a different vibration of learning about the spiritual self. I think that after death, a marker is made, showing where the spiritual self is at and what more it needs to learn.

If my mother was creating her idea of her own after life, like you suggested....the last thing that would of came out of her mouth would of been that the Egyptians were not wrong in their idea of God and Ra...as well as she never would of thought her mother would of been reborn...for she did not consider reincarnation of second chances...until after this experience.

So as much as I also think we have a lot to do with creating our place of 'rest' in between our phases of 'learning'.....for some reason, she experienced a few different things that went against her own belief. This is why I find it all so fascinating. But always, each to their own...with all due respect.

LV

I also dont think (imo) that she saw God or heaven...but she was in a place that was still very attatched to this Earth Sphere.

[edit on 9-1-2010 by LeoVirgo]

Not to take anything away from your mother, but people see what they want to see in near death experiences. Some see Jesus, some see Allah, others see hookers. It's all about perception and what you're willing to believe. Seeing what you believe in a near death experience might help you make the transition so to speak when you're actually going to die.

Not trying to ruin a good thing here,but I have always wondered if satan is a spiritual entity,and can speak to people in the spiritual realm (which he does)and he can be like an angel of light (portraying himself to be even as Christ is),then why couldnt some of these experiences be from lieing deceptive spirits while man is in a vulnerable position (like very sick and on deaths door).And possibly spiritually weak as well .

So maybe the NDEs really do need to be examined and tested a bit more before we all jump to the conclusion that they are all Godly enlightenment (instead of satanic deceptions)because I think there is sufficient evidence showing that it is possible that they are attempts from spirits to deceive and turn people away from the true Lord Jesus Christ of the bible .(You know the one who says that there will be many come and claim HIS NAME and show themselves to be as ANGELS of LIGHT)



I thought this covers alot about how we should view alot of NDEs (my Mom had one too so I am not just a skeptic who isnt familiar with them)
I know when my Mom woke up she believed that everyone was gonna be saved (which she believed otherwise for more than 20 years prior to this).She had TWO NDEs one of hell (which was horrifying to her)and one of a space type encounter with Christ .


Here is that link to an alternative view on NDEs other than whats been posted on here .

Just a snip since I dont know the rules anymore lol .


[One of the most common characteristics of the so-called near-death experience is encountering a being of light. This being is said to emanate love and warmth.

It has been claimed by numerous (not all) individuals who have had alleged near-death experiences that the being of light they encountered was none other than Jesus Christ. As appealing as the idea may initially sound, this identification seems to be flawed in view of the fact that the so-called being of light typically says and does things contrary to the Christ of the Bible. Since Jesus is the same yesterday, today, and forever (Hebrews 13:8), it would be impossible that these are one and the same Jesus. I believe that many of the individuals who go through near-death experiences actually encounter a counterfeit Christ.

The “Jesus” (being of light) typically encountered in near-death experiences teaches such things as:

* Death is good and is not to be feared.
* Sin is not a problem. In fact, this “Jesus” often responds to human sin and shortcomings with humor.
* There is no hell to worry about.
* All people are welcome to heaven, regardless of whether one has placed faith in Christ.
* All religions are equally valid.

In view of the fact that these ideas clearly go against what the biblical Jesus taught, I think we have good reason to conclude that this “Jesus” is in fact a lying spirit.
THE REST AT LINK
www.christiananswers.net... ]


If we are supposed to TEST every spirit (how can you know if they are from GOd ?Test it against the WORD OF GOD and if it is CONTRARY to his teachings then it is not from God )then surely we should also test the spirits we encounter in the spirit world since that is the world of which they come from and exist in ..so if your in that spirit world I hardly think you would be exempt from being deceived .Isnt this why we are not supposed to get into things like hypnosis etc because we will be in a vulnerable state of mind in the spirit world and it can be dangerous and certainly can deceive you on your beliefs with SUGGESTIONS or suggestive visions etc .........

I have always believed thats what happens when people get hypnotized and asked all about past lives .It is suggestive hypnosis that takes them to that place (blank) where spirits can channel info to those people.
I think this can happen in a NDE too .






[edit on 14-1-2010 by Simplynoone]

reply to post by Simplynoone


Such is to say people are given the serpent when they ask for a fish. It's really nothing but a broad dismissal because it isn't in line with your beliefs.

Matthew 7

7Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you:

8For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.

9Or what man is there of you, whom if his son ask bread, will he give him a stone?

10Or if he ask a fish, will he give him a serpent?

11If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children, how much more shall your Father which is in heaven give good things to them that ask him?

But you say that what the father gives must be from Satan, and based on it being "too good", and against your beliefs.

Btw, can you show where the things you mention are against what Jesus said? Because I'm not seeing it.

Originally posted by eight bits
Just wanted to chime in within a thank you to Grandma and her family. This thread came and went "before my time" here at ATS, and so I wasn't aware of these videos until now.

It was very interesting to see Grandma explaining her experiences, and generous of everyone involved to share them here. Thank you.

Ditto exactly !!
Much luv to you all and badmedia's biblical references were
timely and humbling!!

[Btw, can you show where the things you mention are against what Jesus said? Because I'm not seeing it.]


And you wont see it because you dont take the bible as a whole and you dont read it in context (Not getting the whole picture and not even wanting to ) (because it doesnt fit in with your own personal belief)..You pick and choose what you want from it and leave the rest ...And this is one of the very reasons why when you ask for a fish you get a serpent .
This is why many many are deceived including alot of those horrible christians that you go on and on about .(which I get ya on that one and agree that some of them are horrible and are NOT true Christians)....


Im not gonna get into this with you again Badmedia ..
Your beliefs as we have already determined do not line up with the bible.
But you say that the bible (Most of the NT and the OT)does not line up with your beliefs (That the apostles were false witnesses)..
So which one should we toss ? I guess the bible eh ? NOT >.

reply to post by Simplynoone


I do not pick and choose what to believe in the bible. I tell you what I see is right and wrong in it, at least in the way it is presented. It's not like I decided oh I will take this part, and that part and yay! Very specific things I mention.

If you don't want to back up your claims and just dismiss me, I guess that is your choice.

* There is no hell to worry about.
* All people are welcome to heaven, regardless of whether one has placed faith in Christ.
* All religions are equally valid.

But I will humor you once again ...


There is plenty written in the WORD about there being a place of TORMENT (a hell) and
There are also plenty of scriptures about there being TWO WAYS (One is the way to DEATH and one is the way to Everlasting life) Doesnt sound to me like there are many ways JUST TWO >>
Narrow is the way and few there be that find that way

If all paths lead to God then there would have been no need for JESUS CHRIST to have come and did all that he did ..As there are many Harry Karishna types who could have lead the way (as you say been a good example to mankind to have them follow them to goodness and light as you say)


Jesus said himself that he would send a comforter (The Holy Spirit) that spirit comes from the father THROUGH CHRIST ONLY to live within you upon belief and then obedience to him .(faith without works is dead and works without faith is dead as well )
Then no other can OFFER THAT SPIRIT TO YOU now can they ?

I dont see how anyone can believe that Jesus Christ was just a similar prophet etc to that of Mohammed or Karishna or whoever ..
HE WAS NOT ...he is a ONE OF A KIND SON OF GOD >...(LOOK UP ONLY BEGOTTEN)

reply to post by Simplynoone


Hello Simplynoones....hope all is well with you.

You bring up great questions....and surly God would not hold our questions or doubts against us, for things we do not know.

If ones intent is true, and God would allow such a trick to them, while on their death bed....then this is not the God I have come to know.

How do you know, that some of your 'word of God' that you use to test everything through....is not guided by a evil entity who would love to not only mislead one lady, but the mass of mankind? How do you test your 'book' as a spiritual wisdom?

What makes God different from 'evil entities'? Is there a difference in nature between the two?

We read that things like lying, cheating, stealing, boastfulness, pride, ect are of 'satan'. But yet, I know and can face my lower self enough, to admit, I needed to experience all of those things, to know, this was not my spiritual self and these were things I needed to work on. The good and the bad offers something for us, one way or the other.

I know that mother and I both had talked alot and did alot of focusing on God, the good for mankind, and the teacher Jesus before her experience. The actions that I was felt to do (fasting, insane amounts of reading and understanding for nights and nights on end, facing my lower natures and accepting them as my own shortcomings, deep cleansing of my mind and body, I feel was the first thing that showed me, this was of a good nature.

How does one test things through the Holy Spirit? I think this is a journey for each individual to figure out for themselves. All I can say, is that the way the Holy Spirit seemed to of lead me was through direct teaching to things I would find a deep spiritual understanding in. I really cant even begin to tell others how many things I had to learn and search to know more about the history of the Holy Spirit being a humble teacher of mankind in many places at many times. The key here for me is to understand first what does 'Holy' mean.....What does 'spirit' mean. Your most inner self is the place that you should test with the Holy Spirit. Your deepest core holds the answers.

What I have experienced....is many people interpret the Bible differently....but when a person (the majority) talks about direct learning from the Holy Spirit....and even Jesus....I dont ever hear how the Holy Spirit or Jesus has taught them about a wrathful God or that warns of reasons to fear death or God or life itself.

I have never read about a near death experience where Jesus found humor about sin....but I do know, that God knows and Jesus knows, we have to sin to learn things. We might not realize it till much later, the lessons that the sin held for us, to learn about our lower nature, to discern now from a spiritual nature....but God knows we have reason, God knows that we learn through our mistakes, God knows that there is much we cant see, Gods not expecting us to just follow in a way a prior man walked....for this takes away a personal journey to God for a another person. You can find insight to another experience, through a book, or reading or listening to it....but dont let that be YOUR truth....for God has something to show each one of us.

Just because you pray or read the Bible does mean you have reached the limits of what God has to show you. In fact, I know that it does not stop there for you....but that is for you to find out for yourself.

If you are so caught up in fearing being mislead....if God had something to show you, how would your eyes be able to see?

Have faith....that God....is not a trickster or allowing us to all be tricked. Sure we have temptations....of this Earth....and temptations.....of different natures within man....but if your intents are true, then know that God knows this, have trust in the fact that God knows your heart, have faith in the fact that Jesus will lead you and help you, if he is the one you call on.

If you call on Jesus for guidance....I believe, nothing else can guide you then....if your intent is true of heart and true of things of spirit.

Its hard to tell another how I personally discern what is of spirit or not, for there is know why at all to go into every detail of study and spiritual time that I have spent on this in my life. It was like being plunged into a binging on learning 'what is of spirit'.

I have learned, that each of us has a lower nature that is attatched to Earth. This is the origins of each persons 'evils'. These are things a person needs to work on....but many do not. Im going to take this one step farther before I go....from what I have learned, on my path, is that my ideas of acceptance of Jesus having to die and the idea that God needed all of those blood sacrafices in the OT....the idea that I could believe this as God....was my lower nature coming threough. These things used to be markers for my soul, showing what I have learned and what I have not. As I learned that God never required death for anything....I learned about my lower nature within me, my own natures of Earth that I had to face and over come. This was not fun mind you, its not fun to learn about our shortcomings....but, there was understanding with it all, which is what makes such facings of self, barable. It wasnt that I was evil....but it was something I had to learn about, it had purpose...my lower Earthly nature had purpose. As I learned about Gods nature and saw the humbleness of God and the heavens.....I can only describe it as being 'raised up' both in nature, and in spirit. It changed me within, a light shined brighter in me and all saw it as so. I didnt have to tell anyone what was going on....for they were asking me....why this light was bursting forth.

This life here is not happenstance for you. Everything that you can ever think of that has happened to you, is not happenstance. You have your own lower nature to face...and you have others lower natures to deal with. Dont blame those that did not know what they do....send love to them, for it is the strongest conquer of all. When one can understand such ways, they have begun truly touched what holds heaven together. Love is the center of all things that have to do with ....God.

If there was a 'satan'....and God allowed this 'satan' to trick my mother.... when my mother had dedicated her life to Jesus and God for the past 30 years....how could God hold it against her for the things she did not know?

But again....this is not the nature of God that I walk with. Its easy for me to say..."I just know".

Love LV

reply to post by badmedia



Yes you do since you only read and only give creedence to the WORDS IN RED oh and the book of John (Parts of it )..totally discarding Paul,Matthew,Mark,Luke etc ...

Another thing you wont listen to any scripture I may offer so whats the point ?


Also reincarnation ..If we did have many lives to go through to get it right then we wouldnt need Jesus as an example now would we ..Because we could certainly figure things out on our own after thousands of years of being here over and over again ...


[edit on 15-1-2010 by Simplynoone]

LV it is pretty obvious that you have shared your view many a time with your momma and you are very good at convincing people of your way of thinking .I see her doubt her own faith many a time on here because of your convincing arguments against the word and against the role that the Lord Jesus Christ plays in our lives (Your so all love and light why wouldnt anyone believe your an angel of light type and know the right way ?)

So whats to say that your views and her doubts didnt bring that experience on ?
And would have swayed the outcome of the experience (she actually changed her own beliefs that she has had for many years because of it ) .

We are to TEST THE SPIRITS especially ones that try to take you away from what the word of God has taught us from the beginning (As there is MUCH DECEPTION in this world)..how can we test them if we have nothing to test them against >(Which is the whole purpose of the word of GOD) ..........


The OT God was not satan he was and is the same God that we see in the NT ..The Bible was not written for control of the masses but for the masses to NOT ALLOW the world to CONTROL them but to learn SELF CONTROL .
Jesus was the SON OF GOD (ONLY SON) And is the ONLY WAY ONE CAN COME TO THE FATHER <
We do not have many lives ...and Allah,Buddah and Karishna and (Insert your fav prophet here) are not THE WAY neither will you find the way when following them ........................
And not any old ancient text will do when seeking to find the Lord Jesus Christ and GOD the father as not many of them even DISCUSS the Lord Jesus Christ ..In fact they are pretty ANTI JESUS now arnt they ?
(These are just a few of the things you teach that are just not in line with the word of God )





[edit on 15-1-2010 by Simplynoone]

reply to post by Simplynoone


We all have our time to be 'begotten'. We all have our time to reach heaven. Some might have many lives before this happens.

I have explained many times to others...Gods word is within life itself. God did not leave us the book....man did. Is there Gods nature found with in the book? For those who can discern what is of man and what is of God...yes, there is.

Some do experience a 'hell' but this is connected to their own shortcomings and misunderstandings. It is a place for them to learn...not a place of eternity.

A parent (a true parent) never gives up on a child.

Sins are not a mistake...for they will teach us about our lower self...so we can face the seeds we have sown.

To think that all truths of what you need to knwo about God are in a book that is destroyable and of material things....then one is not understanding the purpose of a personal journey to the spirit.

Its not just about belief and obedience. If there is no spiritual understandings of the belief or the 'ways' of living in spirit....then what purpose does it really hold?

Jesus's life is full of meaning....but those that cant ont see due to their lower nature....only see the purpose in his death and not his life.

How great is it...that he preached to others to not fight for this life....turn the other cheek....and that he PRACTICED what he preached. It is so great because this shows how much he beleived in what he taught. He didnt loose his 'belief' when he had to face that people wanted him to die. He stood sure footed that he was fighting for th elife of spirit. This is not meaningless at all.

He showed how to sow good seeds. But yet many that claim they follow Jesus....are not sowing good seeds. Killing and the belief that man had to kill is not a good seed.

Jesus spoke against the main way of the people, and they hated him for pulling their rug of comfort beneath them.

Not many can practice what they preach when their life of flesh stands on the line. But Jesus did...and for this, he was great in spirit.

He brought parables to us that have spiritual understandings within them. For this...he was great in spirit. He didnt teach in a way for all to understand....he taught in a way that those of spirit would understand.

Badmedia you quoted Hebrews but you left out part of it (IT HAS TO BE TAKEN IN CONTEXT )



Hbr 10:8 Above when he said, Sacrifice and offering and burnt offerings and [offering] for sin thou wouldest not, neither hadst pleasure [therein]; which are offered by the law;
Hbr 10:9 Then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first, that he may establish the second.
Hbr 10:10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once [for all].
Hbr 10:11 ¶ And every priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins:
Hbr 10:12 But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God;
Hbr 10:13 From henceforth expecting till his enemies be made his footstool.
Hbr 10:14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.
Hbr 10:15 [Whereof] the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before,
Hbr 10:16 This [is] the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;
Hbr 10:17 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.
Hbr 10:18 Now where remission of these [is, there is] no more offering for sin.
Hbr 10:19 ¶ Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus,
Hbr 10:20 By a new and living way, which he hath consecrated for us, through the veil, that is to say, his flesh;
Hbr 10:21 And [having] an high priest over the house of God;
Hbr 10:22 Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.
Hbr 10:23 Let us hold fast the profession of [our] faith without wavering; (for he [is] faithful that promised

I just dont see how you two can discard these scriptures when your discussing the Lord and saying there was no need for his sacrifice of his life.