Are we in the End Times according to the Prophet John�s image in Revelations?

Yes,
We are living in the end times.

Daniel's Vision, my interpretation-

Head of Gold - Babylon
Chest and Arms of Silver - Meades and Persians
Belly and Thighs of Bronze - Greek
Legs of Iron - Roman Empire
Feet of Iron and Baked Clay- Current (UN)( See United Nations Millenium Declaration)
Stone - Second coming.

Daniel 7:23-27
(23)Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be a fourth kingdom upon earth, which shall be diverse from all the kingdoms, and shall devour the whole earth, and shall tread it down, and break it in pieces. (24)And as for the ten horns, out of this kingdom shall ten kings arise: and another shall arise after them; and he shall be diverse from the former, and he shall put down three kings. (25)And he shall speak words against the Most High, and shall wear out the saints of the Most High; and he shall think to change the times and the law; and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and half a time. (26)But the judgment shall be set, and they shall take away his dominion, to consume and to destroy it unto the end. (27)And the kingdom and the dominion, and the greatness of the kingdoms under the whole heaven, shall be given to the people of the saints of the Most High: his kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, and all dominions shall serve and obey him.
*some see a link between GWB and the "little" horn.
Ten Regions as proposed by the Club of Rome to the UN:
1. North America
2. Western Europe
3. Japan
4. Israel, South Africa, Austraila
5. Eastern Europe (Russia)
6. Latin America
7. North Africa and the Middle East
8. Main Africa
9. South and Southeast Asia
10. Central Asia (China)
It is my feeling that after the next elections in the US and UK, we will see great pushes through the UN, this may possibly be replaced by NATO, for economic zones. As things like NAFTA, FTAA, etc get put into play the prophesy of the 10 kings begins to be fullfilled.

The WTO is acting as the administrative branch of the UN in developing these zones.
www.tdctrade.com...

However, what I do not understan is Daniel 9:26, It refers to the messiah being killed again, by his own people. Matthew 24:15 seems to support that this will happen under the antichrist and these times are to come.

World Income Tax
www.house.gov...
World Court - Established International Criminal Court

Also see the Earth Charter-
My hope is that this charter will be a kind of Ten Commandments, a "Sermon on the Mount," that provides a guide for human behavior toward the environment in the next century and beyond.

� Mikhail Gorbachev

Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools. And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things. Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness, through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves: Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen.

Romans 1:22-25 (KJV)

www.thenewamerican.com...
www.born-again-christian.info...
www.conspiracyarchive.com...

Originally posted by ET3
Care to give that passage in Revelations where Daniel's image is?

Did Daniel write Revelations?

Thank you for pointing this out. I stand corrected.

Since the dawn of civilization there has always been someone claiming we are in the end of time. Bible verses can be interrepted so many ways, i would have to see some real signs for me to believe the end is near.

[Edited on 22-3-2004 by jrod]

Originally posted by Amuk
I dont see how you can get around Jesus telling the people on the mount that they would live to see the end of the world.

Amuk... Exactly

He said it himself

Luke 9:27
But I tell you of a truth, there be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the kingdom of God.

Luke 21:32
Verily I say unto you. This generation shall not pass away, till all be fulfilled

Originally posted by Illmatic67
I don't see the world persecuting Christians because of Jesus' name.

Seeing that Christians and Jews run the world, I see Muslims being persecuted and murdered because of Islam.

Wrong. Some Muslims are killed in combat.

And where are these Jews that run the world, I mean come on dude Christians maybe, but Jews?

Very frankly, it is a wonder The Revelation was included in the Bible! In fact, some honest research indicates that it almost was not. As to its coded prophesies, one must examine the time at which it was written, about 65 AD. That was a tumultuous period with an Emperor was literally mad as bats. Nero persecuted Christians horribly, feeding them to lions and such. And there were false prophets then as has been the case in every era since that that time. Of course, huge earthquakes rocked continents (like the New Madrid quake around 1700) and constantly, wars and rumors of wars for 2000 years.

I agree with Thomas Jefferson, third US president, about the book, that it is "the ravings of a madman." There is one thing I fear about it though: self-fulfulling prophesy. Enough powerful people with apocalyptic visions certainly could try to make it happen. Hmmm, do you suppose that was what Jesus really wanted all along and was just masquerading behind the message of love and forgiveness?

Does anybody know what God promised, sealed with a rainbow? As many children know, that God would not destroy the world with water again, but fire. Sure, fire figures in the manifold plagues unleashed by John in his revelation. But the other scourges make that look like warm breeze in comparison. Basically then, Revelations effectively calls God a liar!

Originally posted by Aeon10101110

Very frankly, it is a wonder The Revelation was included in the Bible! In fact, some honest research indicates that it almost was not. As to its coded prophesies, one must examine the time at which it was written, about 65 AD. That was a tumultuous period with an Emperor was literally mad as bats. Nero persecuted Christians horribly, feeding them to lions and such. And there were false prophets then as has been the case in every era since that that time. Of course, huge earthquakes rocked continents (like the New Madrid quake around 1700) and constantly, wars and rumors of wars for 2000 years.

I agree with Thomas Jefferson, third US president, about the book, that it is "the ravings of a madman." There is one thing I fear about it though: self-fulfulling prophesy. Enough powerful people with apocalyptic visions certainly could try to make it happen. Hmmm, do you suppose that was what Jesus really wanted all along and was just masquerading behind the message of love and forgiveness?

Does anybody know what God promised, sealed with a rainbow? As many children know, that God would not destroy the world with water again, but fire. Sure, fire figures in the manifold plagues unleashed by John in his revelation. But the other scourges make that look like warm breeze in comparison. Basically then, Revelations effectively calls God a liar!

TOTALLY.......I mean why take out books like the Macabees, Thomas etc........ and leave that indecipherable garbage in? I think the church knew they could use it to scare people into keep coming to church. If we can't get people to come to church then they make no money.

Oh, so sad.



"A little lie may not be believed at all, but a big lie, if repeated with sufficient vigor and frequency, will eventually take deep root in the minds of the uninformed masses."
- Joseph Goebbels, Minister of Propaganda for Adolf Hitler
1933 - 1945

[Another Messenger]


To the Dedicated Thinker and reasoner ,
GanjaGoddess...who wrote: "Feet of Iron and Baked Clay
-Current (UN) (See United Nations Millenium Declaration)

I was instructed that your
Q? on Daniel 9:26---> Actually refers to the

original 'cutting off' of the Messiah, after 62 weeks !

(which corresponds to the 62x7=434 yrs, since 1st Temple till messiah)

Then the soon-to-follow destruction of the
2nd Temple & city [70 CE] by; the people of the Prince that shall come [Romans?!]

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

item #2: the Obsevation that UN/NATO/WTO/NAFTA/FTAA/.....

?add to that list?

the G7 or G8, soon to be G10??

And don't omit World Bank or OPEC or OIC

I sure don't see Islam as not being around at the Armmageddon Battle & final 7 years (70th week) !

[Edited on 23-3-2004 by riffraffalunas]

Originally posted by riffraffalunas
[Another Messenger]


To the Dedicated Thinker and reasoner ,
GanjaGoddess...who wrote: "Feet of Iron and Baked Clay
-Current (UN) (See United Nations Millenium Declaration)

I was instructed that your
Q? on Daniel 9:26---> Actually refers to the

original 'cutting off' of the Messiah, after 62 weeks !

(which corresponds to the 62x7=434 yrs, since 1st Temple till messiah)

Then the soon-to-follow destruction of the
2nd Temple & city [70 CE] by; the people of the Prince that shall come [Romans?!]

I have a very close friend whose father is a pastor, he also holds this theory, and it is the one I tend to lean towards. However, I find it interesting that in a new Life Application Study Bible that I recieved from said pastor, the footnotes mention that there are 3 diverging schools of thought on this. a.) this was fullfilled in the past by the desecration of the temple by Antiochus Epiphanes IV from 168- 167 BC. b.) this was fullfilled in the past at the destruction of the temple by Titus in 70 AD or, c.) it is still to be fullfilled in the future by the under the antichrist (matt 24:15)

However, after giving this some thought, I wonder if this verse isnt instead referring to the antichrist that is to come, not Titus or Antiochus..
www.mindspring.com...

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

item #2: the Obsevation that UN/NATO/WTO/NAFTA/FTAA/.....

?add to that list?

the G7 or G8, soon to be G10??

And don't omit World Bank or OPEC or OIC

I sure don't see Islam as not being around at the Armmageddon Battle & final 7 years (70th week) !



[Edited on 23-3-2004 by riffraffalunas]

And a ruler shall arise whose armies will destroy the city and the temple.... I watch what is going on right now in the Middle East with wonder and wide eyed fascination.

Rantissi just might be the man who can cause mass carnage deep in the heart of Israel. This is not a hope of mine, I am not an armeggedonist. This is simply a prediction.

Thank you for your thoughtful reply

[Edited on 24-3-2004 by GanjaGoddess]

Originally posted by TrickmastertricK

Originally posted by intrepid
If you wish this is my two cents. The past 100 years or so has been the only time that these events have occurred on a global scale.

Agreed, I was just making a statement for arguements sake. I know someone at some point would say you could make a case for it during WWII, but yes they are on a huge global scale now.

Every day is an end of times.
But the Biblical End of Times was written to mean that it was going to happen back in that era. The authors of the NT belonged to sects who were expecting it to occur any day. There's not just Biblical evidence but literature and archeology points to the fact that Jesus, or certainly his followers believed that they were living through the End of Times - it wasn't something that was going to occur thousands of years down the line. For the prophesies to be fulfilled it had to happen then.

And who can blame them? For them, the end of the world would have seemed imminent. Judaism had seemed to have become a pale resemblance of their interpretation of it's origins, the Romans occupied their land, and they were being persecuted and executed left, right and centre.

So the answer to the question? Are we in the End of Times now? No. They've already happened. But not quite as John wrote them and not in the way the literal Bible readers interpret them.

Are we at the end of times?
Yes, I do believe we are!

Many signs are here and happening today at a very fast pace.
People will either choose to ignore them or will follow what is happening.
The choice is yours to accept or not to accept......the days will go past very quickly and months will seem like days and days like hours and hours like seconds....
When the temple in Jerusalem starts to get built (Solomons temple) there on the throne the Antchrist will sit on the throne and declare himself King and God and people shall worship him and those that do not shall be killed or tortured......
The vision of St John -Kronstadt..1901

www.stvladimirs.ca...

I sometimes think people must use religion the same way some people use drugs. You are stoned on your own beliefs.

End of the world, huh? I think it's a scam to keep you in fear and keep you obediant to those who control you. I get the impression that some of you want to see such a thing happen just so you get validation for what you have been conned into believing.

They say prositution is the oldest profession. I expect the second oldest profession was some self proclaimed "holy man" telling the prostitute how bad she was and that for a donation he could save her soul

Yes, that was sarcasm. Am I a bit harsh here? You bet I am. The things you people do and sanction in God's name would land you in your own imaginary Hell, if such a thing existed.

The whole concept of Revelations doesn't seem to me to be the work of a caring, loving, all-powerful, universe creating God. Sounds like something a human would dream up to scare people into obediance.

I apologize for any inconvenience this may cause to some people, but My time needs to be directed elsewhere on this site. I would like to continue an in depth look at the Seals, so if any one wants to continue this journey, or wants My ideas for continuing this, please u2u me.

Thanks

Trick

Originally posted by favouriteslave

Originally posted by Amuk
I dont see how you can get around Jesus telling the people on the mount that they would live to see the end of the world.

Amuk... Exactly

He said it himself

Luke 9:27
But I tell you of a truth, there be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the kingdom of God.

Luke 21:32
Verily I say unto you. This generation shall not pass away, till all be fulfilled

Analysis of Luke 9:27:
When you read the whole chapter, and espically the verses before (Matthew 9:18-27) you see that they are discussing Jesus being the Son of God. Jesus wasn't trying to change the subject. He was simply adding to the discussion. Jesus told them of the future when he would be revealed in his glory, and then stated that some of them would see this glory.
If anyone is ashamed of me and my words, the Son of Man will be ashamed of him when he comes in his glory and in the glory of the Father and of the holy angels. 27I tell you the truth, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the kingdom of God."

Jesus was speaking of his closest companions Peter, James, and John. If you read the following verses it is clear what He was speaking of. (Luke 9:27-35) 28About eight days after Jesus said this, he took Peter, John and James with him and went up onto a mountain to pray. 29As he was praying, the appearance of his face changed, and his clothes became as bright as a flash of lightning. 30Two men, Moses and Elijah, 31appeared in glorious splendor, talking with Jesus. They spoke about his departure, which he was about to bring to fulfillment at Jerusalem. 32Peter and his companions were very sleepy, but when they became fully awake, they saw his glory and the two men standing with him.

Luke 21:32 can also be understood if you read it in context. Read Luke 21:5-32. While it is true that some verses are stand alone verses, the best way to understand them is to read the surrounding text.

Hope this helps.

It is always the 'End Times' to some religious group. Fear keeps people in line quite well.

I believe in the end it will say the enemys of Isreal will be destroyed

I think that could mean that the "Christianic sides will survive"

and by Isreal it could mean the western "Christianic" countrys

when it says Isreal it could mean

Isreal > Backed by the USA , USA > Once Britain before civil way/independance day Britain > Once ruling power and contained EU (So or i believe around those areas)

Basicly all those countrys are n league with eachother more than the others and are majority christian as opposed to the eastern sides who are Islamic, buddah ect

I also believe the bible says "Jesus word will live on forever and all will accept that he is the true lord" (Not a direct quote)

This could mean that eventualy (with Christianic countrys" surviving everyone will know Jesus name due to everyone being christains due to the christian countys becoming dominent over the rest and spreading the words of Jesus


[Edited on 30-3-2004 by Crash]

I just can't understand how Bible literalists foretell the Endtimes as a forthcoming event.
On this subject, like so many others, the Bible clearly contradicts itself. But to recognise this fact, literalists would have to realise that they are facing dogma and this is something they find very hard to swallow.

The literalists are always very fond of quoting Bible passages. But they always quote the ones that suit their ideas and they very rarely actually look at the ones that prove them wrong.

Jesus clearly says in Matthew:

"I assure you there are some among those standing here who will never taste death before they see the Son of Man coming in his Monarchy. I assure you that thsi generation will not go by before all this happens"

He says almost the exact same thing again in Luke.


Now call me a sceptic but I'm pretty sure that the "generation" Jesus is talking about "tasted death" 2000 years ago.

John's Revelation is a highly spurious peice of work. Even the Church wasn't sure whether to include it in the final Bible. It was probably added to keep the masses in line.

we its believed that we are and also its believed that the bible a hidden message predicting a nuclear holocaust in 2004 (:puz. The world will end in 2006, according to this message, but there's no need to start worrying until it happens.

Originally posted by infinite
we its believed that we are and also its believed that the bible a hidden message predicting a nuclear holocaust in 2004 (:puz

. The world will end in 2006, according to this message, but there's no need to start worrying until it happens.

Yep. But as soon as 2004 ends and there's no nuclear holocaust the doomsayers will move the date to 2005, and then 2006, then 2007, then 2008, then 2009..... need I go on?