Is education controled???

I want to bring up a topic about is education really controled???

here is a video about it from a retired teacher:

Is education nothing but a programming of your brain???

I have notice that teachers spend more time with people who get A'S and B's and I usally don't see effort of them trying to help the people who got lower grades.


I want to open a discussion about Is Education controled???

Public education is controlled by a state-set curriculum geared to conditioning the minds of people within various educational institutions to think in the same way. So-- to answer your question-- yes education is more or less controlled. But education as of right now is not controlled by the federal government. Currently the state governments still have power over education. I hope that answers your question.

reply to post by Frankidealist35


ya kinda. I mean are we controled on what we know??? I am saying do they purposly only teach us just to get a job and nothing else.

I am taking accounting in college and so far all the course I took and have heard people that completed the course saying they don't teach you how to run your own business but teach you how to do basic tasks like how to find a lawyer how do accounting but they teach you more towards to using software they teach only what your job expects from you and nothing more they don't teach how to start your own accounting business.


So the main question here is Are we controled on what we learn???

My social studies teacher in highschool since it was in the same year 9/11 happened our teacher we teaching us about Islam and that it's a religion for the devil, I was about to yell no that's not true but I kept my mouth shut didn't want to get introuble.

Originally posted by computerwiz32
reply to post by Frankidealist35

 

ya kinda. I mean are we controled on what we know??? I am saying do they purposly only teach us just to get a job and nothing else.

Yes, but you shouldn't do all your learning in school. I've learned a lot more from reading books and novels and listening to audiobooks than I ever have from taking any kind of class. I think they want to control what we know because they don't want us thinking outside of the box. I think that there should be an education reform myself.

I am taking accounting in college and so far all the course I took and have heard people that completed the course saying they don't teach you how to run your own business but teach you how to do basic tasks like how to find a lawyer how do accounting but they teach you more towards to using software they teach only what your job expects from you and nothing more they don't teach how to start your own accounting business.

Do you know if the college you go to has business classes where you could learn that kind of stuff? You might want to ask your local library what resources they have about books that could teach you how to do that kind of thing. Local libraries are great with that.

So the main question here is Are we controled on what we learn???

From having graduated high-school this year I will agree that they do try to control what we learn. They set standards as to what they think we should and they only teach us what they want us to know when they think we're ready. That's why I read books a lot more now... so I don't have to wait for someone to tell me things.

My social studies teacher in highschool since it was in the same year 9/11 happened our teacher we teaching us about Islam and that it's a religion for the devil, I was about to yell no that's not true but I kept my mouth shut didn't want to get introuble.

It's not uncommon for teachers to try to force their political beliefs on students within their own classroom. This happens with any class that has something to do with anything that's related to politics. What I recommend that you do in that kind of situation is to separate out what the teacher wants you to believe and what you should take from the course.

From my personal experience in the California public school system (not too long ago, I'd like to think, so it's still a bit fresh in my mind) I'd have to say there is little if any control.

Even when I try to think about the possibilities of there being some sort of deep, seedy controlling going on even further than the teacher's lounge or principal's office... I just can't help but laugh at my memories of how chaotic everything was.

I can remember many times where students were out of control in and outside of classroom and the teacher resorted to campus police authorities. I don't remember my parents ever telling me about campus police. Those few disturbances, though, made me appreciate there was that form of control in education.

But in reply to the OP, specifically:

Originally posted by computerwiz32
Is education nothing but a programming of your brain???

I strongly believe so, especially in this age where information is so abundant. I taught myself, before, during and after school more than any teacher could ever teach me. There were the occasional mentors, who would take interest, but primarily, I felt like there was no control in my life at the point in time. Isn't that typical sounding of a teenager?

I have notice that teachers spend more time with people who get A'S and B's and I usally don't see effort of them trying to help the people who got lower grades.

I strongly disagree with that statement. From personal experience, spanning well over a dozen schools, I never received more time than other students. While extremely intelligent (my, aren't I modest), I felt the teachers left me to my own devices so they could spend more time on those struggling to get students at a third grade reading level in highschool.

That ol' saying, "Ignorance is Bliss".... I felt a lot of students wore that motto on their sleeves like a badge of honor.

Education does need to be massively reformed, though. Overpopulation is causing a huge strain on our already under-funded, unequally distributed school budgets. To maximize learning our societies need to utilize the best tools for that.... books, computers, imagination and inspiration, instead of relying on a school system with an very aged format. Anyone a graduate of remote/distance education courses out there? That works rather well, no?

The status quo is not working and "No Child Left Behind" only seems like a catchy catchphrase in hindsight.

But is the disarray and chaos intentionally planned?

If so, what an awful plan.

Alright, before the ranting continues on my behalf...

Cheers!

[edit on 20-8-2008 by Rashaverak]

reply to post by Rashaverak


Well about the teachers paying more attension to A and B students I was giving my experience.

I have heard south schools are better.

Over here teachers don't bother. I just have a class federal tax class for college.

I was getting a C until the final which was to file a tax return with taxact 2007 which I done it well done half because the only download of taxact 2007 was a demo and to finish a return you had to have a activision code which you can get for 12 bucks or somthing.

I was ticket off so I send in half done exam and told the teacher about I was having troulbe he told me it's my problem not his.

So I got a 0 on the exam and got a F for the class grade.


I have notice in my highschool years teachers would lecture then give us hw and then leave the room to talk with other teachers or get other word done like grading other assignments ect. They usally don't want you asking questions until end of class and usally popular kids would run to the teacher first.

I could explain my point of view but I don't have the time.

I learned so much online from alot of educated people.

I even learned here on ATS that the federal bank is a private corp. In economic class I took in the fall, they told me it's a gov agency.

They didn't really explain how it really worked but gave us belony version.

reply to post by computerwiz32


Where, generally speaking, might you be located, computerwiz?

I was ticket off so I send in half done exam and told the teacher about I was having troulbe he told me it's my problem not his.

Never send in a half-finished exam, much less a half-finished assignment, even if it's in spite of the instructor for a very good reason. Especially when the end-result is a glaring 'F'... yech. I feel for you, but there is a level of accountability when it comes to one's own education.

Learning online (especially on ATS) is so effective, but one of the pitfalls you must learn to navigate with ease is knowing what to filter. Much like filtering all the annoying advertising we're bombarded with on website after website, we also should learn how to analyze data and comprehensively think through issues in a logical and rational manner.

... oh boy, I'm ranting again, aren't I?

Of course it's controlled. It's one great big elaborate hoax to direct kids in the wrong direction. Basically, to have more drones a.k.a. "functioning members of society" and less thinkers a.k.a. crackpots.

[edit on 20-8-2008 by ParaFreaky]

Congress, the president, and the department of education are only grandstanding when they declare that they want to improve the American educational system. In fact the American system of democracy can only function efficiently if the general population, especially the middle class has a medium amount of education. That is to say, the middle class must be educated only to the degree that is as little as possible to allow them to reach consensus in a simplified two party system. Too much education would breed independent thought and to little generates an apathetic poverty class.

We are often reminded of how ignorant the ordinary American citizen is. Not only through statistics but also through those "man on the street" kind of media clips where no one knows their state capital.

This state of relative ignorance is by intent. It is what allows not only for a two party system and oversimplifications like red state/blue state, but also for a population to be easily manipulated and placated by it's government. A middle class disinclined to question it's government as long that they have the relative safety of their green backyards.

From birth the American educational system breeds mediocrity, intellectual laziness, discourages inquisitiveness, creativity and independent thought. I'd like to point out that this dynamic does not make the American" public any smarter or dumber than anywhere else in the world. That is not a issue here. The issue is it to recognize the systemic conditioning of the American population from childhood which discourages and marginalizes questioning and intellectual ambition. I call it the "so you think you're better than me?" syndrome.

There is of course irony in the act of making this point on ATS, since by definition we are a marginalized community attempting to deny ignorance.

reply to post by computerwiz32


YES. Education is controlled. Even more so with the "no child left behind act".

Of course it's "controlled". It's controlled by the state, by the teachers, and by the textbooks. Also, it's controlled by the authors of said textbooks, and their publishers. Probably the managers and workers at the textbook printing press are in on it. Bookstores must be a part of it too. Hmmm.. I bet that papermills and lumberyards are all in on it. You think the woodcutter is doing this to give our children drainbamage?

Wow, if that is the case I bet that the gasoline companies who supply the woodcutter... oh and the chainsaws and other vehicles. Chainsaw manufactures.. check. Wow, they must all be working together. Surely the postal service fits in there somewhere. I'm probably even in on it!

But that is absurd... probably just as much as the first four.

It's not the system. It's the students. The students have complete control over what they will learn, as in, "look at more than one source". The education system gives you back what you put into it. The smarter and more goal oriented excel, take calculus in high school, dual enroll in college while they are high school seniors and work the system with the skill that is required in the real world to advance. Oh, but I guess they figured out the "conspiracy" right? lol. Maybe they are Jews? hahaha. Wtf, are you crazy?

The ones that fail are pot heads, gangsters, drug addicts, or otherwise not conditioned optimally for some reason or another at home.. or maybe they had a few lazy or mean teachers... just maybe. Perhaps they have ADD. It's easy to remember the screw ups and the "nerds" who studied all day and had no social life. There is no conspiracy there.

Oh, I know this sounds KAKAKARZY!!! Perhaps they just didn't like school and were just happy getting a low paying job working construction or as a janitor.

It's fun to imagine that America is dumb because of a conspiracy. Sadly, it's just a lack of motivation to learn.

reply to post by logician magician


Ya I agree we the students still have control what we learn but we don't have muct control of what we are tought.

I had an english class last year of highschool, This last year I could pick any classes I wanted I got all my science,math,english,history ect credits required for graduation.

So I talked to my counsilor to put me in chemistry or physics she looked at me and said honey it's too hard and plus you can't take those classes I asked why and she said because I am already taking science credits the electronics class.

So then I thought maybe she is right so I then picked webdesign when I got into that class we learned nothing but how to use dream weaver.

we did learn html but I already learned it on my own when I was in 6th grade I got a book on it from the libaray and learned it. So when I was in this class I was ahead with my hw. The teacher didn't lecture all was nothing but assingments from some book that was to pratice html.

So since I was ahead so my teacher then made me help others when they needed help. One time she was helping a kid because he souldn't get some text to be a certain color so I had to jump in.

I didn't really learn anything new in that class. I then for the second semester took math algbra 2 well right before 2nd semester started the counsilor called me in and said that their is no room in math class algbra 2 and so she put me in socialolgy. The teacher I got I knew him from business law class.

He told us on the first day he didn't know much about the subject since he is a business teacher.

So what he did was current events on the first part of the class he even said that if we have so much current events he is willing that if it fills up the whole time then we don't have to work.

anyway I was just woundering if education is controls and our country relies on it.

A guy said that an F dosen't mean the studnet failed it measn the teacher failed to teach the person.

Yet in college and also employers look at it as how smart you are.

I also notice that If you get a degree from a college like a bach degree you can get the high paying job but if you don't have a degree and you have the same knowledge as what a person that holds such a degree you can't get the jobs that people who hold that degree.

I know programming. I passed some certificate which I got tested and passed.

I tried looking in my area for a job one was a debugger where I would debugg a clients software. I walked in for an interview and the first thing they asked was a bach in computer science. I told them I don't have it but I have some sample codes I have, you can even test me giving me programming problems.

They lol and said sorry we only hired people with degrees.

so I left.


I notice when you have a degree or a licnese or a certificate you have to renew it so many years.

I notice people that own these colleges make so much money. My eletronics teacher got a president of a college to come over to give us a presentation of his college.

he came not to promote the college but to teach us what they do ect.

They guy showed up with a golden neckless and a some golden rings.
He really looked like a guy from a mob.

He told us that he already knows who we are beacuse they buy infromation on us. That is how they send mail to us.

He also said that colleges have one thing in minde keep you as long they can in their college and also to sqeeze as many as they can in each class.

He told us that colleges don't care if you pass or fail they don't care if you learn anything from them all they want is your money.

He also explained how much infromation they can get and told us you would be surprised on how much information about you is out their on the market.

We learn at a early age that its best to just do as we are told in school and not ask inconvenient questions, because if you ask too many questions the teacher cant answer, you are seen as difficult. Not only by the teacher, but by your class mates that just want to continue along in the book like any good sheep.

So to fit in, you just do what you know the teacher will like. Then you get a job and do the same at work all life long.

We are programmed to be convenient.


[edit on 20-8-2008 by Copernicus]

Depends on the country you live in if you ask me.

For example at my school you are basically allowed to do almost anything.
And in those subjects they are also open-minded.

Eg.: Biology teaches you the theories of multiple people, including the Intelligent Design / Darwin ones.

Then of course there *are* questions like: "Which one would seem to be the most logical?" But they are usually open for discussion as well (though a more scientific stance is usually taken, and as such things as Evolution are said to be *more likely* than intelligent design.)

And at my school they work with both people that are good and bad at a certain subject, those that are bad even more as they need to understand so they can get better grades so they graduate.

[edit on 20/8/08 by -0mega-]

Ask any parent this question and every one of them will convey that educational standards and practices have changed emmensely since they were in school.
I can't help my 5th grader with her math homework because they don't teach the kids the same type of math that I learned and they can't really teach the parents the new math methods to keep up.
In conferences with my kid's teachers, they all agree and one went into a diatribe about how SHE was so incensed by the fact that the school district was using a learning plan developed at the University of Chicago and sold to a publisher for more money because the authors didn't get the grants from the school to continue the research of how the learning plan woul;d really work in schools!
Huh?
Yeah, the authors sold the plan to a publisher to make enough money to continue working out the bugs in the plan.

Yes, I say. Money motivates the educational system too.

Egads!
Cuhail

well I got one story to tell which is true.

my 12th grade heighschool english class I didn't have to take this class I had all requried credits ect. I was pushed into this class so I didn't want to make a scene so I just went with it after fighting with the counsilor for 3 hours that I didn't want to take another english class.

so in this english class we had to right an essay.

This essay was about current events that we want to fix.

It was more like todays problems that interest us.

I live in Michigan and currently their and grew up their. I made a paper on the pavement material I said that the asphalt we use is not good for northern states to use.

I explained that asphalt contracts in the winter and in the summer it expands casuing potholes after so many contract and expand it's like your tugging on somthing then let go for a while and then tugg again it ends up breaking the item ect.

I explained we need to develope a substance that we can use for new roads that would last longer that would be non thermal conductive.

this paper I wrote I thought was nice. I had to read it in front of the whole class since it was part of the assingment when I did I was lol at.

Even the teacher lol at me. She then came to me and said that I copied this paper and instead of giving a 0 she will let me make another essay so I then made a new essay about global warming and gave a stupid reason on how we can overcome it by using eco friendly cars ect. She excepeted that and gave me an A.

Now when I was I college during the Winter I hear on the local news Michigan university has developed a new material for the roads it was mixed with some carbon rubber ect so not it's a non thermal conductor.

This stuff was very similar to my essay. I did in my essay talk about using a rubbor compound like carbon.

I now was like omg I was lol at school and look it was part of a univeristy research.

This was never on any news or news paper or even on the internet before this.

So when I wrote my paper I wrote it in a way that I knew my state has a problem with the road I knew why we had it and yes this problem was covered by the news but nothing on the news was covered about a solution.

so in my paper we had to make a solution. well the assignment was to give what your thought of a solution to this federal or local problem.

So I am just shareing this because in the class room I felt like an idot everyone else was using events that was covered by news media like terroirsts, globalwarming, durgs. Then something about drinking age to be 18 ect ect which was covered by the media.

Now when I look back I go wow why did I feel like a fool when I just pictured that they may be the fools???

this is a real event that happened to me when I was in my 12 grade english class.

So my thoughts on education control is based on our education system.

Is the eduation system controled. I know the internet and also book stores are not fully controled.

I have seen videos on about the school policy.


In middle school my teachers knew I am a nice person and would do anything they asked.

So I mostly ended up being a cleaner. My math teacher one time I was in my english class came to my english teacher and wispered somthing in her ear.

She then calls me and said my math teacher needs me and I go to my math teacher and she had me walk with her and she takes me to the math class room and tells me in front of the whole class to clean up my mess and I go what??? what mess she tells me that the mud on the floor is my mess I didn't want to make a scene or anything so I cleaned it up. I was thinking while cleaning it up how it could be my mess so I look at what desk it was and notice I don't sit at that exact desk so it couldn't been me.

I have notice teachers making me doing it so the last time it was my english teacher she is old. She see's mud foot prints that go by my desk and then ends at the last desk in my row. She comes up to me and say clean up your mess so I was bold enough to say what mess, she then yells don't try to be a smarty pants. I then ask her again what mess. She then said your muddy mess. I said it's not my mess then the class lol because they enjoy fights with the teacher lol.

So she asked what is my first hour class, becuse this was my 2nd hour class.

So I go band class and she then says well where you marching outside and I go no we pratice inside since it was raining outside.
So then she said did you walk to school and I go no my mom drives me here.

Then she said well maybe you ran on the grass to class and picked up mudd on my shoe.

I go no it can't be beacuse if so wouldn't my band teacher complain about a mess I left??? I said that when I left band class I don't remeber see anying mud trails I left.

then a kid at the last row raised his hand. The teacher calls his name and he said that it was him he was in gym 1st hour and they playied soccer outside.

then the teacher goes oh then she said that he has to clean it up and then she started class.

I felt like I should of told her no he dosen't have to clean it up you do.

But I was scared to get in trouble so I just said it in my head lol.


I had my fare share of weired teachers but I notice the attitude of the material they thought was that it was 100% correct type attitude.

We were looked weired to be looked like we are stupid if we asked a question against the teachings of that certian class.

by the way my band teacher stold my music book at the end of the year.

Which I neede dit for my highschool.

Originally posted by computerwiz32

Is education nothing but a programming of your brain???

Without watching that video, I once more do have an opinion..

I do believe that education is a way of 'programming' the brain. However it depends (according to me) to what school children attend and the background of school. Also maybe the background of parents and the way of thinking of the parents is a sensible 'issue' for 'programming' the brain of children.

In the country where I live, up north, they speak about 'white' schools and multi cultural schools. White schools attend more white kids then kids from another culture, etc.. But this maybe has not so much to do with 'programming' the brain. However using those words 'white and multi cultural' is in a way of influence.. Then what is wrong being in a school where it is more multi cultural then a so called white school? According to me this is the first step to rasism, which should not be educated.

It all depends on what kind of education is offered, but especially the content of the material to be educated. As most governments have a 'big say' in what is to be educated in school, I understand why you started this thread, I believe there is nothing wrong with putting this subject to discussion, it is not wrong to be critical towards child education and the content of what schools have to offer.

Yes I agree it really depends on the schools what they offer.

I am more talking about public schools. I when I was growing up was thought to want to go to college because you become smarter today I am in college and my experience so far is that all this is a joke.

I feel colleges are more of a business rather then a place where they want you to become smarter.

I currently had to take courses outside of my major. I am majoring in accounting and for my 1st semester I had to tkae account1 and ITCS which taught how to program a database it was more of a split class for computersciense and business majors.

it showed us how to use excel and baiscly access database and show how to program in sql and also gave us the basics in computer hardware engineering which I already went through in highschool for eletronics I took a college course where my college is supposed to give me credits according to the agreement with my highschool district and the college I attend now. I paid the college 5 bucks to transfer the credits and they tell me well I have to take one eletronic class here at the college and I read the agreement which didn't state I had to take a college class in that college to be able to transfer the credits so it looks like the credits won't transfer and I paid them 5 bucks for nothing.

I notice that people strive for degrees to get better jobs not to learn.

I notice people who get degress well half of them that do don't know really much about their major.

I personally think their is control on what we are tought in public school.

I do belive we still have freedom on what we want to learn. I mean I still can go to the libaray or go online and learn stuff that interest me.

But I have had so many bad experience in public school too many crazy teachers I met and feelt more like a prisioner in school then going their on my own.

I mean I love to learn but I hate goind to school and it's because people are not really open minded in school.

I met only 3 teachers that were great and I learned alot however they were being harassed by other teachers because they didn't stick with what the course is about.

one got fired the others were demoted. One guy that tought biology in highschool I had him, he taought us from the book but he mostly lectured we rarely had to use the book, he made the book as a guide when we are home going hw ect.

I learned alot in that class. He showed us some movies well footage of like surgery and insect videos ect

I notice more and more new teachers not really teaching like not lecturing or doing less lecturing.

In Michigan we are not getting more jobs some rumors that WB is thinking to buy an abandon Ford plant and turn it into a studio they had on local news all these ceos and they were saying that have a high demand for workers but they can't find quilified workers.

My college just announsed this fall they will have a brand new course in computer science, it's game development ect.

I have notice that colleges move towards what demand the industrie needs for a workforce.

Geez, is this a serious question?

Of course it's controlled. The powers that be don't want you understand that they are frauds. If the common and uneducated people understood anything about 'anything' the streets would be gushing in rivers of blood.

They need to dumb you down because of their fear of us all, the people. They want power to control people, not to liberate them. You're just a pawn in chess game if you even ponder a dumb question as such.

Thing is, the American education system is one of indoctrination. They tell you things as fact, then test you on them to reiterate the memorization.

Now, take Columbus for example. He is taught to ALL gradeschoolers as the person who found america(false), and the person who discovered that the earth was round(false).

Why do you think our children spend weeks learning about ww2, but MAYBE a day on the vietnam and korean wars? Why are our children taught that communism=evil, when, in actuality, the world has yet to see a true communist government? Why are they forced to recite the pledge of allegience, day after day?

Yes, the american education system is absolutely one built on the brainwashing of children to further consumerism.