Women 'using web for abortions'

Women 'using web for abortions'

news.bbc.co.uk

Some women in countries where abortion is restricted are using the internet to buy medication enabling them to abort a pregnancy at home, the BBC has learned.

Women in Northern Ireland and over 70 countries with restrictions have used one of the main websites, Women on Web.

A British Journal of Obstetrics and Gynaecology review of 400 customers found nearly 11% had needed a surgical procedure after taking the medication.

The website says it can help reduce the problems linked with unsafe abortions.

(visit the link for the full news article)

Just to make my position clear on this, I believe in a womans right to choice - I don't believe that misguided religious views should interfere with the emotional well being, physical health or safety of a woman who has an unplanned or unwanted pregnancy.

To me, this article underlines just how desperate some women are to terminate an unwanted pregnancy, despite the dangers posed.

It's time for the PTB to wake up in some parts of the world and recognise that women have the right to choose - after all these are decisions that will affect a womans life for years, and perhaps even decades after they are taken.

news.bbc.co.uk
(visit the link for the full news article)

"A woman's right to choose" , "a woman's right to choice" -- both lousy cicumlocutions for what is being talked about: a woman's right to kill the creature with human DNA growing inside of her.

The irony is that the woman's own body is in a cycle of maintenance, aging, and decay, but the creature with human DNA growing inside of her is exhibiting all sorts of remarkable capabilities in constructing a physical body from chemical building blocks in the most remarkably sentient fashion.

Originally posted by Queen Maeve
"A woman's right to choose" , "a woman's right to choice" -- both lousy cicumlocutions for what is being talked about: a woman's right to kill the creature with human DNA growing inside of her.

The irony is that the woman's own body is in a cycle of maintenance, aging, and decay, but the creature with human DNA growing inside of her is exhibiting all sorts of remarkable capabilities in constructing a physical body from chemical building blocks in the most remarkably sentient fashion.

I often wonder about why Christians define a fetus as "human" when the God of the Bible gave the Hebrews the definition of when the soul enters the body. (I might suspect that if the God so stated then, that it has not changed...)

That time is "at first breath." So until then, the fetus is like any "soulless" creature on this planet.

Given that this planet is straining under the weight of the population now living upon it;

And given that unwanted children have a much higher likelihood of being unloved and abused than wanted children;

And given that unwanted and abused children have a much higher likelihood of being sociopathic and otherwise socially detrimental than loved and cared for children;

And given that no one has the right to deem a human (souled) being "less than" another (except by their behavior) and therefore it is a crime of high order to eliminate such a souled being;

It would follow that in all cases, aborting an unwanted fetus should be considered and employed.

And to you, Queen Maeve, to consider this most mundane of life behavior as a reason to bring an unwanted being into the Universe to most likely be unhappy, abused, unloved, and become a societal danger is absurd.

A woman's right, is to just say NO.
I agree with abortion in only two instances..
Rape
Incest

All else is completely preventable.
All else is murder.

i do not think some of these women care about the morality of it, so why try to fight that battle with them? regulate safe and professional abortion procedures and make them available.

let the individual make that decision.

If women don't want to get pregnant, there are many ways to prevent it altogether.

1. Find a guy who's been "snipped." (My preferred method lol)
2. Close the legs and say no.
3. Protection
4. Get tubes tied

Originally posted by Ceara
If women don't want to get pregnant, there are many ways to prevent it altogether.

1. Find a guy who's been "snipped." (My preferred method lol)
2. Close the legs and say no.
3. Protection
4. Get tubes tied

option #2 may be the only available option for many many many many women all over the world. which is fine, people should say no if they do not want to have sex. but do not even claim that those other 3 options are even options for any other countries except the rich ones.

No method of contraception is 100% safe, so that argument goes out the window.

I'll reiterate - I believe it's a womans right to choose what she does with her own body.

And all this claptrap about potential geniuses being aborted can be equally applied to include mass murderers, people like hitler and pol pot, rapists and criminals of all kinds - so it is in fact a moot and silly point to make.

Originally posted by RubyGloom
A woman's right, is to just say NO.
I agree with abortion in only two instances..
Rape
Incest

All else is completely preventable.
All else is murder.

Yup, so many anti-abortionists say that. Very odd, it is supposedly murder, but its okay if the woman was "innocent and a victim of abuse". It is NOT okay if they chose to have sex.

That makes it BLATANTLY clear it is about controlling women's behavior, first and foremost, and NOT about the supposed "murdering" of little babies. If you believe it is murder then it is not okay in EITHER case.

reply to post by budski

No method of contraception is 100% safe, so that argument goes out the window.

Abstinence.
And it takes two to tango.
Start forcing the men involved to take appropriate consequences for their actions.
I think it's disgusting if a woman continues to get pregnant, and have multiple abortions.
I have no comment on choosing whether an abortion saves the world from a criminal, or deprives it of a great human being..that is just not our place to judge or choose.

reply to post by Sonya610


Then let me rephrase..
In cases of rape or incest, I find it appropriate action to abort, as the effects on the child after birth are to heinous to inflict on anyone. Children ask questions about their parentage, and in those cases it would cause psychological damage, and could lead to all kinds of social problems for that person throughout life.Not to mention the mother herself being constantly reminded whether she raises the child or not.

For a mother to just abort her child, because she does not want to be a mother, IS murderous in my mind. No mother should feel that way about her unborn.
Perhaps Iam alone in my feelings, but so be it.

Well I was a "mistake" baby. And I am extremely glad that my mother did not abort me. She had the choice.

I wouldn't be here if she would not have taken the responsibilty of her actions. Like I said I wouldn't be here right now, I am a living breathing human being, with just as much a right to life as anybody else, so what gives people the right to take away the future life of someone, just because they don't want to take responsibility for their actions?

Originally posted by theendisnear69
Well I was a "mistake" baby. And I am extremely glad that my mother did not abort me. She had the choice.

I wouldn't be here if she would not have taken the responsibilty of her actions. Like I said I wouldn't be here right now, I am a living breathing human being, with just as much a right to life as anybody else, so what gives people the right to take away the future life of someone, just because they don't want to take responsibility for their actions?

As was I. Put up for adoption as well.
I was also pregnant as a teen. I kept my son.
Hence my feelings on the matter at hand.

reply to post by RubyGloom


You know the dating scene isn't that simple.

It's never as simple for the women as "want sex, no baby... protection, done", and it's certainly not as simple as just not having sex. People are people, they're not going to stop having sex because of your ideals.


Now. Given that women, even when abortion is illegal, will still find ways to do it themselves, endangering themselves along with the fetus... it only makes sense to make it legal so the abortions can be done safely.

They're going to abort regardless of the law.


And Sonya has a point.

Pro-Lifers telling the mother she can only abort if it's against her will, kinda defeats the point of pro-life.
And delivers a message to the women that they can only have what they want when we've forced it upon them. When it's their own doing, tough luck.

[EDIT]
I was a mistake child as well. I'm still indifferent. If my mother had aborted, I wouldn't be here to worry about it anyways.

[edit on 11-7-2008 by johnsky]

It's interesting to note that many of the members in this very thread probably feel that their personal liberties are being stripped from them one by one. That government oversteps its bounds and basic civil rights are being chunked out the window.

Yet, it's ironic that some of these members are willing to strip women the basic right to autonomy. If we allow the government to wrest away the very control of our own bodies, what liberty will they strip from us next?

Let's face it. It doesn't get any more personal then autonomy.

Originally posted by Sonya610
Yup, so many anti-abortionists say that. Very odd, it is supposedly murder, but its okay if the woman was "innocent and a victim of abuse". It is NOT okay if they chose to have sex.

That makes it BLATANTLY clear it is about controlling women's behavior, first and foremost, and NOT about the supposed "murdering" of little babies. If you believe it is murder then it is not okay in EITHER case.

Yep, Control is truly the name of the game. Thom Hartmann talks about this sometimes--he notes that in countries where women share higher degrees of equality with men, there is less violence, less crime, less impetus to go to war. Quality of life is higher. I'm betting if a radio talk show host (albeit a well-educated and experienced one, and a prolific author at that) can figure this out, so too have those "religious" (I use the term loosely, most of the snake oil salesmen posing as preachers in this country wouldn't recognize Jesus if He tapped them on the shoulder) "leaders" (again loosley, because it's not hard to lead sheep) who continually fight against the right to choice.

The anti-abortion movement is about nothing more than social control. As a means to what end, I have yet to discern. For many I'm sure it's as simple as trying to out-breed rival religions in order to dominate the "spiritual landscape". For others a more sinister purpose may be at play.

reply to post by RubyGloom


Same here.

Just the fact that I would have never even had shot at life if I would have been aborted makes me disagree with the whole subject.

The conditions that I was born into were not that great, and I turned out completely fine. So to say that abortion should be ok because the kid might have to live in a foster home is just silly.

It does not matter where you are born, we all have a chance to make something of ourselves.

each individual has a right to life. abortion is a stupid way to deal with your own bad choices . a child whether it be 2 cells or 2 years is a life. by taking that life it makes you a murderer . a woman who gets a abortion may think it's not but try to tell her she would have to kill an infant and she would panic and find disgust. a life is a life . simple as that. eye for eye tooth for tooth. those who claim that it's not a person till it breathes are ignorant. in biblical times if you injured a woman and her baby died inside her you would be stoned to death. because a fetus is a person and has it's own lifeforce.

Originally posted by budski

And all this claptrap about potential geniuses being aborted can be equally applied to include mass murderers, people like hitler and pol pot, rapists and criminals of all kinds - so it is in fact a moot and silly point to make.

I disagree, and state that your own point is moot and silly.

One's life is not pre-destined, therefore, a man who grows up to be a murderer had just as much chance of becoming a societal genius.

So, what does this mean in the greater picture?

It means that choosing an abortion because the father is seen as cruel and psychotic is somewhat naive.

We should be happy in the least that that man is not going to have a say in how that child grows in the world.

The above mentality, that of denying a person's right to existence because of his father's actions, seems to me more like accepting the world as it is, and refusing to do anything about it by denying the world new life.

But yeah, i do believe in pro-choice.

[edit on 11-7-2008 by Anti-Tyrant]