Senate committee: Bush knew Iraq statements were untrue

Senate committee: Bush knew Iraq statements were untrue

www.mcclatchydc.com

A long-awaited Senate Select Intelligence Committee report made public Thursday concludes that President Bush and Vice President Dick Cheney made public statements to promote an invasion of Iraq that they knew at the time were not supported by available intelligence.

“Before taking the country to war, this administration owed it to the American people to give them a 100 percent accurate picture of the threat we faced. Unfortunately, our Committee has concluded that the administration made significant claims that were not supported by the intelligence,” said committee Chairman John D. Rockefeller IV, D- W. Va.

(visit the link for the full news article)

Okay, again no big surprise to most people. My question is this, are these punishable crimes?

Is being caught lying to the American people in the run up to war, to sell a war to the American people under false pretenses something that the president and vice president can do and not be punished for it?

I would have to believe that this is a major issue and that if this senate committee believes these charges and can prove them that Bush, Cheney, and anyone else who provably lied to we the people should be charged with crimes.

Furthermore, if this is the case can these crimes be brought before the Hague?

Afghanistan was one thing - Iraq another. I personally believe that our invasion of Iraq was a huge mistake and heinous crime against humanity. Saddam may have been an evil son-of-a-bitch but the suffering we have unleashed on Iraq now far outstrips that which he was inflicting on his people.

If this story is true I believe those responsible should be held accountable.

www.mcclatchydc.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

www.senate.gov...

Measure Title: A joint resolution to authorize the use of United States Armed Forces against Iraq.

Rockefeller (D-WV), Yea

Hypocrisy in action. That's not to excuse the Bush administration if they did lie, but I wonder how many on that Senate Intelligence Committee now issuing this report joined Mr. Rockefeller in being Bush's enabler on the matter?

Originally posted by Animal


Okay, again no big surprise to most people. My question is this, are these punishable crimes?

Most definitely they are, any sane person would agree. Unfortunately this will be swept under the rug like all the other atrocities this administration has committed

I for one hope I see the day when these people are made to answer, and punished, for their crimes.

Originally posted by vor78
www.senate.gov...

Measure Title: A joint resolution to authorize the use of United States Armed Forces against Iraq.

Rockefeller (D-WV), Yea

Hypocrisy in action. That's not to excuse the Bush administration if they did lie, but I wonder how many on that Senate Intelligence Committee now issuing this report joined Mr. Rockefeller in being Bush's enabler on the matter?

I agree that it seems hypocritical, but please remember that the senator is speaking on behalf of the investigating committee. He may not necessarily 'agree' on the committee's declaration (although it is politically expedient, hence admittedly hypocritical, to refrain from saying so).

And YES this is 'punishable' but the case MUST be tried before congress..., do you think that is even REMOTELY possible? I doubt it.

[edit on 5-6-2008 by Maxmars]

This needs to be blasted on the front page of every newspaper, every day, and also the chattering, nattering talking heads on all of the 24-hour cable 'news' channels.

Wolf? Are you out there? Keith?? Katie??? Brian????

reply to post by vor78


Enabler?!?! REALLY?

Congress was LIED to using FAKE intel and EXAGGERATED documents and testimony. Are you implying the president shouldn't get the benefit of the doubt? Now, if Bush genuinely did not know that he was ying and made the best decision with what he had, that is one thing. But if he lied and took us to war as a result, then that is treason.

reply to post by Maxmars


He seems to believe it. This from 2006:

wcbstv.com...

Regardless, the point I'm making is simply this: its ALL about political expediency. There will be no hearings, no trial. Why? Because ultimately, the leadership of the Democratic party is ALSO pulling the wool over everyone's eyes. My belief is that many of them believe in this war as much as the other side does and only began opposing it based on polling data. Of course, it can never be proven and is just speculation, but I'm not buying their side of the story, either.

What do you think the odds are that the Dems will find some convenient excuse to stay in Iraq should Obama win?

[edit on 5-6-2008 by vor78]

reply to post by TruthWithin


I'm not defending the Bush administration. I'm arguing that many on the other side of the isle are probably just as full of BS on the issue.

Originally posted by vor78
www.senate.gov...

Measure Title: A joint resolution to authorize the use of United States Armed Forces against Iraq.

Rockefeller (D-WV), Yea

Hypocrisy in action. That's not to excuse the Bush administration if they did lie, but I wonder how many on that Senate Intelligence Committee now issuing this report joined Mr. Rockefeller in being Bush's enabler on the matter?

This is hogwash and you are smart enough to know it. Truthwithin is right on. This was voted on in 2002 during the height of the Bush administrations campaign of propaganda. While I agree that most politicians are slimy bastards in this case trying to call out 'hypocrisy' is weak at beat and I am willing to bet you know it.

The USA was still highly freaked out in 2002 about 911. After all the allegations of nuclear explosions, insinuations to Iraq - Al Quida ties, and all the allegations of 'weapons of mass destruction' it was only the very BEST of the politicians who saw through the bull # and voted no.

Bottom line is this, it is now ON THE RECORD Bush and Cheney lied us into this war. Rather than pointing fingers at those who put it on the record we should be up i arms FURIOUS with our president and his administration. We should be demanding JUSTICE for the nearly 4000 dead Americans and untold dead Iraqis!

Originally posted by vor78

Regardless, the point I'm making is simply this: its ALL about political expediency. There will be no hearings, no trial. Why?

Why? Because too many people, yourself included are too busy to be bothered to stand up for democracy. Shame on you man. Seriously wake up. Ya politics and politicians suck but your words here demonstrate a complete inability to act as a member of a democratic society. It is about time you and yours took on the responsibility we ALL have in a democratic society.

If less of us sat around wallowing in our fatalism MORE could be accomplished, you seriously piss me off.

reply to post by Animal


That's fine. I'm not posting my opinions in an attempt to earn your approval.

Originally posted by vor78
reply to post by Maxmars

 

He seems to believe it. This from 2006:

wcbstv.com...

Regardless, the point I'm making is simply this: its ALL about political expediency. There will be no hearings, no trial. Why? Because ultimately, the leadership of the Democratic party is ALSO pulling the wool over everyone's eyes. My belief is that many of them believe in this war as much as the other side does and only began opposing it based on polling data. Of course, it can never be proven and is just speculation, but I'm not buying their side of the story, either.

What do you think the odds are that the Dems will find some convenient excuse to stay in Iraq should Obama win?

[edit on 5-6-2008 by vor78]

I have NO doubt that the Democratic branch of the Republocratic party will do little more than make noises from their face-holes about leaving Iraq, but then, when has it ever been any different with ANY of them? No way will the established and implemented agenda be reversed now.

PS - Thanks for the link - Politicians, they all seem the same don't they?

[edit on 5-6-2008 by Maxmars]

Originally posted by Animal
Why? Because too many people, yourself included are too busy to be bothered to stand up for democracy. Shame on you man. Seriously wake up. Ya politics and politicians suck but your words here demonstrate a complete inability to act as a member of a democratic society. It is about time you and yours took on the responsibility we ALL have in a democratic society.

If less of us sat around wallowing in our fatalism MORE could be accomplished, you seriously piss me off.

What would you have us do? We elect representative to serve us. Those representatives choose not to, or there aren't enough of them to complete the task at hand. Congressional Democrats could bring impeachment hearings to the table right now and it would mean diddley-squat because Senate Republicans would defeat any impeachment vote. Even if impeached Bush would get a pardon from Cheney (unless he was also impeached) and it would be meaningless. Due process, right now, in this case, does not and will not work. Better to let them leave office, and use what evidence is available to arrest them and send them to the Hague for trial on war crimes charges.

Aside from that what, realistically, would you have the People do?

reply to post by ImJaded


Agreed. Not only will they be swept under the rug but the incoming president will most likely issue full pardon's for all of the administration exiting the White House. This has happened before. Even if it is B. Obama I believe that this will most likely be the case. What I say is that if this happens the people should PUSH the issue hard and state that a presidential pardon should not be allowed.

reply to post by Maxmars


Agreed. My entire point here is that we're attacking the Bush administration (that deserves every ounce of it, I might add) for providing misleading information in the run up to the war, but that the other side will be given a complete pass on the issue, just because they've done an about-face and are attacking the mouthpiece they one supported.

The ones in government that lied and the ones that allowed it to happen? Prosecute them ALL, that's my stance and don't be fooled now that some are crying foul after the fact.



[edit on 5-6-2008 by vor78]

Originally posted by Animal

Originally posted by vor78

Regardless, the point I'm making is simply this: its ALL about political expediency. There will be no hearings, no trial. Why?

Why? Because too many people, yourself included are too busy to be bothered to stand up for democracy. Shame on you man. Seriously wake up. Ya politics and politicians suck but your words here demonstrate a complete inability to act as a member of a democratic society. It is about time you and yours took on the responsibility we ALL have in a democratic society.

If less of us sat around wallowing in our fatalism MORE could be accomplished, you seriously piss me off.

Okay my friend. I then challenge YOU to explain to us how this process will work. Give us the complete details of how the system works and I'm sure more and more will actually take action.

Why do I challenge you? Because I don't know where to start. I have tried writing letters to my senators and congressmen. I have written to the press and posted on many different sites. All of the organizations that are for this type of action are labeled as 'nut jobs' and are slandered and pushed down by the extreme right.

So please, help us out instead of calling us out. Give us your vast knowledge on the subject of how we are to pursue this matter.

I appreciate your input.

reply to post by vor78


vor78....I get your point. BUT, if I read it correctly, you want to prosecute every member of Congress that voted to 'authorize' action, that is, the military escalation in Iraq?

Trust me, I'm on your side....but, think of this: If you are sitting on a jury, and the evidence presented, in the trial, swayed you to conclude, one way or the other, to vote to convict or say not guilty....then, later you learned BEYOND a shadow of a doubt that you had been misled, during the trial....and yor vote was wrong....how would you feel?

Beyond that, would you be a criminal? NO.

This is about intentional lies, starting from very high up in this 'administration' (an administration that was NEVER legitimate in the first place, but that's another thread...) and unwitting accomplices in Congress. Let me repeat....'unwitting'....they were duped!!!

The 'perps' must be held to account!

reply to post by weedwhacker


To say all of them is probably a bit extreme on my part. I agree completely with what you are saying and to do so is impossible for the reasons you state.

I'm not entirely sure that they were all 'duped' however. Again, that's impossible to prove, but based upon their past support of such actions as the bombing of Iraq in 1998 by Bill Clinton under virtually the same pretenses that Bush used to invade, well, something doesn't quite add up on the Dem side, either.

www.cnn.com...

You've got to admit, something reeks here , and the stench is coming from both sides in DC.

WW, Vor;

You know, if you stop th think about it, there is a likelihood that some truly were duped, some played along, some followed 'whip' orders. However, it seems impossible for me to not infer that a few high-profile players on both sides KNEW the truth all along.

I know we can't just dump all of them and start over (sometimes I like to fantasize that we could), but I really would like to know WHO KNEW. And more importantly WHY they 'allowed' it to happen anyway.