Well, Saddam did not think that the F-117 would work at all at the start of Gw1....

The fact is that while Russia may be able to detect the F-117 and shoot it down, newer planes like the B-2 and the F-22 are light years ahead. The f-22 has not even been flown out of the Us (i think) so how would Russia know if they could defeat it? Russia is not serious about stealth because they hold true to the massive numbers philosophy, if you through allot of units at one objective, even if you lose many units you will eventually destroy it.

Ronii, like the Zerg mentality. Mass production, get them out cheap and fast. Swarms.

Actually, the F-15's had the most current radar, but the Indian pilots got the shot off first because of their missle. That's the need for the F-22.

Finally, I have been saying this for forever, the F-22 is still out-matched by Russian AAMs...

LMAO at the Ruski's swiping the F/A-22 design! I never even noticed the similarity between the PAK-FA and the F-22...! or is the T-50 different from the PAK-FA?

Dima, I have been impressed with the points you make but I have to admit you make a few mistakes I.E. the B-2's being downed, I highly doubt that...

let me give u some info on the american economy, u'll be shocked by the extent of your debt, really, it shocked me to, k, here's the stuff

1.yes, u guys have a 10.99 trillion economy with a GDP of 37800, which ranks 1 and 3 in the world respectively, yet u guys are only grwoing at 3.1% compared to Russia's 7.3% and Moldova's 6.3%

2. okay lets get to public debt, now, america spends $2.156 trillion, and they make $1.782 trillion every year after taxes(well, all this info is 2004), now, that is a defecit of $374 billion/that was last year, and it will relatively be the same as this year, so basically its $370 billion a year, now that will increase the public debt by about 5.40% a year and america's total public debt is 62.4%, your total public debt amounts to $6.858 trillion

3. now in comparison to Russia's and Moldova's; Russia spends $73.75 billion a year, and he earns $83.99 billion a year, therefore, unlike america, they have a budget surplus of $10.24 billion, which will remain approximately $10 billion a year, okay, russia's apublic debt amounts to 34.1% of their economy, which translates to $437 billion, now, the $10 billion annually will decrease the public debt by 2.29%

Moldova on the other hand spends $443.4 million and earns $474.8 million, therefore, just like russia, they have abudget surplus of $31.4 million annually, so basically thats $30 million every year, now their public debt accounts for 88.4% of their GDP, which is the most of America and Russia and one of the highest in the world, yet this translates to $6.89 billion, the $30 million a year will decrease the public debt by 4.36% a year, which is even higher than Russia's

4.now, onto the second last thing, trade turnover, america imports products and services worth $1.26 trillion every year, yet it only exports $714.5 billion, therefore, the trade turnover is a defecit of $713.24 billion, thats annually, now, your current position in trade turnover is at -$541.8 billion, lets compare this to Russia's and Moldova's

5.Russia imports $74.8 billion, while they export $134.4 billion, which gives a positive trade turnover of $59.6 billion a year, and their current situation is at $35.91 billion, its positive

Moldova imports $1.34 billion and exports only $790 million which means that they have a trade defecit of $550 million annually, their current situation is at -$135 million

last points: america has $85.94 billion in their foreign echange reserves, and russia has $76.94 billion(but it is now close to $120 billion as of December 1), and Moldova has $302.3 million

america's debt is $1.4 trillion and is precisely 70% of WORLD debt which totals to $2 billion, russia has a debt of $175.9 billion which amounts to 8.8% of total world debt, and Moldova, has a debt of $1.515 billion which is worth 0.076% of world debt

now, let me explain a few things, if a ntion has a budget defecit, then if they have a positive trade turnover, they can use that money accumulated by the trade to pay off their debt, therefore, remaining neutral, or vice versa, u can use the budget surplus to pay off negative trade turnovers, the problem with america is that, it has a negative trade turnover and a negative public defecit, so, in short, u have no spare money, except that in your foreign exchange reserves, which is only reserved for severe economic hardships, to ensure that the economy does not crash, so, to lessen the amount of public debt and its trade turnover, it borrows money from other countries, but u can't pay it back because your in a total economic defecit already, so the external debt builds up and builds up, eventually it reached $1.4 trillion, and its just going to keep on growing

now Russia is an absolutely totally different situation, both the economic trade turnover is positive and the budget, which leaves a LOT of money for spending, and their foreign exchange reserves are higher than america's right now, therefore, the case that russia can't afford to buy anything is irrelevant for their military, they've increased spending by 27.7% for next year

now Moldova is the middle situation, we have a budget surplus, yet we have a negative trade turnover, because the trade turnover is bigger than the amount of surplus we receive from our budget, we cannot pay it off, which causes us to borrow money and increases our external debt, yet Moldova's a developing nation, so, the situaion will hopefully change later on

i hope this has cleared all your thoughts about the american economy and has removed the blind fold that Bush has sneakily placed on your eyes

Dimitri Mikhailitchenko is done

The top image shows shaping problems. A stealth plane needs to have very blended skins surface, if it doesnt it will reflect too much radar that there will be no point in having a stealth configuration. The back tail plane mounts are tubular, which is a very good radar refector. That is why planes like the sr-71 have flared skin and planes like the B-52 have a giant RCS. Also the control surfaces have some sharp angles which show up on radar well.

In the second you can see that the plane is carrying its missiles on the outside, which basically counteracts the effects of stealth. Why have a stealthy plane if the enemy can see the missiles your hanging off the plane. Also the boom in the middle is just horribly shaped and will reflect radar well. The engine exhausts dont have any flairing and as a result will have massive infared signatures. ti also does not have much Snaking, which exponentially increase the RCS.

also the materials recovered from the F-117 and the D-21 are extremely old and are far surpassed by new RAM on the B-2 ect. also The RAM is not overwhelming advantage without shping, and a crashed F-117 isnot in dange of giving up such secrets.

It will be stealthy as the EF-2000 or the F/A-18e/f but not a stealth plane

yo Ronii, the pics don't work, can u give me the original site or try them again, thanx

what are u talking about, no u didn't, give me your articles again, they don't specifically say S-400

k, let me look on google

Probably your strongest argument ever on here, I think the delay in anyone from the USA ripping it to shreds says quite a lot.

What was your point with the "economy" thing for? Or do you just want to rub it in america's face that they spend to much.

Your right, but hey, what can you do.

When Clinton was the Pres the usa debt actually went smaller , But thats because he was a prick and sold secrets, plus Bush has the War on Terrorism, so thats why it will continue to rise, but in around 2-3 years (unless another major event happens) I think that our debt will get smaller once again. (aka: If Iran calms down)

Originally posted by Disturbed Deliverer
Our economy grows at the highest pace of any developed nation. We have low unemployment. We have a GDP twice the size of the nearest competition, and they have an economy mulitple times the size of our own.

The American economy is just fine.

I think Dima was replying to this.

thanx ronnii, wow, u guys ar pretty nice, unlike american mad man and engineer, i don't really like those guys, especially engineer

anyways, i doubt your debt is going to go down because, even if i take out the cost that Iraq had on the american economy which was $60 billion if i'm not mistaken, your expenditures will still be at $2.096 billion, and that will still give u a negative

and u're trade, wow, i'm actually surprised though, i never thought that america imports almost double what they export, but thats not gunna change in 5 years, nope, maybe 8-10, but that would involve drastic reforms, and the government would have to do something, raise prices on the international level to earn more, but then again, the products will become less competitive because everyone else is selling them cheaper

u're debt went down during the Clinton years, really, can u rpovide a link? for some reason i doubt that, but i could be wrong, i got all my info from www.cia.gov by the way, great site, it has everything, i'm making a MASSIVE database on all countries in Europe and the Former Soviet Union, and i'm putting in info on everything dealing with the economy and population growth, it'll be absolutely sick

wait ronni, did u use frigg, whats that program called?anyways, to highlght the pictures?

there are some faults with the F-22 as well, the trailing edge ahs more of a degree than the T-50, its really sharp, and that tiny space between the wing and the tail, there's a gap, and it looks like an obtuse angle, it looks pretty sharp

i don't understand half the things u said about the T-50, everything looked okay to me, u circled the cockpit, because, it looks fine, very curvacious, then theirs this mysterious shadow right before the tail, i wonder what that is, u circled that, then u circled the horizontal tail plane, i don't know why, i think the T-50 looks more curvacious than the F-22, except the nose, that looks like it will deflect some Radar waves

can u explain your detailks further

thanx

The reason other countries have not delved into stealth to the extent of the US is economics. The US's defense budget is almost 29% of what Russia's total GDP is, $370 billion dollars. The US, simply, is at the liberty to spend the money to aquire such technology.