Why don't people value their education?

I've met a few people in my life that aren't really interested in an education, they think that you can do without an education and do other jobs, and they are interested in only the social aspect of it. People need to value their education more. If we are ever going to become an educated society people need to value their education more. It's not a matter of going through grades kinger garden through college and grad school and then whatever school after that and just getting good grades, in order to learn, a student must be willing to learn and consent to the idea of learning. Not enough students care about their education. They could care less about math, science, and history, they end up working at safeway, or, some other mediocore job, and they really don't get far in this world because they didn't put the effort earlier on in their life to further their education.

I believe that people need to value education more. We are taught in school what we aught to know in life. Those that don't pay attention in school don't learn what they aught to know in life.

My question to you is why don't people value education as much as they should? Our education system is designed to educate people yet if people don't care about education they won't become educated. Education standards should be raised, and, more people should start paying attention to their education.

[edit on 25-4-2008 by Frankidealist35]

I think more people don't value education because, well to state the obvious it doesn't seem valuable to them. As far as public education goes, we all know people who have been in high school and who were basically illiterate, couldn't multiply and divide, or name the 7 continents.

And in terms of higher education, everyone I went to University with knows lots of people who couldn't find a job even after paying tons of money for a degree.

Even though I agree that education is paramount, I can't blame people for being disenfranchised with it. The thing they don't understand is that all their time in school they weren't being educated; they were only being told what to say and/or milked for cash.

Probaby because, in America, we get it drilled into our heads so often, what we do know is taken for granted. It doesn't seem important to us because our values are supposed to be work and fun apparently, and our learning before college has little earing on the work part.
Aside from that, anytime someone learned comes in here to the forums, unless they aggree with what's said, it's all disinfo. Let that work into people's brains for awhile, and you're bound to start having trouble with schooling.

And in terms of higher education, everyone I went to University with knows lots of people who couldn't find a job even after paying tons of money for a degree.

Even though I agree that education is paramount, I can't blame people for being disenfranchised with it. The thing they don't understand is that all their time in school they weren't being educated; they were only being told what to say and/or milked for cash.

Those people that couldn't find a job probably couldn't find a job because of other reasons. We don't know what reasons they have for not finding a job. We may think that they have been unable to find their job because of other things, like their family life, or, their belief system, or something else may have to do with why they couldn't get a job.

Also, a lot of people aren't only just told what they have to say when they are in school. I think that our society is at fault for the reason that many people aren't educated well enough. It's because too many people watch TV so they don't have good social skills because they are used to watching TV all the time. It's because they try to learn everything from their parents rather than from themselves. They aren't educated because they don't really take the effort because they don't think they need it and they don't know if their education will affect them down the road in life.

Probaby because, in America, we get it drilled into our heads so often, what we do know is taken for granted. It doesn't seem important to us because our values are supposed to be work and fun apparently, and our learning before college has little earing on the work part.

If our values are to be about work and fun then we won't get far in life and we won't be able to be the innovators of the 21st century and the leaders of the world. What we do shouldn't be taken for granted. People take things that are done easily for granted... they take school for granted... they take math for granted because they don't think they need to use math in life... they take English class for granted because they already know how to speak, Those that pay attention in school learn and those that don't feel left out and end up being uneducated later in life.

I am in high-school... but... correct me if I am wrong... but I have seen many adults that don't really look that eduacted. I wonder if it's that they didn't want to learn , that their family didn't push them enough, that they may be in that position because they did a lot of drugs earlier in life, or, because they may have just given up on education altogether. I don't see why there are people that don't care about education. It doesn't make sense. You go to school because you need to learn how to interact in the real world and you need to be educated so you can do what you want to do in life. Those that don't pay attention in school don't have the ability to do some things...

What you must realize is that our education system isn't exactly setup to be fair for every single student. Individuality comes into play in daily life, and the way one student learns can be a totally different preferential method than from the way another learns, for example, some students learn better through lecture, while others are educated better through hands-on exercises. The fact that every school, every student, and every teacher is different from the next makes it difficult for many students to cope with a school environment. Not to mention the repetition of learning styles that some teachers use. I have teachers that only show me notes on power point slides, every class, until the test. Personally, it gets boring and repetitive for me to learn via the same method every single class, from class to class, every day, for five days a week.

Another thing that I haven't seen anyone include in this topic yet (I may have missed it as I skimmed through the other posts quite fast) is that our society has different niches to fill. We have low paying jobs, decent jobs, and high paying careers that require degrees and such. If every single person in this country was well educated, the low paying jobs would eventually start to be filled by college graduates that have degrees in medicine and what not. The fairness of that would drive many people crazy and cause massive social reform in society, which could possibly lead to revolution against the government and the education system. This is why our education system doesn't go too far out its way to help those that struggle, the system should balance itself out eventually is the reason behind it all.

Good Topic! These days, especially with the No Child Left Behind Act, everything is magnified. No learning acually takes place in school. Memorizing facts takes place. In school, I could tell that basically no one was concentrated on learning, but getting good grades. I'm glad I left that. I've now concentrated on expanding my knowledge of everything.

But, college is so competive these days, I have touble getting into a regular ungraduate program at a state school! I mean, Soild B+, A- student, and I'm not even in the top quarter of my class.

Anyways, off topic, but yes, this is a serious option. Washington does not care, States barely care, and the next generation is taking the blunder. Students are not valuing the oppurtunity they are getting! They have a wealth of knowledge and acess to experts on fields, and all they care about is either landing a good job, or getting accepted into a college. I point this out to them, and they respond by saying, "Yes, I know, but all that matters is getting into collage so I can get a good job and family" Yes, those things are important, but you cannot really achieve those goals if you do not LEARN the acual material.

I also agree, I learn much at school by reading text books, which suprising does not happen much at my school, while most of the teachers give lectures, or do some misleading, pointless 'activity' to 'helo' those kids who do not learn well by lectures. DISAGREE.

Maybe a effort should be made (of course it won't happen) that when you enter a new school, an entrance exam should be given to see how well you learn best, and divide classes by that.

My two cents and some Brain Food
Willie

Higher education is just costly indoctrination... especially in the medical field.

I have over the course of my life, found that the best place to get an education is the Library. Find a topic, become an expert. Write a few papers, and get yourself a fake diploma.

Once actual "Academia" bases some research and work on your ideas/essays, you will now be considered "Educated." You may even get an honourary degree - just so the Academics can save face.

Their is no limit to our potential, only those we impose.

You can do this by saying to yourself; "I cannot have this knowledge until I pay $X amount of dollars and have a piece of paper saying that I know what I just spent four years learning."

When in actuality, It is not the piece of paper that counts. If you can formulated theories and demonstrate academic profundity, you can very well expect to get employment in the field that your chose to study - in the Library. Just so long as you have published a few papers to show off when you go to your job interviews. Attach them to your resume. Pretend to be your own assistant on the phone. Make your own reality. Your an Intellectual now...

Academia is mostly fraud and bullskit. Experts in the art of vocabulous ambiguousity.

Education is Valuable - priceless even. But it is not worth being saddled with $100,000 of debt (currently) to learn something you could have on your own... and be able to publish papers without waiting for your third or fourth year of Higher Education to roll around and give you permission... now that you are smart.



[edit on 1-5-2008 by doctormcauley]

Education is too random and varied to have any sort of blanket value. We have public schools teaching the lowest common denominator and failing wonderfully for the last 30 years or so, higher education that is more of a scam than any other "big" industry and a self-centered/righteous population that thinks even though the have a doctorate in 14th Century Poetry they are ENTITLED to earn some sort of super-wage of hundreds of thousand of dollars each year just because it's a doctorate and for every research chemist working for a cancer cure earning $15/hour there actually is some sweater wearing numbnut with a doctorate in poetry earning hundreds of thousands of dollars at some uppity university just so the university can look at this "highly educated" poetry guy as justification to raise tuition another $40K/year.

As far as personal growth goes if you're interested in something by all means learn about it but understand that even though you love horticulture or trees "and have studied them for years and years you are not suddenly entitled to earn more than a working class wage so think real carefully about how far into debt you want to go to attend some fancy name "big ed" university.

I should mention that being in the field of education I have noticed a pretty troubling trend. The worse the public schools get the less of a value the high school diploma has to employers and colleges. The more people being forced into colleges that don't want to be there have been steadily decreasing the value of the college degrees as more and more schools are overspending themselves to grow and need more money they can refuse less and less students and are essentially doing what the public schools have been for decades now. Teaching to the lowest common denominator.

If you enjoy something the best way to learn about it now is to be self-taught. No, you wont get some fancy degree to hang on the wall but you'll learn an awful lot more in four years by yourself than four years at Yale (trust me) and you'll save a couple hundred thousand dollars.

Just as every other aspect of American life has been artificially inflated so has education. There will be a return to valuing work experience and demonstrable skill over any piece of paper regardless of how expensive that piece of paper was. I'm seeing it happen now in the various fields I'm involved with. I, actually just got offered a job required a Masters education which I don't have because of my work experience and skills. This isn't the field I blew all that money in school for but it is one I have been self-taught in and have gained years of work experience in and my wage will be greater than the line of work for the field I actually went to school for. Currently I'm intensely interested in carpentry and it's way too late to go to school for that and way too expensive so I'll just stay focused on it, learn what I can and maybe find somebody to apprentice under for free for a while. Imagine that, a 30 year old with multiple degrees shunning the academic and professional worlds for a tool belt and dust mask and 18 hour work days.

Unless all of these factors are cleard up and left to be valued naturally the only other value one can have for education is it's personal worth and that's all relative.

As a personal note, college was the biggest waste of my time and money. It would have been better spent buying lotto tickets. College has effectively killed my interest in more than a few subjects I have always been interested in. Slowly I am rediscovering the interest through self-study but "organized" classes and the obscene cost actually made me hate education for a while.

Doing something you love for a living sooner or later kills the love and "learning" about something you love in a classroom does the same thing.

Although education is important its not always necessary. I know many successful businessmen that only have a High School diploma or even less. I myself hold a good job in the IT field and make about $100k a year and I only have a high school diploma. I guess it all depends on what field you want to go into.

Perhaps one of the biggest conspiracies facing us today is this precise subject. Fantastic points!

I see several reasons for the failure in education:

1) Parents do not seem to care about their children like they once did. My father instilled a desire to learn in me. If I needed something for school, he would rather go hungry than see me do without. He was always there to help with homework and answer any questions for me, even if he couldn't do much but offer moral support (he dropped out after the sixth grade to help with the family farm).

I try to instill that same ideal in my kids as well. But I see people all around me who seem to consider school as a daycare system so they can either go to work or go out for fun. Their kids seem to bore of learning early on and wind up barely passing high school and then getting a job in the local plant next to their parents.

I can't say why this is. Maybe the financial pressures on families have risen to the point that people don't think they can afford to help their kids learn. Or maybe it's just selfishness. I've heard it said that the present attitude toward abortion has lessened our feelings toward children in general, but in reality, I just don't know.

2) Schools have become daycare centers. Discipline is out of control. One student can be expelled for drawing a picture of a water pistol, while another can be allowed to run amok, bullying others and picking fights. This makes it impossible to actually have a classroom atmosphere that promotes learning.

And it's not any one person's fault, either. It's a failure of society in general. Despite rumors to the contrary, there are still schools that practice corporal punishment (ours here does). yet I fear that is short-lived, since I have already had to be the advocate for my children a few times when they were unfairly singled out, usually over a teacher's inability or lack of desire to see the whole picture. Injustice leads to more rules to make injustice stop, but more rules lead to problems when the rules are overly stringent and unforeseen circumstances arise (as they always will).

3) Teachers are no longer willing to teach. I know there are good teachers out there, but it seems that for every one, there are four or five that simply want to grab a paycheck and go home, spending a few hours a day droning on in a monotone in a classroom of bored students. Those who can't initially grasp the subject matter are left behind, and later on in life, left out due to never having learned that one lesson.

4) No Child Left Behind is a disaster. teachers are taking the easy way out, and teaching only what is absolutely required of them. Students who don't want to learn are inundated with how important this test is, and those who do want to learn are told to just study for the test.

5) Money. why is it that our schools cannot provide pencil and paper, but they can spend two to three times the going price for office supplies? I know this to be the case, as I at one time tried to help out my local school by saving them 60% on anything they wanted. All I would have done was order the stuff to their specs and let them pick it up. Any business with an office environment is paying a fraction of what the schools are.

I also offered to personally start and operate a book drive, as well as to get it rolling with about 50 books from my personal library, all perfectly appropriate for children and in the correct age range as the other library books they already had. The reply? That's fine, as long as all the books are on this list. the list had maybe a couple thousand books on it, which is what? Less than a tiny fraction of 1% of the books available? I just threw up my hands and gave up.

I also know the guy who runs the computer store that supplies the school with their computers. He has a reputation of being the most expensive supplier inj the entire area and uses second-rate components to boot! I have never seen over two cars parked in front of his place at one time, and I can imagine if not for that nice little school contract, he wouldn't have a single return customer. Did I mention he's big in the Mason's lodge? Hmmm...

Apparently, this financial load has caused some problems, but fundraising is here to save the day! Well, maybe not. I remember back when I was in school, the big fundraiser was right before Christmas every year, when we sold orders for big boxes of fruit. It was a hit; people could help out the school, have fresh fruit, and it all went down just in time for the biggest holiday in town. Now, the bright idea that has replaced it is to sell Coca-Cola by the case, for approximately twice the cost that stores sell them, order only, with a four week delivery, and then you have to come by the school to pick them up. Oh, they sell great... NOT! And the scary thing is when you realize these financial geniuses are teaching our children economics.

All the while people are still asking, "What happened to the oranges?"

6) Drugs are rampart in the schools. No one can learn while they're high. What happened to smoking in the bathroom? Oh, that's right, cigarettes are evil now...

7) Teen sex. The local high school has had to start segregating the freshmen, due to the fact that almost one half the ninth grade girls are getting pregnant in school! I'm at least glad they can kill the kid (have an abortion) so they can get pregnant again... er, wait, that doesn't make sense either... well, I'm sure it's still better than that silly abstinence thing, at least that's what we are told.

8) Boredom. Anyone who wants to further their education by actually learning soon finds out that free thought and new ideas are frowned upon. Without this intellectual stimuli, kids get a 'don't care' attitude that not only denies them the joys of an education, but follows then throughout their entire sheepish lives.

I could go on, but the character counter is getting low, and I'm getting frustrated writing all this terrible truth. To the OP: hang in there. You'll be one of the elite in your world.

TheRedneck

I teach Social Studies and kids here don't like social studies cause to them its boring and the assumption is that it has no value in their life. I have students asking me why they need to spell or know the locations of the African nations even if they are not planning to be there. The best you can do is make lesson plans that are interactive in getting students engaged and emphasize the importance of knowing new knowledge or skills. Get the students curious. Thats the best way to have them value their education.

Originally posted by TheRedneck
6) Drugs are rampart in the schools. No one can learn while they're high.

i disagree with this point, that is all. The rest of your post was spot-on. I also assume you meant "rampant."

Unfortunately, people only equate their educational value as to their earning potential.
Especially the younger generation.
Perhaps we have drummed it into them that they have to be able to earn a fortune to ever 'be' something in this world.
It all comes back to the value system that is being taught.
Just my thoughts..

reply to post by scientist

Yes, rampant. Nice catch.

And I have heard the argument about drug-assisted learning, but I will stand by my statement (if over no other evidence than experience). We'll just have to agree to disagree on this. Thanks for your response.

TheRedneck

I go to a good school. I don't go to a public school. Let me make it clear to everyone that public education isn't as good as people say it is. People say that a public education is good because it will make you a Democratic citizen because you need to be around people you don't even like. However, the private school I go to is way better than public schools. The teachers have developed ways so that everyone learns at their own pace. The school actually makes learning seem fun. I feel really glad to go to a school like the one I go to especially after I didn't do all that well at my old public high-school. It's different at a private school... the people are nicer... the teachers are better... and I learn more. It's clearly the public education system that's messed up.

I went to various public schools (never private or home schooled) and I understand the reason I failed (several times for that matter) in my compulsory education. I was forced to learn for 5 years around 11 subjects (all present in each weeks timetable):

English, *Language and Literature, 3 out of the 5 years spent "studying" Shakespearian works only a month on actual language most of it self study*

Math, Only the "gifted & capable" students ever got the help they needed, I Myself have a learning problem with Maths and instead of being sent to learning support for it I was sent to Set 2 Maths, which was like sending a newby, beginner or amateur to a class of confident or capable higher end intermediates ( or in grade sense someone who would get E or under to a class of people who are likely to get As and Bs).

Dual Science, *"Earth Science" I.E Geology rip off, Physics, Biology split between two different Science teachers for each group, one would teach Bio and be a better quality teacher since they only ever taught one subject, the other had to teach anything new or unwanted and thus likely was as clueless as the students they where teaching*

MFL-German, If you already knew German you would have to take Spanish (specially arranged, no formal classes so basically one on one teaching) or French (the Rival MFL language in all places I went) usually you would be made to take French if you already had Spanish and/or German. French class like German was class room taught and you had NO say which language you got given when you reached secondary education at 11.

I wanted to take French (due to my siblings having done that course) but I was given German

1 Tech *1 out of the following Cooking, Woodwork, Resistant Materials or Graphics*, Only in Year 7 (11 years of age) did you get to do "tasters of each over the year, 2 and a half months of each over the first year. After that it was enforced, you were given one to do for the entire year, until Year 10 (15 years of age) when you had a choice of which, but still had to take one of them.

Physical Education *Restricted options, Footy (Soccer), Rugby or if you are a girl you would get the third option Netball. Those who wanted Swimming, Cross country or less competitive sports lost out, unless they found a outside group or place to practice.

Religious Education, I honestly remember more from RE class before the age of 10 then I do between 11 and 16. I don't think we really covered anything all I can remember is having lots of different teachers since they couldn't manage the classes they were given (Students upsetting/ bullying the RE staff)

Geography, *Urban/Demography based only occasionally non-human based Geography*

History, *Usually history since 1960, rarely anything earlier*,

Music, NEVER taught how to play or understand musical cords..etc, Though we were given Keyboards with the correct labels on them and given the a paper with the correct order to push keys so we could pretend to be able to play the tune to "Super Trooper by ABBA", then at the end of the week all the class took it in turns to play the weekly tune one after the other....

Art, Probably the best/ most interesting course available on the grounds you were actually taught things and given the option to show the things you learned in your own ways. Taught things like pastel shading or water colour painting, then you could use those methods to do your own picture..etc.

----

When I turned 16 after failing my exams that would allow me into further education, I was dismayed to see that I couldn't take the subjects I wanted to take even if I had passed, at least not through the "official" education channels. I only have two methods (Expensive Private/Self Study) to learn the two languages I want to learn and only one shot (University) to learn Critical Thinking, Theology and Philosophy. I am 20 now and really in the same position I was in back at 11.

children or adults should not be indoctranated. To choose what you want to learn and what your natural aptitude is, ie history lessons could be politically motivated into us,

Well it's because a lot of kids cherry pick what they want to learn and don't understand the value of hard work and the benefits of going the extra mile.
Peer pressure plays a big role too because they would much rather be cool and get accepted by their friends listening to RAP mu (whew, almost said music)

The educational bar has been brought down so low just to make it easier and easier for little Johnny to pass to the next grade that now little Johnny has gotten lazy.
Why does he have to work hard if he is going to get what he wants anyway?
... all he has to do do is say his feelings are hurt or that he is a victim and he will be accomodated.

reply to post by Alxandro


I agree with the cherry picking part, why should I have to learn stuff that I am completely uninterested in? Oh that's right, I have to please the district so that they make more money off of the state, and I do not see any of that money being put into the school. I am forced to go to school making money for the school, and I am gifted with crap that I do not want to learn, sure makes me want to go 5 days a week

reply to post by Frankidealist35


"aught?"