Chemtrails Vs Contrails... There's a MASSIVE Difference!!! Check these out...

DENY IGNORANCE

Well i'm sick of hearing posts made by ignorant people on these boards that chemtrails are the same as contrails. So i have a youtube video for you to watch. Only goes for 3 mins.

Watch this video and I think you'll find it hard to say they're the same thing.




Here's another difference: Check out 2 mins 22 seconds in this one below. The big ones the chemtrail of course. It just stay. While the plane in the background does contrails...



Here's just another lady talking about it with pics that nasa snapped ;-P


Below is a pretty good definition of what the difference is that i ripped from the below link :The site i ripped the below definitions from

Definition of a contrail: A contrail occurs when a plane travels at a high altitude (about 30,000 ft. or more) and compresses the air into a water vapor or ice crystals through jet engines or the wing tips pushing through the air. This trail disappears after a minute or so due to evaporation, because it's water.

Definition of a chemtrail: The term "chemtrail" is a relatively new word, which appeared in the last few years along with the appearance of chemtrails.

A chemtrail is very different from a contrail. At first a chemtrail might look a bit like a contrail. However, instead of disappearing like a contrail does, a chemtrail just keeps spreading out and forming a hazy cloud bank. These trails traverse the whole sky and stay for up to around five or even eight hours. They have been known to turn what was originally a clear blue sky into a grey haze.

And here's a picture from one of our own at ATS - Pilot (hope you dont mind im just trying to illustrate a point.
EXTERNAL IMAGE

[edit on 14-4-2008 by DaRAGE]

Wow 14 views no posts. Anyone actually watch the first video?

It's already been explained dozens of times that, dependent on atmospheric conditions, contrails can and do persist for hours - whilst others, a few thousand feet higher or lower do not. This has been well known for many decades. From the ground it's very difficult to determine the difference between an aircraft flying at 28,000ft and one at 32,000ft.

Try reading this thread: www.abovetopsecret.com...

If you can prove that a contrail cannot be a contrail, then you might be onto something.

But IMHO if chemtrails exist, you can't see them.

reply to post by DaRAGE

These are great videos DaRAGE.

I am involved in an ongoing battle against the IGNORANCE of Chemtrails over at another thread. Your welcome to join in this push to deny my fellow ATSers of their ignorance of Chemtrails.

Here's the link, hope to see you there. My Chemtrail Evidence

I know I'm crazy...(theres a picture from WW2 of some contrails persisting long enough to take a picture:lol

I still have a few questions though... How can one part of a trail persist and one stay, I don't mean half and half, I mean one plane, 2 different looking trails.(one trail people seem to think it looks like DNA and one solid)


So can the atmospheric change very from such a small distance? Very perfectly strait so the thick trail persists and spreads and the 'DNA trail' fade in about 20-30 seconds?

What about 2 trails coming at each other and separate like... well..
---------------/space/---------->

Originally posted by Bumr055

So can the atmospheric change very from such a small distance?

Yes. Because what looks from the ground to be 2 adjacent contrails may well have been produced by aircraft flying a few thousand feet above/below each other and atmospheric conditions can change considerably over that distance.

And just as at sea level, temperatures and humidity at altitude can also change in the space of minutes.

There's a lot of good stuff here: contrailscience.com...

Originally posted by Essan

Yes. Because what looks from the ground to be 2 adjacent contrails may well have been produced by aircraft flying a few thousand feet above/below each other and atmospheric conditions can change considerably over that distance.

And just as at sea level, temperatures and humidity at altitude can also change in the space of minutes.

There's a lot of good stuff here: contrailscience.com...

What is that picture I posted was of One plane? I suppose it's possible for 2 planes to have flown the same speed so I could only make out one. Also that I am lying and that I took a picture of 2 trials but I saw one plane producing the effect in the picture or 2 different looking trails.

What if that was one plane? what if those trails were just over a meter apart? it could very that much that one trial lasts 30 seconds and one meter away could persist for hours? I have noticed it gets colder the farther down you go in water but doesn't seem to go from a warmer temperature strait to very freezing, just a sort of gradient change.

EDIT: messed up quote somehow.

[edit on 4/14/2008 by Bumr055]

One contrail is clearly (from the perspective of an experienced meteorological observer) much older than the other.

Now, if you could produce a picture showing an aircraft producing both trails that'd be a different matter

all I know is what Ive seen with my eyes. Something is going on up there, why its a single trail will linger in the sky for hours spreading a greasy milky haze that grows many fold. I'm curious does any one else believe that Chem Trail activity was much more intense back in 2004-2005.

reply to post by Essan


Well.. I really am not looking to discredit myself anymore, I don't want to be like 'heres proof' I just was looking for an opinion on what logically that could be if it WERE from one plane.

I only have one picture from that day because I got my friend to grab his camera. I know we took more but I only got him to send me that one(that was june 5th 07). As far as I remember it wasn't taken right after but I got him to snap it when one started to break apart and the rest just lingering.

EDIT: I'm only looking to see if maybe I'm not crazy. If your saying that there is no logical explanation for that trail other then 2 planes and one before the other or me lying or hoaxing, then I'll leave it at that because thats exactly what I wanted to hear I feel more sane already.

[edit on 4/14/2008 by Bumr055]

Originally posted by Bumr055
If your saying that there is no logical explanation for that trail other then 2 planes and one before the other

Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying. The older (larger) trail is also probably at a different height to the smaller one and may also have drifted from where it was originally produced

So let me ask this?

Is there scientific proof that these contrails due in fact have some proven damaging effect on us?

Like has someone flown into them and taken samples? This seems like such a waste of human energy complaining over jet streams in the sky that you can do absolutley NOTHING ABOUT!!. with no logical proof other than some retards making google/you tube videos with pictures of clouds and trails from airplanes.

Like people are saying that main line air liners purposely pollute the skies with chemicals added to there jet streams I don't understand please elaborate for me.

Well first there is a bit of disinfo here at ATS.

It seems that some people want to continue to claim that the plains do nothing at all but emit contrails.

Sure this may be harmless (in intent) disinfo, but surely these posters know more of the details of what is happening.

The fact is there is something called cloud seeding...there are actually advertisements from companie(s) for this and it shows the stuff coming out of the airplane.

Does this mean its a chemical vs. contrail? Again try not to get caught up in words or we will stay in ignorance.

If you are stuck in "its a contrail" or "its a chemtrail" then people will debunk and bicker all day.

But when you look and see that planes (factually) cloud seed, this is an activity that puts something in the air that is not just natural contrail formations.

We know the chinese gov. wants to do weather control for the olympics, etc.
(It was on wired.)

The fact:
We know people are doing various things with planes, and this should be the focus perhaps. Otherwise its easy to keep those ignorant of such matters (even though its published in the mainstream media) blind to life around them.

Now if you analyze what the process of cloud seeding by the governments are, even dust cropping and the crap that Monsanto produced (agent orange) for Vietnam...you can see that harmful stuff are/were sprayed in skies...and who is to stop them from doing it now. See this is the question indeed.

So good post, personally I get tired of seeing every day full of grey clouds...in April!
It wasnt always this way where April looked like the winter skies of late Dec.

Interesting, I believe Revelations mentions that 2 prophets will have the power to shut the sky so that it will not rain. Well, if we are so advanced in controlling & manipulating the weather, does this mean the 2 prophets are part of the system...or learn how to manipulate that system. (I suppose they would be viewed as terrorist the way revelations puts them.)

Keep watching the skies...and main part is not to be paranoid about it.
You know, there are ancient (well I should say old) paintings showing planes "spraying" the sky with clouds coming out of their aircraft. Wouldnt be surprised if some old, technologically advanced civilization is still around...or something that was extraterrestrial in life. Sounds out there, but our history is paved with (religious) stories of the unnatural...and billions believe. .

Science is neither good nor bad, its a tool - but how is that tool being used.
I suppose in the end, its as the good book says, "all things work out for good..."

Peace

dAlen

Not more of this rubbish. Instead of folks saying "I don't know about vapour trails", they leap to "oooh no it's the government poisoning me with chemicals!". It's exactly the same as when we were living in caves, ascribing all kinds of bizarre, overly-complicated explanations for very mundane phenomenon. "Where does the sun go at night?" "Well, a dragon must have eaten it", etc.

Stuff like this makes ATS look like its filled with loony, baseless paranoia. Which seems to be quite true.

It seems ignorance breeds conspiracy theories. Well, the ridiculous ones, at least.

Originally posted by dave420
Instead of folks saying "I don't know about vapour trails", they leap to "oooh no it's the government poisoning me with chemicals!".

It seems ignorance breeds conspiracy theories. Well, the ridiculous ones, at least.

I dont know, kind of refer to my post above about this...
See its not about going back and forth and calling each side names and ascribing the term "liar" or "loon" to them - its about realizing that indeed planes are doing more than just flying people around...they do have projects where they spray.

What is it they spray varies...from the crop duster to cloud seeding.
Cloud seeding and weather modification is not a conspiracy, and the guys that do it show photos of the stuff coming out.

Now the question really is this.
If America can use chemicals from Monsanto (Agent Orange in Vietnam) to make their own people sick...and Monsanto is a story in and of itself what it can do to a population with no conscious what soever...

But point is, if we already have had cases of poisons being sprayed on our own people by our own people (americans by americans in vietnam) then why can some of this cloud seeding weather modification not have some sinister bit to it.

Its reality my friend...agent orange happened...again against our own people. Monsanto still happens...look for the video I posted yesterday about them, good french documentary.

So before saying people are paranoid, consider that governments have not done much to really curb this...their actions is what inspires us to wonder what really is in those canisters.

Of course the fact is, no one is forced to believe either way.
Your world is safe, where no one tries to harm anyone...so this is your right to have this world - in that light leave the conspiracies alone of this nature and dont let it disturb your sleep, its not worth stressing over if its not your reality.

On the other hand, if you do see that their may be something to all of this, still no reason to worry...and I think thats why so many people deny - partly - is from fear.
What if the governments are against us? What if big corporations only want our money and take away any right we have. - funny, the article on wired about the music industry saying they own the promo music CDs for 'eternity' and people with promos dont have the right to throw it away....just an example of insanity again, which doesnt exist in some of your guys worlds it seems...

I would say its post like the one Im responding to, that could be disinfo.
But not on purpose, but because it misses the greater picture to look at all aspects without being totally polarizing about it.

Sure it helps people get on one side of the fence faster...but it doesnt truly deny ignorance.

Peace

dAlen

[edit on 15-4-2008 by dAlen]

Originally posted by seridium
So let me ask this?

Is there scientific proof that these contrails due in fact have some proven damaging effect on us?

I wouldn't necessarily say proven. It was thought in the past that persistent contrails which last for hours may result in an overall cooling effect

As per this paper from 1970 However current research suggests that overall they have a warming effect - as per, for example Minnis etal 2003 - and, indeed, any genuine meteorlogical website or book you care to check.

Of course, they also make the skies hazier - no health implications but annoying for us photographers.

Anything is is just made up. Possibly by those aiming to divert attention from this real and genuine effect of increased air traffic.

Whether chemtrails - unseen to the naked eye - are also being sprayed is another matter. But few 'chemtrails beleivers' seem interested in examining that possibility, preferring instead to spread disinfo about normal contrails.


Edit:cloud seeding is another issue - nothing secretive about it. It's done by spraying particles above clouds to make heavier water droplets form so they precipitate earlier than they might naturally do. From the ground though, there's nothing to see.

Whether there are any health implications of this I don;t know. Many experts still question how effective it is and personally I don't like the idea. But in the US anyone can hire a firm to cloud seed for them .....

[edit on 15-4-2008 by Essan]

[edit on 15-4-2008 by Essan]

This is something I just posted, as a response, in another thread about chemtrails. The content of the post is relevant for this thread as well.

--------------------------

Reason to explain what?
Why I have a winter sky for weeks in a row this month (when its spring) as well as for the past months, etc.?

note: These winter skies (grey cloud coverage) comes about because of what you would call contrails...
That is some mighty powerful contrails my friend...explain that away.

Why cloud seed if contrails are that powerful?
You even mentioned that cloud seeding doesnt really work - yet contrails, as you would put it, appear to be perfect for weather modification...because the FACT is the weather is modified by whatever is coming out of those planes. This is the key point to pay attention to...

Explain that and we might get somewhere. But lets keep going, it gets better.
Though the main point is made above about the weather modification happening from this.

I ask, why are there airplanes everywhere, dotting my sky now days, pouring out these billowing clouds behind them which cover my sky?

This is a sky that they only recently decided to show up in. No new airports, so where are these planes from and why are they there? I think that is an interesting point, as well as the fact that they are in every direction (at the same time) until there is good cloud coverage.

Again, these planes leave plumes which go from one horizon to the other...call them 'super trails'...I suppose they think the average Hungarian doesnt look at the sky.

Now lets look at history:
Explain how there was such a thing as planes dumping agent orange in vietnam from a company that still exist, and has the same tactics...(watch the video...excellent documented french documentary on Monsanto)

Do you think they cleaned up their act?
Do you think that governments are now friendly in their mass experimentations?
Or is it that you just cant believe that someone could be this evil. Well history has shown us time and again that people can and do act quite evil.

[Again, agent orange, MKultra, holocaust, etc.]

Tell me this, how do you know with all of this, that it isnt chemicals being sprayed?
Can we throw you up their to take a sniff? (just joking)

But going past peoples 'supposed' area of expertise, its time to look at what we know about the nature of the governments attitude toward people...and what they are capable of doing and have done.

I will say this...chemicals or not...something is being sprayed.
Its not far fetched...again, some of you act as if its a miracle that a plane could possibly spray anything...well crop dusters have been spraying for years, so it is possible.

Knowing that something is being sprayed, the question is what and for what.
Personally I detest it messes with my weather, of course now they are Lords of the weather...beyond it messing with the weather, I would not be surprised if it had a Monsanto 'gift' in it. The same company who claims to want to prevent world Hunger...

You know, here is how things work.

Set up a company to do a bunch of crap, say your doing good...and people will believe you when they see your little smiling logos and pictures of nature.
(well not that funny...)

Peace

dAlen

Originally posted by dAlen

Why cloud seed if contrails are that powerful?

Contrails don't cause precipitation.

You even mentioned that cloud seeding doesnt really work - yet contrails, as you would put it, appear to be perfect for weather modification...because the FACT is the weather is modified by whatever is coming out of those planes. This is the key point to pay attention to...

The weather is modified insofar as skies are hazier and average temps may be slightly higher.

I ask, why are there airplanes everywhere, dotting my sky now days, pouring out these billowing clouds behind them which cover my sky?

Because more and more people like flying more and more often.

Try reading up on the subject,or learn some basic meteorology.

Some starting points:

www.bbc.co.uk...

www.faa.gov...

contrailscience.com...

Originally posted by Essan

Contrails don't cause precipitation.

Well you say that the only thing that exist are contrails...so please stick with the whole story given and not pick and choose.

The weather is being modified, thats a fact...
Here is my response from the other thread:

reply to post by Essan


Well, here is where you and I part paths.
The sky is busier...suppose you did not read my post clearly...not to surprising - after all we only see what we want to see, Im sure you would agree.

Also, I have clearly seen weather affected from these plane clouds...call them what you want...its modified, and it works...just some precipitation? Well you advised me to go research, well I have, my advise for you is to go around the world and see what people (like myself are talking about) before implying that Im lying. - no, I know you didnt mean to at all...but the fact is what I see is what I see, and Im sticking to it.

You havent experienced what I have perhaps, and that is fine.

My post really were not meant for you, per say, but for those people that typically read polarized post and stop there. (i.e. - "they dont exist, IM an expert, your stupid to think other wise"..."oh geeze, I may be stupid...oh well", and off they go. My post is to point out the obvious...crap has been done plenty of times on the masses...who is to say it is not happening now.)

See, my hope would be at least to get people to look at all the aspects.
I will not say that they are carrying chemicals, though seeing history it would not surprise me...but I do see the weather, and its from the 'plane clouds'.

We could talk in circles all day...but as I said, I will leave you with whatever it is you believe...its your right, and I have stated what I could for those that may not have considered more than one aspect to this subject...for pondering.

Peace

dAlen

reply to post by Essan


Try debunking this....

Weather as a Force Multiplier: