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reply posted on 19-3-2008 @ 10:44 PM by BRITWARRIOR
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lol
how is it the best fighter in the world, its not stealth there fore its the best targit in the sky but thats where the best titles stop getting given
to this aircraft, its very manuvorable yes but it does not fly at the speed of a locked on enemy misille, from a stealth aircraft it has just got a
visual of.... 
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reply posted on 19-3-2008 @ 10:51 PM by deadbang
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I swear, if Russia stuck wings on a can of soup, some of you would be telling us IT was the best fighter aircraft in the world!..sheesh
Russia does design some awesome "looking" aircraft...but if you can't put up the cash to produce the damn thing what good is it?
I'll stick with the Raptor, hey, it's actually in production...meaning there is more than just a couple of'em.
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reply posted on 19-3-2008 @ 11:42 PM by Willard856
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There are a hell of a lot more Flankers than Raptors. And for those of us who don't have access to the F-22, discussion around the capabilities of
our opposition is important, so we aren't so quick to dismiss such things. While there are aspects of the Russian arms trade that oversell their
product, the Su-30 is one aircraft that deserves to be lauded. It isn't the #1 fighter in the world, but it is definitely up there.
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reply posted on 20-3-2008 @ 01:13 AM by pugachev
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 Originally posted by Willard856
There are a hell of a lot more Flankers than Raptors. And for those of us who don't have access to the F-22, discussion around the capabilities of
our opposition is important, so we aren't so quick to dismiss such things. While there are aspects of the Russian arms trade that oversell their
product, the Su-30 is one aircraft that deserves to be lauded. It isn't the #1 fighter in the world, but it is definitely up there. 
All together maybe, but no single country has more su-30s than the US has raptors...Russia has only aquired 10 of them so far.
[edit on 3/20/08 by pugachev]
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reply posted on 20-3-2008 @ 03:34 AM by Willard856
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My comment was in relation to the "there is only one or two" comment. Fact is the production line is open, and the market is good. China would
probably have more Su-30s than the US has F-22s, but not by much. But there is a world of difference between the two compartively as pointed out.
Anyhow, both great aircraft.
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reply posted on 20-3-2008 @ 04:14 AM by chinawhite
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reply posted on 20-3-2008 @ 08:09 AM by truttseeker
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Thats a great picture...but um...what about it? Anyway, wow, the aircraft can maneuver without weapons and full fuel load  . Granted its a great
aircraft but come on, I'd like to see a pilot with a full combat load and in the heat of battle do that. Great aircraft though, cant wait to see what
the PAK-FA will do.
[edit on 20-3-2008 by truttseeker]
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reply posted on 20-3-2008 @ 08:55 AM by WestPoint23
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Originally posted by Willard856
China would probably have more Su-30s than the US has F-22s, but not by much.
According to the 2008 Pentagon Report on China the PLAAF currently has 76 operational Su-30MKK and 24 operational Su-30MK2. The USAF just received
Raptor 4113 February 15th and Raptor's 4119/4120 are undergoing final assembly.
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reply posted on 20-3-2008 @ 09:07 AM by Harlequin
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WHEN THE HELL DID THE USAF GET 4000 RAPTORS :O
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reply posted on 20-3-2008 @ 09:10 AM by Harlequin
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reply to post by truttseeker
www.abovetopsecret.com...
Typhoon doing ACM with full weapons load
Flanker - pfffft
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reply posted on 20-3-2008 @ 09:21 AM by WestPoint23
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Originally posted by Harlequin
WHEN THE HELL DID THE USAF GET 4000 RAPTORS
The four is disregarded when all you want to know is the number of production airframes that have been built.
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reply posted on 20-3-2008 @ 10:12 AM by deadbang
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reply to post by Willard856
Apologies on the one or two staement, being flippant...I accept that the Su-30 production line has cranked out more than a "couple" of these
aircraft....I guess what Im trying to say is...lets wait and see till the production run is over for both of these aircraft...I'm willing to bet
there will be far more Raptors in the worlds inventories than Flanker-Cs...also willing to bet that the block improvements over the course of
production runs for both will put the Raptor beyond the reach of the Flanker in all categories...
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reply posted on 20-3-2008 @ 10:27 AM by bkcrt
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Originally posted by West Coast
The best aircraft in the world isnt Russian. This aircraft is 4.5 gen tech. Its not even a true 5th generation fighter, like the F22 is, which just
happens to also incorporate a stealth plane on top of its 5th gen tech...in the end, this thing while a good plane, doesnt stack up to the Raptors
capabilities...
The truth. Nothing but the truth. The Raptor's interal systems are all still Top Secret but imploy an "active" radar and radio jamming system,
among other things.
The F-22 will pretty much replace every plane in the fleet except cargo planes and massive bombers.
[edit on 20-3-2008 by bkcrt]
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reply posted on 20-3-2008 @ 11:02 AM by kilcoo316
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Originally posted by bkcrt
The F-22 will pretty much replace every plane in the fleet except cargo planes and massive bombers.
Problem is - if there is only 150 odd of them - thats gonna be a mighty small and overworked fleet.
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reply posted on 20-3-2008 @ 11:21 AM by centurion1211
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Originally posted by guppy
Oh please, the SU-30 is a 4.5 generation fighter. But Russia's SU47 Berkut could turn heads:
SU-47 Berkut
Russia always shows this off at their yearly Air Show. Its pretty amazing what it can do. Berkut is probably as manueverable as the Raptor. I'm
not sure about speed or stealthiness.
SU-47
According to this article the SU-47 is really just a renamed SU-37.
Wiki Article
 The Sukhoi Su-47 Berkut (Russian: Су-47 Беркут - Golden Eagle), also designated S-32 and S-37 during initial development, is an
experimental supersonic jet fighter developed by Sukhoi Aviation Corporation. A distinguishing feature of the aircraft is its forward-swept wing,
similar to that of the Grumman X-29. Its NATO reporting name is "Firkin". The sole aircraft produced is an advanced technology demonstrator
prototype and manufacture of a planned second flying prototype was cancelled. Originally known as the S-37, Sukhoi redesignated its advanced test
aircraft as the Su-47 in 2002. Officially nicknamed Berkut (Golden Eagle), the Su-47 was originally built as Russia's principal testbed for composite
materials and sophisticated fly-by-wire control systems. The aircraft makes use of forward-swept wings allowing superb maneuverability and operation
at angles of attack up to 45° or more.
So, it's been renamed twice and is a one-of-a-kind prototype, and with a designed "borrowed" from the older U.S. X-29. 
Why is anyone even talking about this flying crate? Compares with an F-22???
[edit on 3/20/2008 by centurion1211]
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reply posted on 20-3-2008 @ 11:28 AM by pavil
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Just an aside question. How often is the "stall and hover" feature of vector thrusting going to be useful in air to air engagements? Seems more or
an airshow feature than a combat feature. I assume it will allow for tighter turns, quick changes of direction etc, but they always want to show
videos of these kind of jets nose up in the air hovering. While that is impressive, I don't see the use of it.
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reply posted on 20-3-2008 @ 11:29 AM by FredT
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Originally posted by bkcrt
The truth. Nothing but the truth. The Raptor's interal systems are all still Top Secret but imploy an "active" radar and radio jamming system,
among other things. The F-22 will pretty much replace every plane in the fleet except cargo planes and massive bombers.
I assume you are refering to the AESA array on the Raptor. Yes it will have the ability to do focused jamming and electronic attack, that facet will
not be unique to the a/c. Any AESA equiped craft will eventually have that ability.
The Raptor will top out at 183 a/c last time I checked. and will not replace even the number of F-15 A/B/C's we have at this time. Perhaps you are
refering to the F-35?
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reply posted on 20-3-2008 @ 11:32 AM by FredT
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Originally posted by pavil
Just an aside question. How often is the "stall and hover" feature of vector thrusting going to be useful in air to air engagements? Seems more or
an airshow feature than a combat feature.
Its not as all powerfull as people make it out to be. IT rocks at an airshow and is impressive when trying to sell the a/c to some third world
strongman but as an ACM it does not seem to be the end all be all. We have had huge threads on this issue and of course proponents of super
manuverability will say its the cats meow.
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reply posted on 20-3-2008 @ 11:35 AM by FredT
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reply to post by centurion1211
Actually the S-47 was quite an impressive craft and the manuverability was pretty impressive too. They appear to have solved the FSW issue of
aero-elastic divergence and the aircraft was never intended IMHO for serial production but rather a technology testbed. If they had gone down that
route (and still may) it would have been an impressive frontline fighter.
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reply posted on 20-3-2008 @ 11:42 AM by RedBaron
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It says S-37 not Su-37. These are two different aricraft.
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