The 3 main types of civilization

Dr. Michio Kaku, theoretical physicist and co-founder of string field theory, a branch of superstring theory, speaks about 3 types of Extraterrestrial Civilizations.

reply to post by jbondo


Even though this man has some interesting theories and is scientific in nature, I still find it hard to believe some of his far out explanations... Has he met any of these other civilizations? Does math prove there are these types of civilizations? Where is he getting his information from exactly... String theory? M theory? And even so those are just theories correct? I've seen a lot of videos with this guy and he's always talking, but never really seems to convince me of his ideas... Although he does give good examples... Does not make his word is finite... I find him to be a very imaginative dreamer...

sure you can say these types of civs could exist. Looking at our own civ and looking to the future and how me might develop.

But the big questions he doesnt have any answers for are "how many civs are in the galaxy?" and "why do we see no signs of them?"

I find this very interesting. I have heard other people talk about type 2 and 3 civilizations before, not just this guy. Unfortunately I have yet to find any refference materials, just clips of people talking.
Who knows maybe this thread will open up the discussion.
Great post either way!

Ok, so a quick google search shows that Dr. Michio Kaku seems to be the main speaker these days on this subject.
The theory was first developed in 1964 by Nikolai Kardashev

[edit on 18-3-2008 by Kashodi]

[edit on 18-3-2008 by Kashodi]

I am curious if anyone has read anyone here has read either hyperspace or parallel worlds by Dr Kaku?
I do advise it. very good books.

Anywho. the talks more into depth regarding the civilisation catagories.
He never proclaims it to be his theory but a rather old one that he quite eloquently explains.
All it is, is a basic measuring stick by which we can classify civilizations by their power usage and utilization.

It is by no means presumptious, and has far from anything to do specifically string theory/m-theory or any other major theory. It just gives a common sense outline of what level a civilisation is at without being too specific.

Makes sense to me, I LIKE

reply to post by ElectricUncleSam


ElectricalUncleSam,

I don't know, eUncleSam. It sounds like a closed-minded response. There is a lot we don't know about the universe. And it is true that all the top-minds' theories, like Michio Kaku, Stephen Hawking and others, are just that. They are theories or guesses based on the available data they have at the current time. And each of them are humble enough to say so.

Best question to ask yourself is this: The known universe is 14 billiion years old. Our solar system and planet has only been around 4 - 5 billion years. Humans have been roaming the earth, supposedly, tens of thousands of years. Humans have only occupied known time for only a drop of a bucket. Ask yourself how would a civilization be if it was 10,000 years older than us? Better yet, how would we perceive a civlization that is a million years old? Or a billion years old?! They could possibly god-like in our eyes because of their technology is so alien and so wonderful. Do not assume alien life in the universe develops exactly like humans do.

You should read Michio Kaku's and Stephen Hawkings' books. Very intriguing and good for the mind. It kinda puts you in perspective with our little pond and the universe.

As for the types of civilization, Dr. Kaku did not invent it. It was created by a Russian phycisist, named Nikolai Kardashev. And the types of civlization is called the Kardashev scale. See link...

Kardashev Scale

reply to post by ElectricUncleSam


One more thing, eUncleSam. The M Theory and String Theory derives from Einstein's Theory of Everything. It is the theory to explain everything from how the macroverse (planets, galaxies, etc.) interact with the microverse (atoms, neutrons, etc.). Einstein worked till his death on the Theory of Everything and was no where near completion. But today's physicists, like Kaku and Hawking, have taken up the challenge. Good luck to them. The biggest problem is the planck (spelled right?) constant...

Planck Constant

eUncleSam, please read more about this subject and return. I would love to talk to you about these subjects. I just wished the rest of the world would do the same instead of focusing their lives on Brittney Spears, what car to drive, who is having sex with whom?, and so forth. We should progress not digress.

[edit on 18-3-2008 by guppy]

Originally posted by yeti101
But the big questions he doesnt have any answers for are "how many civs are in the galaxy?" and "why do we see no signs of them?"

He did talk about it a little saying that maybe civilizations dont make it to type 2 or type 3 because maybe they blew eachother up. i do get scared sometimes that some scientist will be messing around and end the world by accident..lol.

Perhaps we don't see them is because we can not comprehend what we are seeing. Its like the fish in the pond analogy:

You have a fish in a pond. The pond is its world. Everything a fish does and dos are natural and all the fish scientists know about it. But there are some "natural occurrences" that do happen, like when it rains and the raindrops cause ripple effects on the surface. Fish sees it happens and just makes a theory what it could be. Its based on their perspective.

Then, as Bob the Fish is swimming along to meet his friend, he sees a peculiar object on the surface. All of a sudden, a human snatches Bob with a hand. Bob is taken through the surface to an alien world with no water to breath with. There is this big, ugly creature grasping onto Bob with weird looking fins. And, as quick as it started, it ends. Bob is dropped back into the pond. Bob quickly tells every fish he sees about his strange experience. But all the fishes think Bob is crazy.

reply to post by guppy


Maybe Bob is crazy....

A screenname "guppy"....? Using an analogy that involves "fish"....? What's going on here?

Good lord.....the fish have become sentient....

I wonder what level of civilization they'll attain? Not much farther than breaded and fried I imagine? Careful fish...I'm keeping an eye on ya'.

Hahaha! Careful when you use "Guppy". Its on NSA's Echelon's keyword list.

NSA Echelon Keyword List

As for the fish analogy, you've read through the lines. We fish are a proud race, except for tilapias. Soon, we fishes will rise from your beaches and take back what was once ours.

BTW, there was another analogy about the ant and a freeway. But the fish in the pond is a good story.

For those people do deny the fact that life exists outside our planet, or even our solar system, send them to the Atlas of the Universe:

Atlas of the Universe

I love this website. You start at viewing our solar system from a distance of 12.5 lightyears. You end up zooming out to 14 billion lightyears. Its very humbling knowing how big our universe is. Denying that life does not exist outside of Earth is like saying our world is flat.

reply to post by guppy


Guppy, I'm disappointed that you have nothing to say about my last post. Could be taken as a joke but it was meant to provoke philosophic.

reply to post by jbondo


Don't worry, I got it. Took a while....scratched my head, smoked a couple cigarettes....

I've always felt that any attempt to categorize civilizations other than here on Earth, was an exercise in "making stuff up". Don't take that wrong....they may turn out to be pretty darn close....but still, all we have to work with is what we've done on this planet. I may be too pragmatic or too much of a geek, but....having no comparative or empirical data to compile these theories smacks of science fiction.

Almost forgot to add....Maybe Bob is crazy.



[edit on 22-3-2008 by MrPenny]

I read a book on this subject called "A Giant Leap" by Adrian Berry, Headline Publishing. It talks about civilization types 0 to 3 and the power they can harness with theories about how we could realistically evolve to advance our civilization type and our transition to the stars, how others may have done and explores some of the more down to earth implications. I thought it was a good read anyway.

fantastic imagery there! Flag + star.


Yes hes got some good theories, but only time will tell if they are correct.

jbondo, i'm sorry. i misread your post. i thought you were just throwing in a sarcastic remark.

Bob could be crazy. It is easy to dismiss one fish. But what happens when multiple fishes experience the same episodes. These fishes have no connection with one another and live on seperate sides of the pond. Plus, some fishes have never heard of Bob's story, so they could not use that as a basis.

Take Sam the fish's experience. Sam is swimming along when he gets abducted and thrown into this pseudo-pond surrounded by invisible walls -- a fishbowl. Sam is confused by what everything he sees. His living space is confined and blocked by invisible "force fields" (glass). Food only comes at certain times from the only opening which Sam can not jump out of. Worse of all, ugly beings are watching him constantly -- we'll call them who-mans. Within a few days, Sam is deaf because who-mans keep pounding on the force fields causing thunderous noises.

After months of isolation, Sam is going delirious and losing hope. One day, a bigger who-man comes up and snatches Sam out of the fishbowl. Sam is then thrown back into the pond. All the fishes exclaim in confusion and excitement. Sam is confused, deaf and traumatized by the experience. Within a few days, Sam kills himself because Mrs. Sam got Guppy-fever and remarried.

(dark huh?)

Originally posted by MrPenny
I've always felt that any attempt to categorize civilizations other than here on Earth, was an exercise in "making stuff up".

Me too....

reply to post by guppy


Sam was pretty hearty! I figured him to die in a week and be flushed.