Should MODS use sock puppets to moderate?

I was thinking… Should ATS moderators, supers and admins be given a sock puppet account in order to do their moderating?

It can sometimes be difficult to tell whether a MOD is posting as a conspiracy theorist expressing his/her opinion or as a moderator doing his/her job.

Also, there are moderators for which I have a great amount of respect for, and sadly, there can be some that I have very little respect for. I have yet to receive any warnings on ATS, but I have a feeling if this particular moderator was to warn me (even for a worth-while reason), I might snap (temporarily of course) and become in danger of losing my account privileges. (Call it a superiority complex)

I’ve noticed in the few other non-ATS forums I’ve posted in, that this is not done. So, there must be a reason why this is a particularly bad idea. Could someone enlighten me as to why?

Thoughts/opinions?


[edit on 16/3/08 by ConspiracyNut23]

reply to post by ConspiracyNut23


Interesting idea, though wouldnt it just be too much work for the mods?

reply to post by ConspiracyNut23


then how can we see some mods slip up in their posts

then again a majority (maybe all) of mods post like any other member so i dont how its difficult to see if they are using their mod stance as their posting attitude would change to enforce the TC on the topics.

intresting how some people always seem to point out Mods when they post something expecting them to change their views into a PC reply .
(not saying your one of them)

Originally posted by ConspiracyNut23
I was thinking… Should ATS moderators, supers and admins be given a sock puppet account in order to do their moderating?

If a mod used a sock to moderate, wouldn't that sock need to be listed as a mod?

I don't get it. How would they be able to moderate as a sock?

Originally posted by ConspiracyNut23
I’ve noticed in the few other non-ATS forums I’ve posted in, that this is not done. So, there must be a reason why this is a particularly bad idea. Could someone enlighten me as to why?
[edit on 16/3/08 by ConspiracyNut23]

Um, because it's deceptive and dishonest?

I fail to see how this would be a beneficial thing. I have never had the problem of finding the differences between the post of a Mod that is there opinion on a subject, or when they are doing their job. They are members just like everyone else and quite often feel the need to remind others of that. They were given their jobs because they can be tactful and civil and can maintain that between other members. If everyone were to behave of their own accord with the T&C rules they agreed to upon becoming members, we would have such a great need for even more Mods and SuperMods.
What an annoyance it would be for a Moderator to have two accounts .
Just my 2 pennies.

Here's an oldie but goodie thread:
Moderators Are People Too. (and they have opinions)

reply to post by ConspiracyNut23
Humor me just a bit. I'm rather new here. Not a seasoned, all knowing and popular member. Tell me why a mod would need or want to hide under another identity when he/she is doing their job? If someone is going to judge or penalize me I want them to be open and straight forward about it.

A mod is still a member and one of us. During the short time I've been active here I have noticed how fair and understanding they have been.

This is only a discussion forum on the net. Why might you snap if certain mods warn you? Would you snap if you were on a corporate board in real life and the CEO chastised you? Would you go postal in real life if a person in authority ruffled your feathers?

Personally I'm not here to win friends or influence people. I'm here to learn from others and help when I can. There are rules. I will follow them to the best of my ability. If I don't like the actions of the mods I will go elsewhere. We do still have free will.

I am very surprised how lenient the mods are sometimes. Some of the members can be very hateful and uncivilized and nothing is done about it. But, that's OK, I am civilized and very able to control my emotions and not feel the need to return the ill will towards that poster.

No sock puppets for mods please. Let me face my accuser.

Dizzie

reply to post by bodrul

(not saying your one of them)

Until the “posts” feature is returned, you’ll have to take my word for it that I’m not.

reply to post by Lug

The sock would be used for moderating. Like Mod1, Mod2, Mod3… etc.

reply to post by AccessDenied

I have never had the problem of finding the differences between the post of a Mod that is there opinion on a subject, or when they are doing their job.

I think if you’d ask me for an actual example of this, I might be hard-pressed. In the relatively short time I was here, I do recall it happening in a post by Springer. I was confused if his statements were his opinion or if they were official ATS policy. (I should point out that I think Springer’s an excellent Admin/Moderator and he’s doing a great job in the UFO forums. )

Sometimes, it might be something as simple as "Is he/she officially asking me to drop this line of thought/reasoning?"

reply to post by SkepticOverlord

That’s what I mean by enlightening me, thanks for the link. (PS, were you moderating just now?
________

I’ve found some more info on this. Apparently such a system is referred to as stealth moderating in forum lingo. I’ve found that the Lonely Planet forum uses them. (not a member, but I’m a fan of their books)

I’ve also found this discussion on a reputable web mastering forum. (I've should have known that my idea wasn't original, so few of them are... ) As chromatico mentions above, it could be somewhat deceptive.


[edit on 16/3/08 by ConspiracyNut23]

Originally posted by dizziedame
Tell me why a mod would need or want to hide under another identity when he/she is doing their job?

So that by day, I can be mild mannered Nef, shy, shambling meek spectacle wearing ATS member, but by night I don my spandex tights, kevlar cloak and mask and become Neformore, champion of the T&C, dooer of good deeds, righter of wrongs, and...ummm.....

Actually I'm the same person all the time

I think it's important for the member to know which staff is taking action against them, as it helps maintain accountability. The staff has plenty of measures in place to make sure nothing is abused, but our greatest asset is the ability of the membership to voice their concerns. To say "Moderator-1" abused his or her power is not something I would like to see.

Prior to becoming a staff member, I really had no trouble whatsoever ciphering what was moderation and what was expressing an opinion. I really do not think it is that much trouble, but alas this has been an issue for quite some time; so some members obviously have a problem with it.

The average post by a staff member is not an ATS policy. Policies are threads that already exist that we post in moderator notes. They would look something like this...

Mod Note: Relevant topic -- Please Review

A simple rule of thumb to abide by...

If we are engaging the members, we are posting as a moderator.

If we are engaging the subject matter of the thread, we are posting as a member.

Maybe that would help resolve some of the confusion surrounding the day to day postings of staff members.

Edit to add:
No, I don't think they should use sockpuppets, but I think it's all right for them to have one. As long as they don't post in the same thread or talk to each other, it's fine (as far as I can tell. I don't have one - too much to keep up with, imo)

On the attitude, despite how it seems, I think the Mods are good at their job, and there's no vindictiveness or anything personal, ever.

One way I know is that they just voted to let back in one or two members who were banned. These former members were -quite- naughty. But they were forgiven after agreeing to be good.

From talking to many of the Mods it appears the predominate theme in the background in ATS modding is to try and get the member squared-away and get right back on the board (but abiding by T&C), -not- to get rid of them.

Do I still gripe and moan to myself? Sure. Can't please everyone. Everyone copes. Learning to cope and be civil on a public board is good. If you want to rant and rave and cuss there are other places that allow that.

HTH.

2 cents.






[edit on 16-3-2008 by Badge01]

Originally posted by ConspiracyNut23
I have a feeling if this particular moderator was to warn me (even for a worth-while reason), I might snap ...
Thoughts/opinions?

I think it's not a good idea for the mods to hide behind an anonymous name to prevent members from snapping. Just say no to snapping.

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
I think it's not a good idea for the mods to hide behind an anonymous name to prevent members from snapping.

Just say no to snapping.

Then who'd we know zinged us? Not that I've ever been zinged...came close once or twice. Nope, just say no to snapping.

It's not possible. Staff actions generate u2u's for actions taken. That being said, if you aren't a staff member you don't have the buttons to take those actions. BH can vouch for that, she's been a mod before.

I'd just like everyone to know;

I am kicking buttocks on TOEE.

I have a lot of trouble keeping up with what I do as one person, doubling that would only add to the problems. I would have to keep checking to see if I sent a U2U as #1 or #2, and pretty soon I would be sending myself U2Us and Remain on Topic notices.

I do post some, though not as much as I did before. But part of the reason is that I'm busy trying to help with the chores around the board.

When I post in a thread, I sometimes use the "IMO" to show that I am just voicing my own opinion, and not representing anything other than my own point of view. Usually I do this on a thread where I am disagreeing with someone about the stance they are taking.

This would be a really miserable job if I could no longer participate as a member, and had to keep all of my posting duty related. I accepted the position of moderator because I hoped that I could give something back to a community that has benefited me with a place to learn and express myself. I accepted because of the pride I have in our community here, and if being a moderator can further that community, then it is a job well worth doing.

A sock puppet would be easily seen through anyway, as posting styles and manners of speech are unique, even in a medium such as this.

Everybody that has been on ATS for any length of time has their certain couple of members on here that they dislike... sometimes it's based on their opinion and attitude, sometimes it is something as trivial as their username or display picture. I don't think hiding behind "sock puppets" isn't going to change that.

You don't have to like them, you don't even have to respect them... but you owe them the courtesy to not make it a public affair. Over time I've learned... you just have to switch it off. Avoid reading their posts, just block them out. If it comes down to it, you can always hit the "ignore" button.

It also just seems like a huge inconvenience for mods to switch back and forth between accounts on a regular basis.

As much as you hate to get warnings from your arch-nemesis mod, it's always nice to know which mod is giving you applauses too. Remember that all mods are volunteers, they're doing this just for the love of it and out of the goodness of their heart. Maybe there are one or two "control freaks" who just like the power, but most moderators are genuinely trying to help out the community.

Personally tell a mod "thank you" today... better yet, tell the one you dislike. You will know you have truely grown as a person when you can thank your enemy and appreciate what they do. Go on, you know you want to

.


[edit on 3/16/2008 by Yarcofin]

Its simple:

Mods who are participating in a thread shouldnt actively Mod in that thread but ask other Mods to help out. In rare cases this happens anyway but can easily be lifted by filing a complaint about the Mod. We are not above critisism and do make mistakes.

But in general, Mod-decisions are not made solo but after discussing things with other Mods. If more than 2-3 mods agree on an action, its undertaken. This is a lot of work, but it ensures fairness.

Way back in the day, when I was a mod, I had a sock puppet. The problem is I rarely if ever used it. There was no reason for me to use it.

Being a mod did not mean I was above the rules or got a free pass on anything. I was still accountable to the T&C's just like every one else. Sometimes I did and said great things and sometimes I seriously screwed the pooch. Just like every other member on this board.

I suppose the sock puppet I had is still around some where, though I forget the name or password. I think it was Grimstear, or something like that. The truth is I had no use for one then I still don't.

Then, as now, If I have something to say I want you to know who is saying it and that I get the credit or flame. It's just simpler that way.