Ape trounces the best of the human world in memory competition, page 1

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Topic started on 26-1-2008 @ 11:34 AM by Buck Division

Ape trounces the best of the human world in memory competition

www.dailymail.co.uk

It is thought that young chimps are blessed with photographic memories, allowing them to remember patterns and sequences with amazing accuracy.

Professor Tetsuro Matsuzawa, the Kyoto University researcher behind both sets of experiments, said: "People still believe that humans are superior to chimpanzees in any domain of intelligence.

"That is the prejudice of the people. "

(visit the link for the full news article)

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reply posted on 26-1-2008 @ 11:34 AM by Buck Division

I think this article illustrates quite clearly, and indisputably, that human consciousness is much more than simply memory and processing power.

Intelligence is often defined as our "remembered information". By that definition, I guess this chimp is more intelligent that we are. Yet, even though the chimp has a immense memory, and skill enough to be tested, apparently there is some other quality to humanity that falls outside of our ability to remember things. Evidently, there is more to human consciousness than our memories.

Why is it that chimps, given their superior memory ability, have yet to create their own chat forum here on ATS? I think the answer is: unknown! However, some people would say it is because you need a "soul" in order to communicate, and only humans have that particular ethereal feature, whatever that may actually be.

www.dailymail.co.uk
(visit the link for the full news article)

reply posted on 26-1-2008 @ 11:39 AM by oLDWoRLDDiSoRDeR

They did a special on this not too long ago . And there are a few "viral" videos showing the chimps crush humans in a short term memory test .

Matter of fact heres one

YouTube Link

reply posted on 26-1-2008 @ 11:51 AM by Buck Division

reply to post by oLDWoRLDDiSoRDeR

Excellent!

The article describes the testing, but the video really makes it clear. Looks like there is some sort of "positional recall" memory going on. I didn't get that from the article, so this video contributes a lot to the thread.

Thanks for the video.

reply posted on 26-1-2008 @ 11:52 AM by oLDWoRLDDiSoRDeR

reply to post by Buck Division

No problem . There are a few different ones . This is the one i liked . It seems un-bias. And a bit more professional than the other one i saw . But i just happen to see them in passing . Glad to contribute

[edit on 26-1-2008 by oLDWoRLDDiSoRDeR]

reply posted on 26-1-2008 @ 03:29 PM by Buck Division

Continuing to ponder this article, several hours later:

IQ tests must be useless in gauging the worth of human beings, because clearly these tests measure the reflexive parts of the human brain rather than any real aspect of humanity. It follows that those who try to measure human worth by means of intelligence tests are participating in a cruel fallacy.

We use IQ tests to classify humans for better or worse. People with high IQ scores may feel superior to others. Societies such as Mensa and the Prometheus Society place themselves on a higher plane than the rest of humanity – they expect their opinions to be given regard than normal folk. But if IQ is a true measure of human worth, don’t chimps deserve an even higher place in society? Those that value high IQ scores should regard chimps as objects of worship!

More disturbing yet: scientists and researchers, such as William Shockley and Richard Herrnstein and others, have used IQ test scores to justify rascism, by pointing out the differences in IQ scores between the various world populations. IQ scores are used to diminish entire sectors of humanity. And people accept that! The article of the OP refutes this. Certainly, if reflexive intellectual talents, such as those measured by IQ tests, are good indicators of worth, chimps must be superior to all human races! They perform so well on this test!

So we see that clasifying people by IQ scores is a major fallacy. It causes societal harm. How many people have had their self worth brutally and fallaciously reduced, when they find that their IQ score is lower than they expected? How many good people have been wrongly discounted and marginalized because of some stupid IQ test result?

It seems to me a better way of measuring the worth of a human would be to look at metrics such as empathy, and curiousity, and tenaciousness, and creativity. Forget about IQ tests as a measurement of human worth – chimps are apparently better than humans.

Just some thoughts on this drizzly afternoon….

reply posted on 26-1-2008 @ 04:02 PM by oLDWoRLDDiSoRDeR

I saw one of those studys on racism . Its crazy .
If you take people raised in different backgrounds and taught at different schools of course raised with different values and beliefs . With different views and cultures . You will defiantly get different answers.

The real question is was the tests skewed to reflect what the guy wanted or was it legit?
I mean you would have to almost fashion each test to the background of the person to get a real answer wouldn't you . I mean a guy from Kansas is going to know less about new york than a guy from new york .

reply posted on 29-1-2008 @ 01:26 PM by Buck Division

Originally posted by oLDWoRLDDiSoRDeR
The real question is, were the tests skewed to reflect what the guy wanted or was it legit?

William Shockley skewed the intelligence tests he administered to reflect what he wanted. Definitely.

The more complex and subtle thing is that what Shockley wanted is also what ALL OF HIS FRIENDS and associates wanted. He defined a little select group, and they control the admission to that group. The group was large, and had credibility with others, and took on a life of its own.

IQ tests are a tool for reducing and eliminating diversity, which is wrong, wrong, wrong to do. Without diversity, we have fascism.

So I guess the question is as follows: is fascism legit? Some have believed that, through history. They can support this idea because fascism (whether we like it or now) works very well IN THE SHORT TERM. However, over time, fascist societies become brittle, and shatter to pieces. Fascism may create hardness, but it doesn't create STRENGTH.

I would say fascism is a very mean spirited philosophy. It is a common pitfall of human thinking that we revist over and over again, to be temporarily trapped in its clutches.

My feelings towards IQ tests are quite similar.

Good point (as usual, OldWorld!)

reply posted on 29-1-2008 @ 01:37 PM by oLDWoRLDDiSoRDeR

reply to post by Buck Division

Awe your gonna make me blush

Now i feel the need to argue against my points lol

But truly you would have to raise 2 kids from birth and teach them equal things for equal times and then take into consideration . Diseases mental barriers and any other disorder that would lead on to test lower than another .

And then the kids would have to care about how they tested. And know they were competing from the start to get anywhere near a "legit" result .

So in closing . It will be impossible to EVER get a result that isn't skewed in the researchers favor. To do the test at all shows bias and or a belief that you would/could get a correct reading .
Which in my opinion means the research(er) cant be taken seriously.
No matter how hard they try.

Someone needs to chime in and disagree . lol We have such good arguments for our side .

[edit on 29-1-2008 by oLDWoRLDDiSoRDeR]

reply posted on 29-1-2008 @ 01:45 PM by Mirthful Me

Scoreboard!

Gold star for my brethren.

Now if we could just get simian suffrage maybe we could elect worthy leadership. I could just see a poo caucus... That would put a quick end to the professional lobby consortium.

Brainiac Monkeys, not just for Intellectual Olympics anymore...

reply posted on 29-1-2008 @ 01:51 PM by ChronMan

IQ tests on Race translate to IQ tests on Location/Upbringing.

Race is mainly location.
You do not posses more or less intelligence due to Race, that is pretty foolish to assume.

People subconciously confuse Race with location and its lead to plenty of ignorant conclusions.

reply posted on 29-1-2008 @ 02:04 PM by Beachcoma

reply to post by Mirthful Me

I think your brethren are preparing to take over the world after we humans finish killing most of each other off. Quietly waiting. Then, finish us up.

Chimps hunt prey with spears, scientists find

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