The Holocaust is Overrated

Originally posted by memyself_I
OHH you poor fool..
I pity u indeed ..
READ 1st then RESEARCH then come back ...Dont just answer with you mindless dribble which in any way is not your thoguhts
but out of your schoolbook ..

DID u actiually look at my posts !!

Go on read them and then answer ...

I HATE fascism !!!!!!!!


that is why i want the past to be represented as it happened ...IN OUR HISTORY BOOKS!


Fachist !?
That BTW is the world you live in ..Can you not see it ..?
No you cannot because you dont know what it is ...

THIS (here and NOW ) is a GLOBAL fachist Cooperate world ..
So people like you running around with a bag over their heads really deserve this world
why are you opinionated when it s obvious to any normal free thinking human that something is not right with this story in history ?

and you and your children are taught the history as they tell you to ensure in todays cooperate fachist world you are kept blind to see that NAZIS didnt loose the war they merly moved operations to the cooperate world and the USA
YES the US ! No1 fachist cooperate police state .

Of course noone recongnizes Fachism anymore ..when you have fools like you populating the planet ..


plz EDUCATE YOURSELF AND SEE THE LIES


AND no HITLER was a bas&%$& and he would have killed me immediatly i think outside the box
You on the other hand adhere to the status que and he would have been happy with you on his side ..


..I stare in disbelieve at the average stupidity of human kind

[edit on 30-5-2008 by memyself_I]

If you hate Fascists so much, why do you sound so much like one, and parrot their pet conspiracy theory (well, among the ones who aren't proud that their chosen political ideology enaged in genocide)?

And I very much doubt historical accuracy is your main concern here. How many peer-reviewed papers and studies on the Holocaust have you read? And no, David Duke is not a peer-reviewed source.

Sorry to burst your incredibly paranoid bubble, but the world we live in isn't fascist, unless you are reducing the term to something functionally meaningless. Google "Politics and the English Language" by Orwell. Please. Last time I checked, most of the world did not come under the commonly accepted definitions of fascism. You know, the ones created by political scientists and historians and philosophers. In fact, I've got a copy of Robert O Paxton's The Anatomy of Fascism right here. and the modern world is hitting upon very few points.

Would you like to try again?

Originally posted by memyself_I
@LoneWeasel

I understand and agree we will never be on the same point ..so lets leave it at that ..

Just a few comment on your mindless dribble(feels nice don’t it beeing insulted for no reason )

It doesn't feel nice, it doesn't feel anything at all to be honest, it's water off a duck's back. I don't see why you find my "dribble" to be mindless, and I continue to stand by my assertion that I've answered your point adequately in previous posts on this thread - and by my suspicion that you haven't read the thread properly.

As regards the specific point of German national sentiment (which is the only point I feel I haven't adequately expressed my opinion on in the pages that precede your ten-post rant), I feel quite strongly that your feelings of being oppressed are personal to you,

Ahh no why would that be? don’t put words in my mouth this is childish .

I wasn't doing anything of the sort, I was simply stating an opinion. I don't think it's childish. I disagree with your view. End of story.

I cant care less.... I think all people on this planet are equal (ly thick) ..I don’t tick this way nations and passpord and pride ..all BS to keep peole s mind busy . But I understand the feeling and public guilt felt in Germany .& u DO NOT

I also disagree with your assertion about what I know and don't know, and your authority to voice that opinion. But again, I'm afraid it's of very little consequence to me what you believe.

As I've said, I feel I and others who share my views have answered all the points you make, and all the arguments (if you can call them that) you make,

BS you as well as all the other JUMPIN on this have answered nothing ...go back I wont post it again Iam done here ..Read then see WHO ignored any points made

No. I haven't ignored anything. I posted my points on this topic earler in the thread. There is nothing new that is on topic in anything you posted subsequently. YOU go back and look. Or don't bother, it's up to you.

I haven't jumped on anything, and there's no ganging up here - it's my opinion - note the use of the word "opinion" - that you are a somewhat troubled individual who sees enemies where enemies there are none. I'm not your enemy, and I slightly resent being spoken to as one.

To the rest resorting to insults and insinuating other dumbness ...
It will come back to you my friend ..dont you worry about that

Sorry, are you attempting to threaten me?! How absurd.

There's nothing remotely insulting in what I wrote - but feel free to take it however you like. I expect I'll sleep OK tonight anyway, despite my imminent come-uppance....

I see I am completely wasting my time here as the GANG jumped ONTO my posts but ignored it and replied BS I hear every day ..without any sound reasoning or answering and concerns and question i put before you ..Instead bury my post with MANY MANY replies ..I wonder who had to call in who ..

This is just nonsense, I'm afraid. Check the last few pages of this thread and see who has posted the most - and then tell me your points are being buried. There's no gang, here, there's just a majority of opinion against your own - and there's a reason for that. It's because you're wrong.

Sorry you feel you're wasting your time - I genuinely would encourage you to read the thread you claim to know all about, because I think you would find it rewarding and instructive.

However, I would draw the mods (sorry, I mean "controllers" :@@ attention to the somewhat threatening tone of your remarks to me earlier. I don't know for sure that it's entirely appropriate for a civilised discussion of a sensitive topic.

LW

Originally posted by memyself_I
@KilgoreTrout

Your arrogance serves no other purpose than to highlight your own ignorance, I can safely say that most of the replies on this thread fall far short of understanding the holocaust and the causes of the war that surrounds it.

LOL you just make me laugh nothing else
Calling me ARROGANT ..and in the same sentence ...only YOU understand no sorry comprehend the full story of WWII
You are so pathetic I just ignore you ..LOL at least it made me chuckle.

EDUCATED FOOL ---- l

I realise that you have difficulty with English but at no point did I say that only I have all the answers, in fact in the same post I admit that I do not. My point is that MOST people, unless they chose to educate themselves in the matter do not understand the complete story. I, who have chosen to educate myself, still have many answers to find, but I am at least looking instead of pretending to KNOW or looking for a quick fix answer.

If you think that that is pathetic, fine, that is your perogative. You seem to feel that people are ganging up on you, perhaps they are but then you are kind of asking for it and I get the impression that you would be disappointed if they didn't. As I said before banal at best, attention seeking at worst.

Many people do feel that the holocaust is 'over-rated' or perhaps 'over-exposed' is a better term. I can see both sides of the argument and neither agree, nor disagree with the OP, for me in many ways it is just another genocide in a long century of genocide, one that we have not learnt from just as we have not learnt from any of the others and that is probably why we have entered into another century and the genocides continue. However in other ways it is quite unique and remains unique.

My knowledge of the holocaust comes from an interest in the causes and effects of the second world war, not from a specific interest in the holocaust itself, which is why I do know that many misunderstand or have an incomplete understanding of the history. You have no understanding at all, which is blatantly apparent. I offered to help you answer some of your questions and you chose to ignore that offer, it was genuine, but it seems that your ego or motives prevented you from accepting. The offer still stands.

I have learnt a great deal from members on this site, I have no trouble acknowledging my ignorance or shortcomings, but nor do I see any need to hide my knowledge, I have worked hard at acquiring it and have earned it. We all have different skills, knowledge and expertise - in the best of threads we can come together and share that. Sadly that is seldom the case in threads relating to the holocaust and any real debate is quickly disrupted by posts such as yours which offer nothing but vitriol.

I realise that I should have ignored you in the first place, you are nothing new here, but your post on the Himmler/Allen thread got me seeing a little red. I apologise for biting but your behaviour was incredibly rude and while you may not wish to learn from those with a greater degree of education than yourself I do. Mr Delpla is a member like anyone else here, if you feel able to criticise his knowledge why have you not responded to his post asking you to qualify your ability to do so? That I would most like to see. He seems to think you have run away and I have a tendency to agree.

What exactly have you brought to the table? Nothing that I can perceive, other than proclivity to belittle others, not a great contribution. Please feel free to demonstrate otherwise, I look forward to it.

The truth fears no amount of scrutiny, the truth floats on its own without having to be enforced.

Name me one other Genre or topic that if I were to question it or deny it publicly I would be thrown in prison ?

If a witness lies at the Nueremburg Trials once then can his whole submission be thrown out ? to quote Einstein ( I think he was Jewish ) if you can't trust people wiht the small things then how can you trust them on the big things ? ( for those not accustomed to the trials a witness to the Holocaust first hand discribed how a Guard ripped a baby in half with his bare hands).

Its not that I don't believe the Holocaust happend, I just question the numbers ( 6 Million ) and the extent compared to the other Groups that were killed enmasse by the Germans that gain no publicicty.

en.wikipedia.org...:World_War_II_Casualties.svg

[edit on 30-5-2008 by mazzroth]

Originally posted by mazzroth

Its not that I don't believe the Holocaust happend, I just question the numbers ( 6 Million ) and the extent compared to the other Groups that were killed enmasse by the Germans that gain no publicicty.

[edit on 30-5-2008 by mazzroth]

Wow, this thread has been around for quite a while, I recall voicing my opinion on this topic some months ago.
So, since its going on still, ill briefly recap my opinions.
I also have serious doubts about the number that they claim died in the German work prisons.
Ive also wondered a couple of things too, like why the Guards would allow a prisoner to languish in his barracks for months unable to work or do anything else constructive, when all they had to do is put them in the gas chambers to kill them in the de-lousing showers that sprayed them with this stuff here..



which has been proven to be non-lethal to humans.

The "Jewish Holocaust" is the only historical period in history that resists investigation and in some countries even imposing prison sentences on people that do attempt to investigate it.

If it happened the way that we are told it happened then why arent people allowed to conduct independent investigations?
What are they afraid will be found?
If theres nothing to hide then why do those laws exist?

Originally posted by mazzroth
The truth fears no amount of scrutiny, the truth floats on its own without having to be enforced.

Name me one other Genre or topic that if I were to question it or deny it publicly I would be thrown in prison ?

The constant harping on about everyone's inability to "question or deny" the holocaust is completely disingenuous, disproportionate and just plain wrong. I've lost count of the number of times I've asked people on this thread who flog this dead horse to provide me with the names and specific cases of people currently residing in prison having been prosecuted under this supposed law. No one has replied. You are writing on a public forum now, for heaven's sake.

Are there more people in jail for holocaust denial across the world than there are in Guantanemo - at the behest of a single nation -without having been charged with anything at all, for example?

The reason the argument is disingenuous is because it supposes that people are "oppressed" for uttering the "truth". This is absurd. No one is oppressed. The reason that people disagree with holocaust denial is because it's wrong. Not because it's wrong to say it.

Its not that I don't believe the Holocaust happend, I just question the numbers ( 6 Million ) and the extent compared to the other Groups that were killed enmasse by the Germans that gain no publicicty.

en.wikipedia.org...:World_War_II_Casualties.svg

[edit on 30-5-2008 by mazzroth]

I think this point has been hammered home a great deal already on this thread. But again, it challenges an argument I don't think is being made. No one who stands up for the victims of the holocaust has ever suggested that more people died in Auschwitz et al than in Russia. No one has questioned the need for more attention to be given to other atrocities. What they've done is question the title of the thread: "is the holocaust overrated". And those who share my view would still answer: no. A systematic attempt to wipe out an entire race based simply on the fact of their race cannot ever be "overrated". And for me, that's where the argument stops.

Should there be more awareness of atrocities elsewhere in the world during, before and after the second world war? Yes. Are Jewish people responsible for there not being so? No. Do Jewish people deserve to have the topic of the horrors of the holocaust treated with respect, even if other such horrors are not being respected adequately? Of course.

You have every opportunity to promote understanding and appreciation of the terrible suffering inflicted on many many groups of people by many others because you have freedom of speech, a busy Internet, and the support of many people to do so. To go about raising that awareness by blaming Jewish people for in some way oppressing the truth is morally, factually and evidentially wrong, and more than that, it is just plain stupid.

LW

Originally posted by Kr0n0s
which has been proven to be non-lethal to humans.

Except...

Modern Holocaust deniers assert that Zyklon B gas was not used in the gas chambers, relying as evidence on the low levels of Prussian blue residue in samples of the purported gas chambers found by Fred A. Leuchter, which Leuchter dismissed as the results of general delousing of buildings. However, Leuchter's negative control, a sample of gasket material taken from a different building in the camp, registered as having no such cyanide residue.[10] The manager of the analytical laboratory hired by Leuchter states in an interview in Errol Morris' film Mr. Death: The Rise and Fall of Fred A. Leuchter, Jr., that Leuchter's thick samples of brick would have greatly diluted the cyanide residue, which forms only an extremely fine layer on the walls and cannot penetrate.

In 1994, the Institute for Forensic Research in Kraków re-examined this claim on the grounds that formation of Prussian blue by exposure of bricks to cyanide is not a highly probable reaction (Amoklauf gegen die Wirklichkeit. Praca zbiorowa; B. Gallanda, J. Bailer, F. Freund, T. Geisler, W. Lasek, N. Neugebauer, G. Spenn, W. Wegner; Bundesministerium fuer Unterricht und Kultur Wien, 1991). Using more sophisticated microdiffusion techniques, they tested 22 samples from the gas chambers, delousing chambers (as positive controls), and living quarters (as negative controls), finding cyanide residue in both the delousing chambers and the ruins of the gas chambers but none in the ruins of the living quarters, thus refuting the Holocaust deniers' claims.[11]

Zyklon B

So, you see, it was there. The guy's results were tainted.

To say its not lethal to humans is - well - absurd. Hydrogen Cyanide is listed under the Chemical Weapons Convention as a potential weapon

An HCN concentration of 300 mg/m3 in air will kill a human within a few minutes.

Hydrogen Cyanide

reply to post by memyself_I

Now a word to the forum moderator ..LOL what a misused word

Check ATS you don’t moderate you control... That’s a difference

And whats been controlled here, exactly? People post their opinions. You posted yours. You disagree with the other opinions that have been posted and then resort to complaints of unfairness solely because people aren't automatically agreeing with you?

Instead bury my post with MANY MANY replies ..I wonder who had to call in who ..

Its a message board. Are people supposed to stop posting just because you typed something? Get real. This site has over a million visitors a month. Nothing is static here at all.

Originally posted by LoneWeasel
I've lost count of the number of times I've asked people on this thread who flog this dead horse to provide me with the names and specific cases of people currently residing in prison having been prosecuted under this supposed law.LW

www.englishpen.org...
www.guardian.co.uk...

Now since I have provided proof of this you can shut up with your Pro-Israel lies. Tell me this LoneWeasel do you honestly think that a People genuinely oppressed to the tune of 6 million executions would then go on and Persecute the Palestinians as they have ? I think not.

Now since I have provided you with absolute proof that People are Jailed for this, then do me the favour of providing the names of the 6 million who were killed by the Germans.

"Are there more people in jail for holocaust denial across the world than there are in Guantanemo - at the behest of a single nation -without having been charged with anything at all, for example?

The reason the argument is disingenuous is because it supposes that people are "oppressed" for uttering the "truth". This is absurd. No one is oppressed. The reason that people disagree with holocaust denial is because it's wrong. Not because it's wrong to say it."

It IS a fact that in several countries in the heart of Europe is illegal to question holocaust. Why?!?
It is beyond me that "civilized" society would deny truth to its Citizens just to protect powerful Zionist lobby!
It is beyond comprehension how much our governments are sissy's when it comes to telling real truth rather then publish pro-zionist stories in history books as a fact.
Fact is that % of Jews killed in a WWII is roughly 1% of total population killed in a same period. So is it 600.000 Jews killed genocide or is it 26.000.000 killed Russians genocide, 6.500.000 Poles, over 1.000.000 Serbs, Greeks, Gypsies, Czechs...
We just want the truth whatever that might be. Death is death regardless who got killed but to monopolize entire governments, films (600 of them dedicated to Jews in WWII alone), history books to one group of People who suffered the least among all others who took the brunt in comparison is preposterous!!!
Just because it's on the TV all the time it doesn't make it a fact. In fact last night was the movie (yet again) with Robert Duvall as Heinrich Himmler and when he was captured by mossad in Argentina illegally smuggled on board and flown back to israel to face the crime for genocide against the Jews and non-Jews alike. I tought, it should be against Slavs, Gypsies, Greeks and Jews but all you see is Jewish suffering thru entire movie.

Originally posted by Rogue Element

Originally posted by memyself_I
OHH you poor fool..
I pity u indeed ..
READ 1st then RESEARCH then come back ...Dont just answer with you mindless dribble which in any way is not your thoguhts
but out of your schoolbook ..

DID u actiually look at my posts !!

Go on read them and then answer ...

I HATE fascism !!!!!!!!


that is why i want the past to be represented as it happened ...IN OUR HISTORY BOOKS!


Fachist !?
That BTW is the world you live in ..Can you not see it ..?
No you cannot because you dont know what it is ...

THIS (here and NOW ) is a GLOBAL fachist Cooperate world ..
So people like you running around with a bag over their heads really deserve this world
why are you opinionated when it s obvious to any normal free thinking human that something is not right with this story in history ?

and you and your children are taught the history as they tell you to ensure in todays cooperate fachist world you are kept blind to see that NAZIS didnt loose the war they merly moved operations to the cooperate world and the USA
YES the US ! No1 fachist cooperate police state .

Of course noone recongnizes Fachism anymore ..when you have fools like you populating the planet ..


plz EDUCATE YOURSELF AND SEE THE LIES


AND no HITLER was a bas&%$& and he would have killed me immediatly i think outside the box
You on the other hand adhere to the status que and he would have been happy with you on his side ..


..I stare in disbelieve at the average stupidity of human kind

[edit on 30-5-2008 by memyself_I]

If you hate Fascists so much, why do you sound so much like one, and parrot their pet conspiracy theory (well, among the ones who aren't proud that their chosen political ideology enaged in genocide)?

And I very much doubt historical accuracy is your main concern here. How many peer-reviewed papers and studies on the Holocaust have you read? And no, David Duke is not a peer-reviewed source.

Sorry to burst your incredibly paranoid bubble, but the world we live in isn't fascist, unless you are reducing the term to something functionally meaningless. Google "Politics and the English Language" by Orwell. Please. Last time I checked, most of the world did not come under the commonly accepted definitions of fascism. You know, the ones created by political scientists and historians and philosophers. In fact, I've got a copy of Robert O Paxton's The Anatomy of Fascism right here. and the modern world is hitting upon very few points.

Would you like to try again?

Actually, I think what memyself_I was trying to say is that we are living in a corporate-fascist world, which is true. It is basically the merger of corporations and government and the laws passed are not to benefit the people but rather the corporations. This is the slow overtaking of the world that has been happening for at least a hundred years. He is not subscribing to a fascist conspiracy theory. He is merely questioning an event in history, and because of the government propaganda and programming, most people are unable to view the said events with an objective light. Does questioning 9/11 make you a terrorist?

[edit on 1-6-2008 by italkyoulisten]

Originally posted by ApolonDeath is death regardless who got killed but to monopolize entire governments, films (600 of them dedicated to Jews in WWII alone), history books to one group of People who suffered the least among all others who took the brunt in comparison is preposterous!!!
Just because it's on the TV all the time it doesn't make it a fact. In fact last night was the movie (yet again) with Robert Duvall as Heinrich Himmler and when he was captured by mossad in Argentina illegally smuggled on board and flown back to israel to face the crime for genocide against the Jews and non-Jews alike. I tought, it should be against Slavs, Gypsies, Greeks and Jews but all you see is Jewish suffering thru entire movie.

This is an example of the programming I've been talking about. Aside from movies there are hundreds of books, which are held in high esteem, many of which are prize winners, about specifically Jewish suffering during the Holocaust. Many of these we have to read as children and the gruesome pictures painted by the books are forever etched into our memories. For example, Anne Frank's Diary is required reading for fourth graders!

"I am a child... program me!"
-Bruce Haack

reply to post by Apolon


Well naturally you can argue and say 6 million killed Jews is not a correct number. But how did you reach 600000? Is it just dividing by 10????? This is by far less correct as traditional (EEEvil zionistic lies) calculations. I asked you once and you failed to answer , so i ask you again:
Poland 1931 census: little more then 3000000 Jews. Poland 1945 - 240000 Jews. Let us say half went to Soviet Union, so 1500000 - 240000 = 1260000. Only in Poland 1000000 Jews for certainly were killed. So how can you say that X is not correct while your Y is taken from air?

reply to post by ZeroKnowledge


Yes 600000 is a really low estimate. I think he probably forgot a 0. I am not questioning any of the "facts", but I am just pointing out that it is a black subject, and nothing should be hidden from public scrutiny, so therefore there must be some purpose in the purposeful programming of the public. I am starting to think it may have more to do with the NWO than Zionism.

reply to post by italkyoulisten


Actually i totally agree that this issue should be more open. Taboo thing is really problematic. But i would rather wait a little because there are still people who might be emotionally hurt if the issue is going to be openly discussed. Imagine if someone survived the camp and now he turns on TV and there is a historian (even if he is after the truth and not just to "re-paint" the history) telling that his research about what happened in this camp cannot show that people were gassed to death.

And since there are not only those that look for what happened but those who make all kinds of weird claims (Zyclon B is not lethal to humans, for example!!!) imagine what camp survivors will feel.

reply to post by ZeroKnowledge


Yes, but is it also not likely that those who are making these outrageous claims are actually with those who are actively attempting to cover up the truth? It is a technique called "poisoning the well" where disinfo agents would spread ridiculous rumors disguised as the opposition to discredit the opposition.

I don't think the question is about the facts (which the disinfo agents would like most people to believe when the Holocaust is in question), but rather why such emphasis. The facts are probably skewed to some extent, but it is a black subject that no one dares to speak on.

We can't wait too much longer, because the NWO is on the horizon. Not surprisingly, speaking critically of the Holocaust will cause you to be deemed an "anti-semite" by the World Jewish Congress (WORLD!!!), and thereby lose all credibility.

There is an active campaign to create this mainstream concept of the Holocaust. Many things are still up for debate. For example, the use of gas chambers has never actually been verified.

I think part of the reason it is so emphasized is to create a world enemy-figure: Hitler and the Nazis. I also believe it is tied into the international banking conspiracy, of which most of the alleged conspirators are Zionists.

[edit on 1-6-2008 by italkyoulisten]

quick point here from me. I can speak as a Person who new 3 survivors of concentration camps. Two of them were stationed in Birkenau - Auschwitz and one was in Mauthausen. One of them met his future Wife in camp, she fell pregnant in working camp before he was sent to Birkenau. She lived as well as the child who is 60+ now.
I know all of them through my ex-girfriend.
Her Grandfather was one, his Wife was other person, and one other survivor was his friend. Third person I knew of but never met. They were all Serbs taken away like hundreds of thousands other Serbs to working camps.
The worst concentration camp never debated publicly is JASENOVAC in Croatia runed by Croatian Ustasa. They were the most fanatical in extermination of Serbs and Gypsies exlusively! That is true killing camp, not used for workers but just as a slaughter house., Who went in didn't come out. Lucky ones went to Poland and Germany.
As some of you might know Serbs and Montenegrins are tallest People in Europe, so imagine person of 194cm and wide shoulders returning home and his Wife lifting him like a baby, putting him in a bath for a scrub. He was tall person, strong and big before camp and after his Wife could lift him up with some effort.
He lost more then 55kg but he and his Friends lived.
He spoke of harsh conditions and gruel working hours. Reason why he and others lost so much weight was long hours of work, digging new roads, breaking stones, making some stuff for the Reich, from morning till late afternoon. Food was there in the beginning but later became so scarce as war progressed and Germany start loosing battles one after the other so camps and prisoners were not priority for any deliveries.
He mentioned that guards were losing weight also.
So, it was not camp of systematic extermination but heavy duty working camp where prisoners were forced to work all day long. Prisoners who tried to break away or undermine the regime were dealt quickly, but that is understandable. It is the war after all. No one wants lose canons around.
They were feed. He said many prisoners didn't perish because of killings but from exhaustion, lack of food and drinking water at later dates, and disease which was frequent later with no running water available.
He mentioned lots of inmates, most of them he forgot by name, but he remembered where they were from. Mainly Slavs from all sides, Gypsies brought from many east European countries (they had the harshest treatment). Gypsies were considered by Nazi sub-humans so they had long end of the stick most of the time. Some guards were better then others he said, and with two of them they spoke frequently. Even Person who lived just over two years in the worst conditions and treated like a slave could say few kind words for some gurds which was strange to me when I was young after listening all the stories and movies on the subject imagining Nazi guards like flesh eating cannibals.
I hated him at the times because I thought he sold out, now I understand HE is the only one who is allowed to say good or bad things about any inmates or guard because HE and HIM alike were there!
Not some pulicer grabing sissy who is fabricating facts and myths in order to sell the books and go up the rectum of certain powerful lobbyist.
I repeat HE said majority of inmates were SLAVS, Gypsies and some Jews but it was nowhere near number as shown in the movie.
As we saw Schindler's list, all inmates were Jews!?!
As for statistic after the war regarding killed Jews you can thank zionists for mudding the water. Most of the Jews escaped in many countries around even before the war and especially after. They were promised Jewish land by the same zionists who started the terrorist campagne against British, French...
Six million dead is for some reason significant in Jewish religion because it is constantly mentioned from 1.000 years ago then 150 years ago and finaly after WWII statistics.
They all have something in common, 6 million "dead" Jews, which has nothing to do with facts but religion and politics to reap compensations from everyone. Same figure of 6 million was repeated at least 3 times in Jewish history!!! Who wants to read everything and dig deeper, he is welcome but do not state some crazy post war figures around here please.
If anyone has a reason to hate Germans, we do, because we were attacked by them alone 3 times in the past 60 years so I think that Slavs in general should judge them if anyone should.
I don't remember Serbs and former inmates getting a single dime where every Jew who was in there (or not) was compensated and still israel is cashing in...
As for the facts Vs fiction, best proof for lies that we were feed is the fact that we are not allowed to dig and debate about Jewish deaths where everything else is ok.
So much for the truth.
That old man I spoke of died 11 years ago, his Wife died barely 2 years ago from the cancer. She was 89 and of Ukrainian origin but she lived in Belgrade ever since coming out of working camp.

[edit on 1-6-2008 by Apolon]

reply to post by Apolon


Naturally there were not only Jews in the camps, and in camp in Slovakia there were less Jews then in camps in Poland - why?
Because in Slovakia lived about 130000 Jews and
because a lot were transported OUT of Slovakia. To other camps. Death camps, not labor camps.
www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...
I cannot understand how you, with relatives in camps, cannot see that if Nazis did awful things without much consideration to people that they considered less then them self (Slavic races and ctr) - what they could do to those they did not consider human at all? Like Jews and Gypsies and certain social groups.

Also, since it is a serious subject - don't you think that at least a serious approach is needed?
And yet you take 600000 out of the blue. You talk of some 6 millions a thousand years ago???? What happened in 1008? If you refer to Romans taking Jerusalem - it was almost 2000 years ago. If Babylonians - less then 3000. And what happened in 1858 to Jews,this i totally do not understand?
And how come only 6000000 then? Only yesterday i read in other thread that in "their sacred Talmud" "Billions with a B" were killed when Romans took Jerusalem.
But "just" 4. Come on people!!!!

I doubt that if anyone was seriously looking into it he would use almost random numbers (600000, 1000, 150 ....) and try to search in normal sources. Not necessary jewishvirtuallibrary but at least those that think that data is correct when it is correct and not taken from ceiling.

how many of the 3 million poles and other minorities were jewish? 6 million jews were killed... hitler basically accomplished his mission, because he did kind of destroy the jewsh race, 6 million people is impossible to come back from. 78% of European jews were killed and the majority of the poles killed were... HEY... ALSO JEWS! Hitler was openly anti-semetic, but so is the rest of Europe even though i see little evidence that Jews hold any power or control over anyone right now, but people are still anti-semetic. IS this because the Jews killed jesus? Or are they just easy to blame like 'n-word's and arabs? Whatever it is the jews have been a scapegoat and basically a punching bag for everyone else, i just want to ask why

Scapegoats? Depends who do you ask the question. Serbs believe they suffered immensely under everyone from Romans, Ottoman empire, Austro-Hungary, Germans 3 times and now Kosovo was given to a terrorists.
Depends my friend on which side you are. Jewish state of israel has been feed with money from Germany, USA and still does. Which other state gets that? NONE!
We got big 0 out of all wars. Just lost millions of people and land in the process.
Politics is a Whore.

reply to post by Apolon


Is this the reason for your issue with Holocaust? Money given to Israel - correct. Did Israel took it from former Yugoslavia? Did Israel bombed it? You say that Germany invaded your country 3 times and yet you wright it with capital G and Israel not.
You are entitled to dislike whoever you want, but if you do not trust what current official history says about Holocaust because Israel received money and Serbia did not - i do not understand it.