Russian top secret nuclear submarine has been put in the water.

The Soviet-era Alfa class submarine is and was a piece of crap. Whenever it travelled above 15 knots it could be heard 1/2 way around the planet. Speed does you no good if you are not stealthy.

To quote the FAS:

"Although a much-feared design in the West, these concerns were prompted by grossly exaggerated accounts of the boat's capabilities and an assumption that they represented the main thrust of Soviet submarine development. The fast, deep diving nuclear submarine threat proved a false alarm, but they provoked massive investments in ASW weapons by the US Navy, and resulting in dramatic improvements in the Mk. 46 and Mk. 48 torpedoes that apparently culminated in the 63-knot ADCAP torpedo.

Extremely noisy at high speeds, the noise levels of the Alfa at lower speeds were generally similar to that of other Soviet SSNs. Though extremely fast, the boats were unreliable, poorly armed and with sensors that were unique, hard to maintain and frequently defective. Two different models of liquid metal (probably lead-bismuth) reactors were used. The four boats built at the Admiralty shipyard used the BM-40A reactor with two separate steam loops and circulating pumps. The boats built at Severodvinsk [Project 705K] used the OK-550 with branched first-loop lines and triple circulating loops and pumps.

The reactors required a heater to prevent the liquid metal coolant from solidifying. In 1972 the reactor on K-377 suffered a casualty during sea trials and the metal coolant "froze" destroying the reactor. In 1982 the reactor on K.316 was destroyed when the heating system was accidentally turned off. A special facility was constructed the submarines were moored to supply superheated steam to heat the liquid metal when the reactors were shut down. External heating proved unsatisfactory, and the reactors had to be kept running even while the submarines were in port.


Series production of the Project 705 boats began in the mid-1970s, and the program ended in 1983 with the sixth production unit. Eventually four of the seven Project 705s were lost due to reactor failures. One boat was retired by the end of 1987, and four others were decommissioned in 1990-1992. At least one [and possibly two] was modified with VM-4 pressurized water reactors from Project 671B and used for test activities prior to being decommissioned in 1995".

Yes they were fast and yes they dived deep, but they were nothing more than technology demonstrators whose role were very limited. Their brief lifespan only accentuated this point.

Can you people that dont know anything please just shut up?

Alpha could outrun all anti submarine torpedoes of its time, so..

Noise or not its not relevant, and it wasnt 'a piece of crap'.

It still beats anything that US has on perforrmance.

Uh huh.

OK, since you are obviously Joe Naval Warfare, why don't you please explain to me the combat usefulness of a submarine with no capability to hide itself while in combat?

Or maybe you can explain to me how a submarine can accurately obtain and track potential targets, both surface and submerged targets, when it is travelling in excess of 40 kts and creating so much noise and cavitation that it can be heard on both sides of the Atlantic ocean?

Or maybe you can explain the usefulness of a nuclear submarine with a patrol duration of about 30 days?

Or better yet, why don't you tell me exactly how many of these fine units are still in service and are not scrap metal or rusting pier-side at some God forsaken North Fleet base?

Or even better, why don't you tell me how many of the 6 operation units commissioned DIDN'T have catastrophic reactor or coolant system failures?

Nobody said that the Alfa didn't reach some impressive depths and speeds, but operationally from a combat point of view, these boats are (were) a piece of crap.

And BTW, the only reason that the Russian Navy holds these records is because the US Navy apparently exercises better security with the operational capabilities of its active naval combatants.



And if you are wondering how I know these things, my 6 years in the Atlantic Fleet taught me well. Also, check out this link on my company's home page.

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Originally posted by FULCRUM
Alpha could outrun all anti submarine torpedoes of its time, so..

While giving the crew new exciting genetic mutations.

it can sail at a depth of over 6,000 metres

If that number is correct, that's unreal. Yeah there are submersibles and other deep submergence craft that can go there and deeper, but if an SSN with a full compliment of weapons and crew with months of endurance can submerge to 18,000 feet, it's pretty much untouchable. I don't think any torpedo goes that deep. I suspect that figure is highly exaggerated. 6,000 feet sounds more realistic or this boat is a lot smaller than I imagine it. What is the displacement?

Dah, so they can blow away one of your subs or aircraft carriers or nuke your city, wtf you think they "need" it for?

Originally posted by THENEO
Anyone know why they need this? even if it does work as promised.

Thats during peace time when alot of those subs are docked or sailing w/o taking avasive action.. in a war or heated situation things would be different, and that assumes the us really knows every sub they have going, there could be additional land based vessels that would be launched in a second wave..

Originally posted by TheButcher
sounds like quite a weapons platform, although I do always doubt the Russians everytime they say they have this new all dominating weapon system.

Anyhow.. the news are real and they are getting even better subs, and they always had the best subs.

not true - US subs have been mutch better, as evidence of the fact that for the last 30 years The US navy has simultaneously pinged every sub in the Russian fleet! this is done a few times a year just to let them know that at any time the entire russian nuclear sub fleet could be tacken out within litterally the period of about 5-10 seconds. And the Russians never know the Yanks are there cause US SUBS ARE THE MOST SILENT......

But hey, that was the past, and if this one is as good as advertised then maybe the US has some work to do.

reply to post by Schaden

If that number is correct, that's unreal. Yeah there are submersibles and other deep submergence craft that can go there and deeper, but if an SSN with a full compliment of weapons and crew with months of endurance can submerge to 18,000 feet, it's pretty much untouchable. I don't think any torpedo goes that deep. I suspect that figure is highly exaggerated. 6,000 feet sounds more realistic or this boat is a lot smaller than I imagine it. What is the displacement?

Yup Schaden,

That is pretty much what I was thinking. This must be a small hull boat.
Not much militarily useful reason for going down 18,000 feet....even 6000 feet. Research yes...militarily ..no. What the military does do is send Research teams like Dr Robert Ballard of the Titanic fame do do contract reserarch for them in the deep...and using specially designed tools/boats to go down there.
Most peoples are so dumb they dont even know that places like Woods Hole have special government/military contracts and clauses to farm them out for military uses if needed. Government moneys for research.
I have to bust out laughing when I hear alot of this stuff on college campuses. " Save the whales and Woods Hole!! They dont have a clue as to how deep the government/military is into educational/research funds. Not just our government..but foreign governments as well.

Thanks,
Orangetom