Calif. gray whale found shot with .50 cal machine gun

I hate to repeat myself, but if we didn't produce guns then we wouldn't have idiots with guns shooting whales all over the place. it's the power of the weapon that people take advantage of. I never said we should take away our guns and let the criminals keep them. I said, destroy ALL the guns and only keep them in a certain base for the military. other than that, there is no need for anyone to own a gun. No need.

Right... who cares about freedom. We've got an agenda to pursue!

The whale was also harpooned. Gonna steal harpoons from all the responsible harpoon owners, too?

Originally posted by apc

Originally posted by jedimiller
people lived for millions of years and lived fine. please tell me why we need to have guns today?

To kill anyone who tries to take them away.

And man has not lived for millions of years. Man has lived for a hundred thousand years. And in that time we have constantly been developing and improving upon a myriad of different ways to kill eachother.

What I want to know is why didn't they harvest the whale? It's very odd that they didn't, or at least it appears that they didn't.

No one is for sure how long man has lived. but that's the problem, humans have been developing weapons to kill eachother for ages. It was fine to use guns back in the old west or during the world wars, but why do we need them today? aren't we smart enough to stop violence already? Guns were created to kill people..that's the idea of a weapon to kill, whales or whatever else..that's the ideology of a weapon..not to protect yourself, when no one else has a weapon then you don't need protecting from anything.

I think that's why the Alien visitors are afraid to talk to us, because they know that we are going to start shooting them. I hope you understand what I'm trying to say, but as long as people want guns, it will be misery.


BTW, I'm 35 now and I never owned a gun. and never will.

Originally posted by scientist

Originally posted by jedimiller
please tell me why we need to have guns today?

uhh... PROTECTION?

...and they needed protecting from a gray whale? Gray whales show up at your doorstep and trample your food and pets underfoot?

Your argument about guns=freedom falls just a little hollow when you realize that all of Iraq was armed (tribes had guns) and that didn't stop Saddam from taking over. There are a lot of African nations where gun ownership is common... and so is genocide.

Originally posted by Indellkoffer

Originally posted by scientist

Originally posted by jedimiller
please tell me why we need to have guns today?

uhh... PROTECTION?

...and they needed protecting from a gray whale? Gray whales show up at your doorstep and trample your food and pets underfoot?

Your argument about guns=freedom falls just a little hollow when you realize that all of Iraq was armed (tribes had guns) and that didn't stop Saddam from taking over. There are a lot of African nations where gun ownership is common... and so is genocide.

if we are going to base the legality of every single item on whether or not it can be used to kill a whale...

well, go ahead and throw away all your forks, knives, cars, cleaning solutions, ovens, microwaves, etc. Actually, you could probably stuff your shoes into its eyes and blowholes and kill it like that, so lets just assume clothing is deadly to whales, therefore no need.

The logic of some users on this board is making we want to go buy a third gun.

It saddens me that the Tribal Traditions are being abused in this manner.

Now, paddling out in a canoe and harpooning the whale with traditional method would have been more in line with wha I know of the tribes in this area -but a machine gun in the hand of a young kid?

Yipes.

Has there been any further updates on the comments of the Tribal Council?

reply to post by MikeboydUS


Earlier reports were wrong it was not a machine gun just a 50 caliber rife which as I recall was a reuirement set by the US govnerment when they harvested a Gray 4 five years ago. The rifle requirement was to insure a quick death to the whale once it had been harpooned.

One could assume they are not very good marksmen since it took at least three shots back in 01 or 02 :shk:

The whale was shot with a .50-caliber rifle, he said. Early news reports describing it as a machine gun were incorrect, Gorman said.

Originally posted by jedimiller




are you being serious? of coure the gun is not going to pull it's own trigger!! that's what I'm saying, a person with a gun is a bad combination. this kid would NOT have killed the whale if he didn't have that gun. the gun gives him power and that's what I'm against. people lived for millions of years and lived fine. please tell me why we need to have guns today?

oh, i am being very serious.....thats my point....you take the guns away, whales are still gonna get killed by humans...you need to take away the people and that is not gonna happen.
some people are not responsible enough to own a gun...many are. i have not shot mine at anyone ot at a whale...

so some people can't handle it, you think nobody whould have them?

i am saying some people with guns are bad combinations. some people with cars are. some people with lighters are. some people with swords are. you want me to keep going?
how do you know he would not have killed the whale had he not had that gun? maybe he would have used a harpoon or something? not possible?

people have not lived for millions of years....lets just get that out of the way.....why do we need guns?
cause there are people out there that are insane and might want to break into my house and murder me and rape my wife....how is that for an answer?

my house was broken into 22 years ago. my parents were almost killed. i watched it....i was 7.
there will always be guns in this house. trust me on that.

Originally posted by apc


And man has not lived for millions of years. Man has lived for a hundred thousand years.

I agree with the rest of your post. This portion though I do believe is incorrect. Mankind goes back about 6 million years.

Originally posted by Tiloke
.50 caliber rifles are extremely popular for target enthusiasts as well as completely legal to own and use in all places except for Kalifornia. It gets a bad rap because certain politicians decide that the "big bad 50" needs to be banned.

There is absolutely no reason that a private citizen needs to own a 50 cal. None at all. It can't be used for personal defense, and if an 'enthusiast' wants to use one for target practice, he should have to go to a licensed firing range and use one there.

[edit on 10/9/2007 by Thousand]

Originally posted by LoneGunMan
Mankind goes back about 6 million years.

The genus Homo goes back 1-3million, but Homo Sapien didn't show up until 100-150,000YA, depending on who you ask.

Originally posted by jedimiller
I think that's why the Alien visitors are afraid to talk to us, because they know that we are going to start shooting them.

Oh, I'm sorry. That was my mistake for thinking we were having a rational discussion here. All this time I thought the aliens were just pissed at us for killing all the whales...

Originally posted by jedimiller
I said, destroy ALL the guns and only keep them in a certain base for the military. other than that, there is no need for anyone to own a gun. No need.

You do not like guns, we get it already, but you are living in a delusional dream world if you think all gun are just going to disappear and no one will ever make another one. I don't know what to tell you beyond that.

Originally posted by Thousand
There is absolutely no reason that a private citizen needs to own a 50 cal. None at all. It can't be used for personal defense, and if an 'enthusiast' wants to use one for target practice, he should have to go to a licensed firing range and use one there.
[edit on 10/9/2007 by Thousand]

Can't be used for personal defense? I guess our ideas of personal defense must be different because a .50 cal is pretty much the ultimate line of personal defense. It would protect my property very well.

www.douglasridge.org...



[edit on 10-9-2007 by zerotime]

Originally posted by jedimiller
This is sick. Disgusts me, another reason why people shouldn't have guns. for those that dont think guns kill. please tell me, how would this kid have killed that whale without a gun.

Good point, im sure these little dumb humans never killed a whale before we had guns? You're not making sense.

Then you say its ok to hame guns some times, and not others? Also, people have hunted whales for ages, get that in your head.

People kill people. People have, as long we we have know, and perhapes longer have killed people. It is only the means that changes. Today people need guns more then ever. I think each head of the household should have a gun. Obviosly this would exclude all those that have mental disorders, criminal records, and other violations that would rule out ownerships of guns. Some guns people should not have thought, such as a Rocket Propelled Gernader Launcher...

Originally posted by Thousand

Originally posted by Tiloke
.50 caliber rifles are extremely popular for target enthusiasts as well as completely legal to own and use in all places except for Kalifornia. It gets a bad rap because certain politicians decide that the "big bad 50" needs to be banned.

There is absolutely no reason that a private citizen needs to own a 50 cal. None at all. It can't be used for personal defense, and if an 'enthusiast' wants to use one for target practice, he should have to go to a licensed firing range and use one there.

[edit on 10/9/2007 by Thousand]

obviously, you do not live close to bears. Way to make a grand assumption though. To me, it reads like this:

"There is no reason I would need a .50, therefore nobody else in the country could possibly need one."

If possible could the mods change part of the title to say rifle instead of machine gun. Thanks.

reply to post by jedimiller

If we banned guns then people would just find another weapon. If someone really wants to attack someone they WILL do it and NOTHING will stop them.

Using that logic why dont we just ban everything and anything can be used as a weapon?

Ban .50 cals because it was used to kill a whale? Dear god I'd hate to think what weapon we'd chose after the .50 cal is gone. All I can say is that it can only be more painful for the whale.

People please lets keep in mind that guns don't kill people, last time I checked a gun is not directly responsible for the death of a human being because the gun has no intent to kill a human being considering that a gun is an inanimate object.

I too heard somewhere that .50 cals were required once a whale was harpooned to ensure a quick death to the whale in that's being hunted. It's a good idea, assuming that the hunter has a good shot.

Shattered OUT...

Heck, I have TWO of them.

I can't imagine shooting a whale, though.

50 cal rifles are a lot of fun to shoot, but you have to have a LOT of room. And a really great backstop. The rounds can go a long long way. I used to use the tank range at a certain Army base before 9/11 but now they're all crabby about letting you on base with it, even with the CSM sneaking me in.

At one time I really wanted a 25mm rifle too but it's too much like work, you have to have a FFL for them. If I'm going to do a lot of paperwork and have to have special safes, 24 hour inspection and the like, I want something more worth the effort, like a Mk19. And you just can't get one.

[edit on 10-9-2007 by Tom Bedlam]

Originally posted by jedimiller
I hate to repeat myself, but if we didn't produce guns then we wouldn't have idiots with guns shooting whales all over the place. it's the power of the weapon that people take advantage of. I never said we should take away our guns and let the criminals keep them. I said, destroy ALL the guns and only keep them in a certain base for the military. other than that, there is no need for anyone to own a gun. No need.

so ... you take the gun away from an idiot, and they still have a car, knives, rocks, tasers, and a whole bunch of other things that are available ... and things as simple as a sharpened bamboo stalk makes a decent spear. So they don't have to be stupid with technology.

But, let me also say, guns don't kill people, bullets do. Without bullets, those guns are just hunks of metal.

and ...

NO ... if you want to take away all the guns, then take them from the world military units as well. No guns left on the planet.

The reason the citizens of the u.s.a. have the RIGHT to own guns is to protect them from their own government, not criminals.

I agree, I cannot stand guns and it is much more honorable to fight like the samurai did. They were quite respectful, even to their enemy ... though, they all wished to die if they lost, since losing wasn't honorable No, I am not making light of it, but I honestly do have a lot of respect for those times, when it took more courage to fight than pulling a trigger from a distance. Face to face sword battles take guts. So do fist fights, but at least with a sword fight, you know your enemy has a weapon, in a fist fight, they could have a shank/dagger/knife hidden away for when they are losing.


I do understand your position, but you need to be realistic in the world we live in, not the fantasy some of us wish it was. I personally would like a Star Trek TNG kind of world, where money is abolished as well as poverty, starvation, discrimination, etc. for the most part. Traveling through space and seeing the sights wouldn't be bad either.

But, people are too greedy and short-sighted to see that without money, they could have so much more, so, that dream world of mine won't exist, at least not in my life time.

Neither will the removal of all weapons from the planet (and space). The last thing you want, unless you want to live an Orwellian/Rand-like future ... is to take guns/weapons of equal power away from the law-abiding citizens ... and leave them in the hands of the few ... the government, the military, and the corrupt with power. Now, realize, the first few Joe S.'s may not take up this power and opress the people ... but, it seems nearly inevitable that someone starts to take too much 'liberty' in their position, thinks they know what is best for everyone, and FORCES you to comply with the instruments of fear, power, and weapons.

Thiink of Cheney, who tries to say he doesn't have to answer to the executive branch's rules, with the power of a yes-sir upper military management and intelligence community, and a country of citizens with no way to fight back. That image, my friend, scares the crud out of me.

Before you try to get upset with me, I only own a Katana, Wakazashi, and Tanto. I don't own a firearm of any kind. I sure do know how to aim with considerable accuracy though, if I even do need to take up arms to defend this country from terrorists from the outside or from within.



To the point, people need to be responsible with whatever weapon they use, even their voice.

I find hunting sick. I am angered that anyone in these times are still allowed to hunt whale, dolphin (porpoise), or mostly any other animal. I will not get into the vegetarian thing ... fine, eat the animals that wouldn't exist if they weren't bred and raised for that purpose in the first place. It is still healthier in moderation

You know, it is crazy, people kill animals that can't fight us back, but, if someone goes and tries to interfere with those people, they are considered the bad guy. Where is Dr. Evil with the animals with 'frickin lasers' -puts pinky to mouth- ... I would like to see a hunter fighting a deer with lasers ... instead of sitting in a tree with a rifle to put a head on the wall, the same with all the other 'game' animals and illegally hunted species. Give them a real fight for their life.

See ... star trek food replicators would eliminate the need for hunting, and so would the holi-deck, for those who need to kill defenseless things

Honestly, no offense to hunters that use everything, but I still don't understand why, since you don't need to ... though with the way things are going, you meat-eaters may need those hunting skills to survive.