Isolationism Is America's Answer

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
also, i am going to argue bias, do you have evidence that supports this from an agenda-free source?

And what would you consider as being such? A liberal propaganda rag?

another "great" thread from someone who claims to be a speaker of "truth". how could anyone think isolationism from the world is good for america? like another poster said, we already tried that until december of 1941. what did our isolationism do for us then?

Koncept, don't bother trying to hi-jack anymore of my threads. I have put you on my ignore list and won't be able to see what you post anyway.

[edit on 24-12-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]

Madness, I know that my previous post seems condescending, but really, I'm curious as to what you would consider an "unbiased" source. It seems to me that you view anything and everything that is contrary to YOUR opinion as being "biased." By the way, what is an "agenda-free source." Anyone or anything that claims to be without an agenda is either a liar, or not smart enough to know what agendas are. I don't care who you are or what you represent, you have an agenda.


[edit on 24-12-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
also, i am going to argue bias, do you have evidence that supports this from an agenda-free source?

And what would you consider as being such? A liberal propaganda rag?

...wow, more hyperbole and deflection as well as ignoring my other point. i wonder how many points you've dropped while we've discussed...

anyway, it's obvious that you have no interest in discussion as you clearly missed the "agenda-free" part of my statement and cut out the point i made on economic advantages.

when you're ready to discuss instead of throwing out petty statements and dropping arguments, tell me.

reply to post by SpeakerofTruth


an agenda-free source would be one that doesn't concern itself with a particular agenda and just puts out information as information.

and again: economic advantages/disadvantages are the issue, not just government funds.

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul

an agenda-free source would be one that doesn't concern itself with a particular agenda and just puts out information as information.

There are not any sources that do that.. Oh, there are some which CLAIM to do that, but they have an agenda, just like everyone else. Like I said, anyone who claims not to have an agenda is either a liar, or too ignorant to know what an agenda is.

[edit on 24-12-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]

Agenda

3. personal motivation: an underlying personal viewpoint or bias

Source

A list or program of things to be done or considered: "They share with them an agenda beyond the immediate goal of democratization of the electoral process" (Daniel Sneider).

Source

reply to post by SpeakerofTruth


1: there are institutions which merely collect data for the sake of doing so.
2: economics, where is your evidence showing that illegal immigration has had a negative economic impact?
3: why are americans entitled to the special privilege of access to greater resources simply by their birth?

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul

1: there are institutions which merely collect data for the sake of doing so.

There are those that CLAIM to, yes...

2: economics, where is your evidence showing that illegal immigration has had a negative economic impact?

Uh, to me, the fact that they are here ILLEGALLY and being granted medical and social services is enough economic information for me.

3: why are americans entitled to the special privilege of access to greater resources simply by their birth?

Once again, as an American, I am arrested if I enter Mexio or any other nation ILLEGALLY. Why are we obligated to treat others any different than we or anyone else are treated in said countries?




[edit on 24-12-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
There are those that CLAIM to, yes...

no, they just tend to collect random, unrelated information

Uh, to me, the fact that they are here ILLEGALLY and being granted medical and social services is enough economic information for me.

then you admit your short-sightedness. you should look at the overall economic impact they have instead of the narrow focus you have.
you keep looking at a tree long enough and you won't realize the forest around you.

Once again, as an American, I am arrested if I enter Mexio or any other nation ILLEGALLY. Why are we obligated to treat others any different than we or anyone else are treated in said countries?

then we should make it perfectly legal for any number of people to enter the USA and other nations should adopt a similar policy. it's fairly obvious that the USA has a somewhat (if not overtly) racist immigration policy in which it is far easier to get into the USA if you are a northern or western european, while southern europeans, people of latin america, africans, and other people of third world nations.

the problem isn't that the people are entering here illegally, it's that they are forced to enter the USA illegally.

[edit on 12/24/07 by madnessinmysoul]

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
then we should make it perfectly legal for any number of people to enter the USA and other nations should adopt a similar policy. it's fairly obvious that the USA has a somewhat (if not overtly) racist immigration policy in which it is far easier to get into the USA if you are a northern or western european, while southern europeans, people of latin america, africans, and other people of third world nations.

Yeah, madenss, it's that we are "racist" rather than concerned that the influx is going to turn our nation into the same hell holes these people are leaving... Keep believing that, bud. You just keep believing that.

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
Yeah, madenss, it's that we are "racist" rather than concerned that the influx is going to turn our nation into the same hell holes these people are leaving... Keep believing that, bud. You just keep believing that.

the ignorance shows. i'll give you a good example, my birth nation is only allowed 2 immigration per year to the USA. 2. when my family came to the USA, we used both slots up (my mother was born in the USA when my grandparents lived there for a few years)

malta is anything but a hellhole...

you might want to educate yourself.

edit to add: and why do you keep ignoring certain points i make?

[edit on 12/25/07 by madnessinmysoul]

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
malta is anything but a hellhole...

Let me ask you a question, if these places are as nice as Malta, as I have been there, then why do so many decide to leave their homelands to come here? By the way, I served two years in the military and have been to numerous other countries, so, no, I'm not "ignorant" as you seem to be continuously implying.. Mr. "I'm eighteen years old but I'm awfully 'smart' for my age."

[edit on 25-12-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]

really really interesting thread but i think humanity has isolated its self from each other far too long, we need to be knocking walls down not building them up, look at the iron curtain the isolation of east v west it does nothing but breed suspicion and leave an underlying hate and mistrust for the generations that follow, people who only look at the worlds bad points would want isolation, if i read only the bad points in my local paper i wouldn't leave the front door there is so much more to the world than that, America offers the rest of the world more good than bad and most of the world offers America the same don't let the media or politicians lead you to believe the world is this terrible place because it really isn't all doom and gloom, most people are good and want good things for the world, hopefully eventually the people we elect will too

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
Let me ask you a question, if these places are as nice as Malta, as I have been there, then why do so many decide to leave their homelands to come here?

work, education, etc.
if america is so great, why did my father return to malta after 16 years in the USA?

there's always a motivation, no matter how good the place is it's the circumstance of the individual that dictates action

By the way, I served two years in the military and have been to numerous other countries, so, no, I'm not "ignorant" as you seem to be continuously implying..

i can only go by the knowledge you demonstrate.

Mr. "I'm eighteen years old but I'm awfully 'smart' for my age."

it's actually 19 now...
and ad homs aren't going to win you the argument any more than other logical fallacies would.

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul

work, education, etc.
if america is so great, why did my father return to malta after 16 years in the USA?

Given the way you feel about America, I hope you stay wherever you are... Please do.


Also, given that you are in some foreign land, you really have no right to tell the American populace how they should feel or think when it comes to the security and continued welfare of their nation. Thank ya.

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth

Also, given that you are in some foreign land, you really have no right to tell the American populace how they should feel or think when it comes to the security and continued welfare of their nation. Thank ya.

Considering the compulsion the US has to conduct it's interests of security and welfare beyond it's own borders that extends to the manipulation of the social economic and political mechanisms of nations on a global scale , then I think he has a right to his say. The US openly proclaims that it has the right to use military force anywhere in the world, at any time it chooses, against any country that it believes to be a threat to American interests or national security. The US will not hesitate to act alone if its attempt to enlist the support of the international community does not succeed. Nor will the US be restrained by the convention of international law. Perhaps given those circumstances, You may find it a little understandable that sometimes it is within peoples 'rights' from a foreign land to have their opinion of your security and welfare when it becomes a global issue of America's making . And not the insular isolationist affair you and most of the non-american world wish it were.

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
Given the way you feel about America, I hope you stay wherever you are... Please do.

that's no way to talk to an american citizen or a human being in general. you really seem to sink to lows that i don't normally expect out of you when your view of things is challenged on this issue...

Also, given that you are in some foreign land, you really have no right to tell the American populace how they should feel or think when it comes to the security and continued welfare of their nation. Thank ya.

again, i'm an american citizen, i have EVERY right to tell my fellow americans what's on my mind on the issues.

oh, and what gerbil said!
i completely agree with it.

[edit on 12/26/07 by madnessinmysoul]

Madness, young man, you're right. I'm being disrespectful and for that I apologize. I mean that..