Bombs going off while the first plane impacts the WTC Video and picture provided.

If you cant see an explosion on the second hit on the second tower I have nothing to tell you.

Originally posted by piacenza
I guess you see what you want to see case closed.

Agreed. There will always be debunkers. I agree with your post and a very good find. To the people saying the first impact cloud could be from the plane; In order for a cloud like that to appear from the explosion from the plane there would have to be no floors there. We do know that the floors above the crash zones were intact until the building fell. That is all I will say on the first video.

The second video could be from the first plane explosion, but I highly doubt that. Take a look at the crash site of the plane. This was some time after the first plane crashed. Most of the fuel in that plane burned off in the first explosion leaving little, or no fuel left for something like that to happen as far away as it did.

[edit on 12-7-2007 by Tahlen]

Ignorance.



How, exactly, do all supporters keep quoting -

It certainly doesn't look normal...

How many times, in your life, have you witnessed firsthand jetliners crashing into buildings, besides 9/11?














Exactly.

Originally posted by Tahlen

Originally posted by piacenza
I guess you see what you want to see case closed.

The second video could be from the first plane explosion, but I highly doubt that. Take a look at the crash site of the plane. This was some time after the first plane crashed. Most of the fuel in that plane burned off in the first explosion leaving little, or no fuel left for something like that to happen as far away as it did.

[edit on 12-7-2007 by Tahlen]

I'm going to go on a few assumptions to make my point here.





Flame reacts wildly and unpredictably to wind, we agree on this. (Assumption made - rational people would understand and agree with this point)



Several hundred feet in the air, wind currents are far stronger and more unpredictable than those on ground level. We agree on this. (Second assumption - rational and logical people know this to be fact. Cite; fireworks displays ALWAYS have "test shots" prior to full display to judge wind currents at height)


Jetliners traveling at hundreds of miles per hour create and disturb already pragmatic wind at height. We agree on this. (Third assumption - again rational, logical, non-ignorant people know this to be fact.)


Therefore, my logic dictates that A.)Wind interacts with fires in strong ways. B.) Jetliners PRODUCE and ALTER wind.

A plus B equals; C.)The approach of the jetliner traveling at hundreds of miles per hour created and/or altered wind currents causing a very small, smokeless flareup.

This does not coincide with knowledge of any bomb in use.

First off, good eye to notice the smoke coming out of the top of the tower at the time of impact.

However I honestly don't think it was caused by a bomb. First, it occurs 3-4 seconds after impact, at the time the fireball rapidly expands. I believe what happened is that the explosion swept through the core and up the elevator shafts like a chimney and was vented through the mechanical floors at the top of the building, which were not sealed so they could dissipate heat from the hvac, etc., and I think this is what we see here.

This plane hit on-center, so you must assume it impacted on the core and would have caused the damage to enable this scenario.

Also, this plane hit very high on the building and the distance inside the building the smoke traveled relative to the fireball outside is consistent.

BTW, this is by far the brightest pre-impact flash I've ever seen on any version of this footage and has obviously been tricked with. There was a flash, that should not be in dispute, but it has been shamelessly enhanced for effect.

Finally, the other footage of the second impact and the near-simultaneous explosions in the other tower shows you that the OP has good reason to believe as he does, since it proves that explosions were timed to coincide with impacts, even though in the first case I don't believe what you're seeing was caused by an explosion.

In sum, the second video is more telling than the first re: explosions, but the first caught the pre-impact flash which--even though enhanced--is good evidence something is afoot.


[edit on 13-7-2007 by gottago]

The problem is there is NO preimpact flash.

The flash you see is white. Aluminum, when burnt (in this case VAPORIZED by the EXTREME forces at work) burns white.

The nose of the jetliner impacted with forces in the range of THOUSANDS of foot-tons. A foot-ton is the amount of energy used to lift one TON one FOOT off the ground.

Aluminum, when subjected to these kinds of forces, will vaporize, and the resulting friction is enough to ignite said aluminum vapor.

Originally posted by piacenza
I cannot find the video version with a nice Zoom of the impact of the first plane where those bombs are a lot more visible.
Notice on the top of the building the smoke and one explosion.


img292.imageshack.us...

Video

Mod Edit: Image Size – Please Review This Link.

[edit on 12/7/2007 by Mirthful Me]

[edit on 12-7-2007 by piacenza]

By definition , it's called an EXPLOSION for a reason .. It expans out in ALL directions .. No one in the history of the universe had ever seen something like 911 happen before so there's no template to compare it to. So what's so hard to believe ? It's only because no one has ever seen a site like that before so there's no comparison . I honestly can't believe why you people WANT to give all this credit to the government to pull something like that off when they can't even throw
away a semen stained dress .. Please .

[edit on 13-7-2007 by gen.disaray]

img292.imageshack.us...


So there would seem to be what looks like an explosion at the top of the building. Considering there are accounts of the explosion reaching the basement, I can't see why it couldn't go up as well at the impact point.

Second, why would the government or whoever you say did this, make such obvious mistakes that you notice like this. Consider how complicated that you think it was, and how they have apparently slipped up so much.

Third, what would the point in an explosion above the main failure point be anyway?

Originally posted by forsakenwayfarer
The problem is there is NO preimpact flash.

The flash you see is white. Aluminum, when burnt (in this case VAPORIZED by the EXTREME forces at work) burns white.

The nose of the jetliner impacted with forces in the range of THOUSANDS of foot-tons. A foot-ton is the amount of energy used to lift one TON one FOOT off the ground.

Aluminum, when subjected to these kinds of forces, will vaporize, and the resulting friction is enough to ignite said aluminum vapor.

Ok so would you mind explaining how come the flash in the second impact its actually not where the plane hits?
Should be an easy task...

The flash at the time of impact was casued by static electricity. This has been discussed on SEVERAL occasions.

The flash that I think you are referring to is visible also in many other videos of the first impact (usually the good quality one have it).

I'll say it again - there was ONLY ever one video of the first impact. The Naudet Brothers recorded it whilst filming a documentary. It is the only record of the first impact.

If there is another, please enlighten me.

[edit on 13-7-2007 by mirageofdeceit]

THIS is the problem.


........................................__......................................................
.................................,-~*`¯lllllll`*~,..................................................
...........................,-~*`lllllllllllllllllllllllllll¯`*-,..........................................
......................,-~*llllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll*-,......................................
..................,-*llllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll.\.....................................
................;*`lllllllllllllllllllllllllll,-~*~-,llllllllllllllllllll\....................................
................\lllllllllllllllllllllllllll/...........\;;;;llllllllllll,-`~-,................................
.................\lllllllllllllllllllll,-*.............`~-~-,...(.(¯`*,`,...............................
...................\llllllllllll,-~*........................)_-\..*`*;..)..............................
.....................\,-*`¯,*`)............,-~*`~................../...............................
.....................|/.../.../~,......-~*,-~*`;.................../.\..............................
.................../.../..../..../..,-,..*~,.`*~*..................*...\.............................
...................|.../.../..../.*`...\................................)....)¯`~,....................
...................|./..../..../........).........)`*~-,............../.....|..)...`~-,..............
.................././.../....,*`-,.....`-,....*`....,---......\...../...../..|..........¯```*~-,,,,
.................(............)`*~-,.....`*`.,-~*.,-*.......|.../..../..../...............\..........
..................*-,.......`*-,...`~,..``.,,,-*.............|.,*...,*....|.................\.........
......................*,.........`-,....)-,..................,-*`...,-*.....(`-,..............\........
........................f`-,........`-,/...*-,___,,-~*.....,-*......|....`-,...............\.......


Ignorance is bliss?



[edit on 7-13-2007 by forsakenwayfarer]

The plane going in would have caused enormousness pressure, blowing out windows, doors etc. on the upper floors. They were no bombs.

Originally posted by SG-17
They were no bombs.

Just playing Devil's advocate, but bombs do the same thing. So how do you know it wasn't both? I don't see how you possibly could know.

Originally posted by mirageofdeceit

The flash that I think you are referring to is visible also in many other videos of the first impact (usually the good quality one have it).

I'll say it again - there was ONLY ever one video of the first impact. The Naudet Brothers recorded it whilst filming a documentary. It is the only record of the first impact.

If there is another, please enlighten me.

[edit on 13-7-2007 by mirageofdeceit]

I am refering to the same video you are mentioning but posted by multiple sources and you are wrong there are actually 2 videos with 2 different angles of the first impact.
Go to youtube and you can find it easily.

Originally posted by bsbray11

Originally posted by SG-17
They were no bombs.

Just playing Devil's advocate, but bombs do the same thing. So how do you know it wasn't both? I don't see how you possibly could know.

All so called "truthers" seem to think THEY know? How is THAT any different.

"I don't see how you possibly could know."

Hi guys, I have been looking at the video in question again (I have a dvd version here) and I think the smoke right at the top might actually be from the impact fireball and not a seperate explosion. It seems to be well timed with the ball of smoke expanding rather than going off just before.

My guess is the fireball and smoke expanded inside the building and travelled up the elevator shafts hitting the roof then coming out the top with as we.

Still that doesn't mean it isn't a detonation on the top level but I think based on the footage thats inconclusive. However I do fully believe the squibs we see during the top down destruction are indeed bombs.

Like this for example:


[edit on 13-7-2007 by VicRH]

Do you have a specific point to make about something I've personally said, forsaken, or are you just ranting? Where have I ever said I know anything when I'm not completely positive? Maybe once in a blue moon, and good luck finding an example from any of my posts. Thanks.

It seems for some reason you have made this a personal statement. I don't know why, because that is not the case.

A point was made, apparently too close to home for your tastes?

Originally posted by forsakenwayfarer
A point was made, apparently too close to home for your tastes?

Maybe I just don't like bull being slung at me without you being able to back it up, and apparently you aren't even going to bother to try. Do I make things up about you? If I did, do you think you would take offense? And what if I responded by still being an ass to you? Put yourself in that situation so you'll realize how you're coming across to me right now.

So I tell someone they don't know something, you jump the "truthers" case for it, but you weren't talking about me in particular, right? So who are you talking about?