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posted on Jul, 11 2007 @ 09:02 AM
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Hey, I know this isn't the suggestions box, but this is a discussion of points, and the use of them, so let me throw this out there.

I heard the poster who felt that some people were starting "bogus" threads to get points for validation, and that a lot of these were junk threads. I agree, and think there's a way to stop that.

Just do not give a new thread poster any points until there are 10 replies, or 15 replies. That way, mods can shut off a junk post and the person get no points for the effort. Also, even if it is a valid thread, but it gets no interest from the others here, then there are no points awarded.

That might make people work just a bit more to post better, more timely threads.

And before someone jumps my case on this, if you want to look, I've had threads that went nowhere fast myself, so I would have gotten no points for those efforts.

(Damn, I could have started a thread and gotten a hundred points over all the argument this idea would raise.
)




posted on Jul, 11 2007 @ 09:04 AM
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This has now become a case of appeasement. Now everyone else who has too many BTS point will start screaming "censorship"!!! and calling for their points to be reallocated.

You have just opened up Pandora's box. I wish you all the best.



posted on Jul, 11 2007 @ 09:10 AM
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I like the points system, it's well thought out and does work.

I'll bet that if "we" keep complaining about it, it will be taken away.

Be thankful for what we get and let's move on.


Remember we're all guests here, while the admin do take our recommendations in to consideration, it's still thier site and they can do what they want with it.



posted on Jul, 11 2007 @ 09:20 AM
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That was "only a question"?

Taking a remarkably minor issue and blowing it up into a "censorship" rant?

The answer was explained VERY clearly on more than one occasion but for some reason it's being ignored.

I will repeat it again since this oh-so-dramatic thread has such a high readership. When the Administrators of ATS decided that there should be 3 different kinds of "points", members' point totals were divided among the three. That is the story. Nothing more, nothing less.

The question was answered to any rational person's satisfaction in a thread yesterday and the thread was closed.

At approximately 1:15AM last night I made the decision to attempt to help the OP out. I zero'd out the BTS points and transfered them all to PTS, as this was the desire indicated to me in the multiple posts about it. Sadly those engaged in the "pile-on-drama-bomb" have chosen to ignore that.

What is truly remarkable is that some will use any opportunity to go scream about censorship. Anything. Ignoring the fact that when a thread is deleted you get an automated u2u about it. It's not up to the mod, the u2u is sent on it's own. Deleted individual posts? Well, those are backed up in case complaints arise. Speaking of complaints, you all know how to submit them. See, that's the way to get something resolved.

We have thousands of members posting thousands of posts every day. The staff is relatively small, and is human. No one has ever claimed perfection. If you disagree with something a staff member has done, you submit a complaint. The complaint is reviewed by the ENTIRE staff, not just one.

Some people in this thread are coming up with major complaints and accusations. My question to them is who are you? I've never seen your name before and I've never heard your problem. If you really gave a damn about your problem and submitted a complaint, perhaps I (or another staff member) would have known about your problem and resolved it. How are we supposed to know if you don't say anything? How can you jump on us with accusations if you don't even give us a chance to correct your issue by telling us about it?

I think that about sums up my views on this subject. As I said, I've corrected the issue that the OP had.

As a parting note however, I must state the following. The title of this thread is "Censorship is Alive and Well at ATS". As a member here for four and a half years I consider myself qualified to say that this is a false statement. Drama-seeking on the other hand, that's alive and well. That is what's disturbing.



posted on Jul, 11 2007 @ 09:25 AM
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Originally posted by 11Bravo
All Im gonna say about this issue is that certain Mods are slap happy, apparently drunk on their 'psuedo-power'.


Really? Hadn't noticed that at all. I, personally, haven't had any issue with the way they do their jobs herein. Have I had arguements with them on threads? Sure, we all have... I don't think I've seen one of them abuse their "psuedo-power". Do they have bad days? We all do.

When a Mod oversteps it usually isn't for long, and they've gotten slapped down fairly hard by the true powers on ATS. Some familiar names aren't here anymore because of that.

All in all, this board is much, much better run then most, if not all the others around.



posted on Jul, 11 2007 @ 09:26 AM
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Yes, Djarums I would agree with you completely.

I think the whole point of this topic is very silly and petty, after all, this is just the internet.

I was merely poking fun at the parallels that we face all the time in our life when we submit to an aggressor. We see that in hostage crisis's we see it in war we see it everyone.

I think this whole thread is laughable on how petty it is. You guys do a great job and this is the best run forum I have ever been on. Its sad the ECK can't see that. Or if does, uses sensationalism to get her way.



posted on Jul, 11 2007 @ 09:38 AM
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Djarums, points taken. While I doubt that my attempts to lighten the mood on this thread was the aim of your rant, I feel compelled to point out a wee little fact that you have overlooked.

It's a conspiracy forum!

What do you expect? Didn't they warn you when you took the job that most of us carry paranoia around like a lucky talisman? And that we will read, and maybe post, on any thread that has the "C" word in it?

Do you read some of the things that members think are a conspiracy? This is a world class insane asylum for the severely paranoid. Me included. (Though unlike many here, my paranoia is justified.
)

Hey, for some of us, this is free therapy. Role playing to release of pent up hostility at a world we feel we have no control over.

And you're one of us. You think (implied) that we are crazy to make your life suck by having to deal with all of this. You want rational behavior, and a sense of moderation, all the while hiding behind a mask and suit avatar that makes you look like someone's nightmare.

Lighten up, dude. We're in this together.



posted on Jul, 11 2007 @ 03:43 PM
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I think the only sensored crowd is those who are short with word, as well as stuipid.

Im not sure why you are so worried about points for. Im not to sure what they are for... Above Top Secert, sure. Below Top Secret, sure, PTS...????

Conspircy
i have extra, or misapropiated points, clearly this is the work of those known as the three amigos, and there tyantical. faciest ways.



posted on Jul, 11 2007 @ 03:50 PM
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You have 0 BTS points now!!
Satisfied?



posted on Jul, 11 2007 @ 04:08 PM
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Personally (and please note that the use of the word "personally" is intended to denote that these are my personal views, and need not be applied to, accepted by, or smiled upon by others,) the accumulation of points is not why I read and post. Given the topic of this thread, I glanced at my points for the first time in ages today, and noted with complete apathy that I have a modest number of ATS points because I have posted here more than anywhere else, a negative sum of BTS points because I rarely if ever post there, and a paltry sum of PTS points owing to posts I made in threads that were moved from here to there (I endeavor to avoid threads dedicated solely to politics, or threads which have been deemed as such by the mods.) My points are probably, by most people's standards, pathetic to look at. I also lack an avatar and other aesthetic touches that might otherwise distinguish me from other members. That is by choice. Should this bother me? If it should, then I must apologize, because it most assuredly does not.

I come here because it is a well maintained crossroads of ideas, thoughts, perspectives, and viewpoints, like many other internet communities, and because it attracts those with interests and curiosities similar to my own. I post infrequently by some members' standards, and I tend to only create threads if I need answers to questions that are plaguing or fascinating me. I post here because I like to, and at times, because I feel the need to. I do not post here to accrue points. I have enough trouble accruing monetary "points" in the real world to be troubled by my virtual "thought economy."

As for censorship, whether or not censorship occurred in this case is beside the point, as is whether you, I, or any other member agrees or disagrees with censorship in general. This is a privately owned and operated website. We agreed to the TOS when we joined. We knew we would be subject to someone else's rules when we signed up. We don't have to like it. We simply have to abide by it in order to utilize this web space for discussion of the topics on display. It makes little sense, and serves no purpose save perhaps to exasperate oneself, to agree to such terms and then, having seen them in action, to decry them as unpalatable. If true censorship did ever come to ATS, it would be within its owners' purview to institute it. I could leave or stay at my leisure. Whether we would like it or not would not be at issue. This is a privately owned and operated website. The fact that it allows open discussion on a wide range of subject matter does nothing to change that, though it may make it less apparent than it might otherwise be. Likewise, I may not agree with the way society works, but I have to live in it.

Personally, I am predominantly satisfied with ATS, its rules, and its staff. As one of them stated earlier in this thread, they never claimed perfection. I respect the views and opinions of those who disagree, and recognize the reasons for the existence of the points system, but it is my position that ATS is not about how many points a member has.

[edit on 7/11/2007 by AceWombat04]

[edit on 7/11/2007 by AceWombat04]



posted on Jul, 11 2007 @ 05:57 PM
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Originally posted by skyblueff0


But, on a serious matter, I really don't like how SOME, but not all of the new members, are using that point disbursement as a "Rite of Passage" type or a "Firebrand" cause.

I believe they view the point system more as a credibility or respect system, the more points you get, the more credibility and respect you obtain within the Forums.


I'm sorry if I come off as a royal pain sometimes. But the points issue was an important thing for me when I was a PTS Counsel member. I wanted the points we earn (anyway) to mean something.

To me, the points I've earned represent the hours I've spent here contributing threads and comments on others' threads. I'd be a liar if I told you it didn't feel great to see my score jump suddenly from time to time (when someone thot a contribution was good).


Feeling that way makes you think you've done something good; contributed to someone's betterment (out there). So, I think the points system is great - when respected.

I just wish I could buy a hat and mug with them.

(someone pls correct me on that if I'm wrong)



posted on Jul, 11 2007 @ 06:01 PM
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I think its great that Djarums
gave him 0 bts points. I think you should readjust his bts points and just give him 1 to add insult to injury.



posted on Jul, 11 2007 @ 06:10 PM
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Originally posted by hikix
I think its great that Djarums
gave him 0 bts points. I think you should readjust his bts points and just give him 1 to add insult to injury.


You people kill me.


I raised a valid issue. Attack me all you want. The funny thing is, some of you don't even know me; therefore, you don't get where I'm coming from. I care about this site, believe it or not; as you can see, I've been here awhile.

Djarums, I'm kind of surprised at you. But whatever.:shk:

Its all good. And for all you haters, if I could give each of you 100 of my pts each, I would. That's not why I'm here.



posted on Jul, 11 2007 @ 06:16 PM
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Surprised at me for what?

You requested that your BTS points be moved to PTS.

I did precisely that.

I'm not sure what the issue is.



posted on Jul, 11 2007 @ 06:27 PM
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Maybe one day when the 3 Amigos have hit the big time they may allow us to exchange our points for one dollar per point


Seriously though i dont even notice my points. As long as i can access the whole of ATS then points mean nothing to me they are akin to monopoly money.

Instead of flagging peoples threads i think we should be allowed to donate some of our points to the OP of a decent thread ie instead of flagging then donate 50, 100, or 500 points to them. It would be like "Wow what a great thread, Here have 500 on me" At least it would give us something to do with them.

Do the 3 Amigos have a Fort Knox type bank where they keep billions of points???



posted on Jul, 11 2007 @ 07:14 PM
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Originally posted by 11Bravo
All Im gonna say about this issue is that certain Mods are slap happy, apparently drunk on their 'psuedo-power'.

That's a bunch of bunk. Mods are people too just like you and me and they have to put up with accusations like this ^ on a daily basis.
I've never seen anyone around here on a power trip and neither have you.
Stop the nonsense.


Take a pill.



posted on Jul, 11 2007 @ 07:19 PM
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dont understand the importance of this



posted on Jul, 11 2007 @ 07:20 PM
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Originally posted by thesaint

Do the 3 Amigos have a Fort Knox type bank where they keep billions of points???


Nope, they're just like the Federal Reserve, they just print more.


Actually, I'm with you on the points. Someday I may get around to an avatar, but aside from that, I doubt I'll have much use for those I have.

It's nice to get applause, and points come with that, but the satisfaction is in doing something that makes someone else notice.



posted on Jul, 11 2007 @ 08:06 PM
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Chill.
No offense, but a few posters here need to get a grip. On the other hand, kudos to the more mature members here who have shown some understanding.

It's the nature of the beast; we're trying.
There are 50 staff members here- roughly half of them are forum moderators- for us to catch everything, much less brief eachother on every single action, would make a full time, if not overtime job out of this volunteer effort which we all do simply for the love of ATS and the service of our fellow members.

It's pretty dang good...
Whatever disagreements we might have with site policy or certain decisions (almost everyone gets one eventually- even yours truly has been behind the woodshed with a mod once, back before I was staff), the fact is that we choose to spend our free time here, so clearly we can all appreciate that ATS provides extensive services and they are free.

Because of staff.
Part of what makes that possible (in addition to the sound planning and member-conscience mindset of the Amigos) is the fact that ATS mods do for free what a print publication would pay an editorial staff hundreds of thousands for (combined).

You can complain...
What does a thread like this accomplish? Some people are talking about past instances that are too late to help, some people are just plain wrong and putting the staff in a position of having to point that out and make the member look bad in public just to defend our integrity. It's bad for everybody.

Or you can help.
When you are subject to staff action you don't understand, you should query the mod who took the action, or use the "complaint feature" in the member center, not to be hostile, but to find out what was wrong and how you can accomplish what you want to accomplish within T&C. Maybe if the video contains profanity we'll let you synopsize it and post a link with a disclaimer if you ask. If not and somebody else does it, don't assume it's bias. Point it out to us politely. We don't want the rules broken by one member any more than by another. We could use the extra eyes and constructive voices.



posted on Jul, 11 2007 @ 08:08 PM
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Originally posted by NGC2736
Nope, they're just like the Federal Reserve, they just print more.


I bet they don't even have enough gold to back-up these points.



Originally posted by The Vagabond
Part of what makes that possible (in addition to the sound planning and member-conscience mindset of the Amigos) is the fact that ATS mods do for free what a print publication would pay an editorial staff hundreds of thousands for (combined).


Really? You can get paid for the stuff you do for editing and moderating messages on a message board? Unless there is something else moderators do on this forum that I am not aware of. On one forum I go to, all the moderators do is edit or delete messages, so if there is more all of the moderators do (excluding Tinwiki, unless all participate), I'd like to hear it. I once brought up my question on that forum and asked if they would ever get paid for what they do, and they responded "not a chance in hell".

[edit on 7/11/2007 by SonicInfinity]



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