Chinese Military 13 million strong?

Wow, I have to admit this is an overwhelming number for a "peace time" military but if wiki is correct then that is the total number of the Chinese Military (combined forces) This outrageously high number includes the large "militia" and the paramilitary forces.

The People's Armed Police Force (PAP) is a paramilitary police force primarily responsible for law enforcement within the PRC.

According to another wiki link the size of the standing Chinese Military is about 2.4 million, about 1 million more than the US.

Since the establishment of the People's Republic of China in 1949, the Military of the People's Republic of China has grown to include the active and reserve forces of the People's Liberation Army, the People's Liberation Army Navy, the People's Armed Police and the Militia [1]. In terms of sheer number of troops, the 13-million-strong Chinese armed forces is currently the largest military in the world [2].

Source, Wikipedia


In the beginning was just reading up the Japanese Military, wondering when or if they would eventually amend their Constitution in the event that the USA needed their assistance in any future altercations we might have over in Asia, specifically with China.
My brother and I were just discussing this the other day. Japan is one of our most important allies and they would most likely play a key role in any future conflicts that may arise between China and the USA.
A more powerful Japanese Military would definitely be in our best interest and to be honest I dont know to much about how (we) wrote their Constitution and how hard it would be to have it amended.
This is not intended to be one of those doomsday threads. I dont know if America and China will ever go to war, I certainly hope not. It really just started out as a light discussion about Japans Military and its limitations and just kind of grew from there.

I edited it to update more information that i found. I kind of over reacted initially, I seen the number "13 million" and sort of posted before reading more info.



[edit on 19-5-2007 by Kr0n0s]

Sheer numbers alone would probably make this a pushover if war fighting was done like the old rank and file style, the first row kneels down and shoot at the other side, and the other side the same, but our advantage are our Naval superiority and quick strike capabilities at Guam here this will calm your nerves.

www.fas.org...

no one will F with a B2 bomber I don't care how many people they have.

and also as long as there is a Wal Mart on every corner we have nothing to worry about.

They may have a 13 million man army but there is no way if we went to war with china that they would be able to support that many soldiers. Do you realize how much much that would cost them just to give every soldier 1 weapon and 1 mag. ALso just trying to feed all those soldiers would also be a lot of money and food. Sometimes its not always good to have a giant army ie sparta and the persians.

Yea I have to agree, the logistical issues with trying to support such a huge force would greatly strain the Chinese resources. I dont really fear an invasion from China because for one thing, there Navy just doesnt have the capabilities to transport enough troops across the Sea, unless they ally themselves with someone like, say... Russia like this article suggests
Could you imagine the US or any other country trying to occupy China?
I dont think it would be possible.
Hell, even 10,000 peasants with a rake could over run a fire base of a few hundred soldiers.
Look at what happened in Korea in 1950 though, enough Chinese stormed across the border to throw us back on our heals and keep us that way for quite a while.
Sometimes its difficult to wrap your mind around the shear size of China and their population. What is it now, about 2-3 billion? That is an astounding amount of people.
Dont worry though, I'm not seriously concerned about this. What I mean is, it is a concern but not an obsession, it was just a discussion we had and one that comes up here occasionally.
Id like to hear from some Chinese or Taiwanese about this topic though.
peace

America had better wake up to this very real threat. That s all I am going to say.

You gotta have something more constructive to add here right?
Im not doggin you speaker, just like to know more about what youre thinking about this..

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
America had better wake up to this very real threat. That s all I am going to say.

[edit on 19-5-2007 by Kr0n0s]

Well, this is actually something that has concerned me greatly for quite some time. I have posted much on this issue.

There are a number of threads here at ATS relating to China and the threat/threats that they may present to America. Here are some good places to look, in my opinion.

China Vs. U.S

China overtakes America in exports

China build-up, for what?

All of these thread adequately show how China is a very real threat. There are also many more threads here at ATS relating to China.

I'll be honest, I think that if the United States doesn't keep a steady eye on China, it will become much more of a threat that any grenade launching Middle Eastern nation ever thought about being.


Current Military personnel in the U.S armed services:

Approximately 1,426,713 personnel are currently on active duty in the military with an additional 1,259,000 personnel in the seven reserve components .

Numbers game

These numbers are probably not exact, they came from wikipedia, but they are pretty close. That puts us over just 2.5 million service personnel. Things are so desperate for the United States military that there are even plans of instating foreign nationals into our military.

WASHINGTON -- The armed forces, already struggling to meet recruiting goals, are considering expanding the number of noncitizens in the ranks -- including disputed proposals to open recruiting stations overseas and putting more immigrants on a faster track to US citizenship if they volunteer -- according to Pentagon officials

Bad Situation

When a nation starts having problems in finding citizens in its own borders will ing to fight for it, then it has problems indeed. it's a sad state of affairs in my honest opinion.




[edit on 19-5-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]

China is already working extremely hard to close the military gap. Experts estimate their spy network may have as many as 10,000 spies, and 3000 front companies.

www.post-gazette.com...

They are also using hacking teams to break into highly classified computer systems and steal military information, on a regular basis.

software.silicon.com...

In my opinion these events alone constitute major acts of war. But the government is mostly keeping this quiet because we can not afford a war with china at the moment.

Originally posted by Vipassana


In my opinion these events alone constitute major acts of war. But the government is mostly keeping this quiet because we can not afford a war with china at the moment.

The United States is proving that it can't even fight a two front war and certainly not a three front. Wow, how far we have fallen from the rough and ready days of WW2. We are a paper tiger in my honest opinion.

[edit on 19-5-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]

The US wanted to prove that using our superior technology would require less troops on the ground but that just isnt the case.
No amount of smart bombs in the world can equal the benefits of having soldiers on the ground, especially in an Urban type military campaign.
I want to stress that I am NOT one of those "doomsayers" or a chicken little "the sky is falling" type person.
Im just trying to point out the obvious and wonder why this is a taboo topic within the US Govt.
I'd like to touch on what I mentioned earlier. Its my opinion that it would be HUGELY beneficial for us if Japan was able to amend its Pacifist Constitution and begin an offensive military buildup, especially its Navy.
I dont know all the specifics of its Constitution, especially the question I have of whether they would actually need our permission to do this.
Honestly that is the real point I was trying to make in my original post. This needs to be started now, so that within 5 years they could actually be of some benefit for us.

Japan has no need to update their military status as long as they are under the US nuclear umbrella. Why spend billions on military equipment when you can just ask the US to launch a few nukes? We should concentrate more on solidifying some kind of alliance with China rather than militarizing Japan.

Originally posted by Kr0n0s
Yea I have to agree, the logistical issues with trying to support such a huge force would greatly strain the Chinese resources. I dont really fear an invasion from China because for one thing, there Navy just doesnt have the capabilities to transport enough troops across the Sea, unless they ally themselves with someone like, say... Russia like this article suggests
Could you imagine the US or any other country trying to occupy China?
I dont think it would be possible.
Hell, even 10,000 peasants with a rake could over run a fire base of a few hundred soldiers.
Look at what happened in Korea in 1950 though, enough Chinese stormed across the border to throw us back on our heals and keep us that way for quite a while.
Sometimes its difficult to wrap your mind around the shear size of China and their population. What is it now, about 2-3 billion? That is an astounding amount of people.
Dont worry though, I'm not seriously concerned about this. What I mean is, it is a concern but not an obsession, it was just a discussion we had and one that comes up here occasionally.
Id like to hear from some Chinese or Taiwanese about this topic though.
peace

As a Chinese, I think everybody in the world knows that the Chinese army is the largest military museum in the world. Chinese weapon technology is several decades behind America and Russia. Even the satellite bombing test that have been exaggerated by American military personnels and weapon companies can only match to ancient American technology in 1970s or 80s.

Yes, Chinese military technology is making progress, but the same is happening in America. The difference between Chinese military power and American military power is only expanding.

Unless some country invades China, 2 million Chinese army does not impose any threat since China lacks the technology to project power far away. The reason why China needs such a big army is obvious. Korea Peninsula, Taiwan Strait and Kashmir are all dangerous problems that will spread to China if not careful enough. Not only is China bordering intrisically and culturally ultra aggressive Japan and gigantic and extremely capable Russia, China is also bordering the heartland of Muslim terrorism. Bin Laden can easily flee into Chinese border anytime. Southeastern Asia between Laos, Thailand and Burma has also the largest illegal drug business.

Luketao, there is a possibility that all of this is much ado about nothing. I mean, during the "cold war" we were led to believe that Russia was on the same technological level as America and the truth of the matter was, they weren't even close. You may be correct Luketao.

Excellent post Luketao, I am always interested in the opinions of others but especially opinions from the country that I reference in a post that I make.
Lets all just hope that the world, especially our respective country's, never have to find out how a war between our two nations would play out.
peace

Originally posted by Kr0n0s
Excellent post Luketao, I am always interested in the opinions of others but especially opinions from the country that I reference in a post that I make.
Lets all just hope that the world, especially our respective country's, never have to find out how a war between our two nations would play out.
peace

I think many Americans hate China and Chinese people because China does not adopt American systems and American beliefs. I think it is a mentality of cultural imperialism. The "Chinese Exclusion Act" in American history also reflected another sort of American fear for the Chinese.

The fact is that China now is very willing to assimilate western experiences, systems and adaptible values. Just from 1978 to 2008, Chinese economic values have peacefully shifted from extreme left to at least moderately right. The progress in Chinese military technology is compatible with Chinese economic growth.

Yes, many Chinese people are still suspicious of American values, such as "Democracy", "Freedom" and "Individuality". But quite a few Chinese, especially the young ones, also find American TV dramas and movies attractive and many of them admire the American way of life. It is easy to see that China is surely going to get much more liberal in the following decades. However, it is a big mistake if America tries to directly force that upon China. The mainstream Chinese people, including many of the CCP party members, all know that we are going to gradually adopt the good sides of the western political systems.

In all, I think China is definitely going to become more liberal and "western", but it is not going to happen overnight. American decision makers just need more patience. In general, Chinese people are very flexible. Fundamentalism and Extremism have no soil.

I think that to an extent, most American leaders have taken a hand's off approach in regards to China. Now, whether that approach is out of fear or out of thinking that China would "come around," I don't know. The only thing that has been a true thorn in the side of American-Chinese relations is Taiwan.

[edit on 21-5-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]

I have no problems what so ever with the Chinese people or for the most part, the Chinese Govt.
Yes I am a little wary of the Govt but I dont use that as a reason to hate the Chinese people.
I met a person from China online some years back. We spoke regularly on ICQ as we both had a common interest at that time, which was hacking public protected websites, nothing serious. For the most part we did it as a kind of hobby. He was a really nice person and had very frew kind words for his Govt.
He said people there felt the same things that most Americans felt. There was a general fear and mistrust of the US Govt due to the propaganda the people heard, which is just about the same way things go here.
I lost track of him over the years, I hope he didnt get in trouble for speaking bad about the Chinese Govt..