Someone Else's Fault

Originally posted by magicmushroom
Semper do you not think though that the examples you give go right across society and not just in the social group you mentioned. I mean whilst some one is claiming welfare a corrupt business man is putting a thousand on welfareand blaming some one/thing else for it.

Ah magicfungi beat me to the punch.

Exactly:

Someone else's fault...

Trace it back....

A decision was made, a job was lost...

It is easy and all too common on here to "blame" everything on some "corrupt" entity, when in reality decisions were made to work for that entity...

But continue on because it has to be...

Someone Else's Fault

Semper

Originally posted by SteveR
Why is your post specifically targetted to certain people? Why do you not reference the pervasiveness of this mindset in the general population as a whole? So, then, is it just blacks, homeless folk, and criminals that call "someone else's fault"?

It's because there's something innately wrong with blacks, according to Semper's post (he threw in homeless and criminals to make it look better).

To the crux of it indeed.

This is the second thread you've made about this...[edit on 28/4/07 by SteveR]

Kinda makes you think it's a response or something, eh? Maybe he read something about crooked cops...

Irony: Calling people close minded as you only consider lack of responsibility as the issue in things they discussed.

Originally posted by SteveR
Why is your post specifically targetted to certain people? Why do you not reference the pervasiveness of this mindset in the general population as a whole?

It's true. This phenomenon is present throughout all segments of society. Even those who are doing quite well in life are learning to blame other people for even their own actions. I think that's what's so important about this issue.

The guy who parks his Hummer in the compact space and then can't get back in when he returns blames the VW driver in the adjacent spot for "wedging him in".

It's everywhere. The rich, poor, black, white, educated, presidents, cops, teachers, clergy, housewives, young and old all take part in the SEF game. No one is immune. It's societal.

Thank you BH,

For those that failed to understand my use of "Analogy".

a·nal·o·gy /əˈnælədʒi/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[uh-nal-uh-jee] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–noun, plural -gies.
1. a similarity between like features of two things, on which a comparison may be based: the analogy between the heart and a pump.
2. similarity or comparability: I see no analogy between your problem and mine.

Now I understand the one poster not getting it, that is a pervasive occurrence when ever that one posts, but I would expect the rest of you to not place prejudice in a thread not about prejudice.

And yet, that strikes again at the root of the issue.

Example.. (Follow me now)

It can not possibly be the fault of the individual, be they black, white, tan or blue, it has to be .... DOT DOT DOT

Prejudice.

Again the shirking of individual responsibility and the laying of blame on something/anything else.

Now granted for some this is an ever present fact; that to simply "STATE" in a thread, as an example, that a persons skin color is black, is indicative of the entire thread being racist. This is a psychological problem, ie Psychosis, with that particular individual or individuals, and not something that I care to be concerned with in the creation of threads NOT about race.

Those of you that do this, well again....

You simply and quite succinctly PROVE the opening post, it can't be about me.. It HAS TO BE ABOUT RACE... It's not, it is about you...

It is also notable to observe a posters inordinate usage of the emoticons to, I assume, illustrate some form of emotion or attitude. These little handy dandy gif files are fun and have there place and I have used them, but to decorate your post, in a serious discussion with numerous unrelated gif files is indicative of what? A lack or inability to discuss on a mature level.

I believe it again is an attempt at subverting the attention that would otherwise be drawn to an individual that in ordinary circumstances, would force the issue of responsibility.
However in this, the ethereal world, one can and some often do (As evidenced by previous postings) avoid the unsettling and often disastrous results of having to face the adult world and accept that responsibility.

Semper

Originally posted by truthseeka
Irony: Calling people close minded as you only consider lack of responsibility as the issue in things they discussed.

Did you see that, semp?

For a super intellect , more things go over your head than I would expect. Or maybe you just have a problem reading. Or maybe you just like to read what you want to read.

I never said the individual or other(s) are solely to blame in what you are railing against. Saying one or the other is the ONLY factor would be closed minded. And yes, that includes blaming the individual solely.

Thus, the irony comment. Or, the sky calling the ocean blue.

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
It's everywhere. The rich, poor, black, white, educated, presidents, cops, teachers, clergy, housewives, young and old all take part in the SEF game. No one is immune. It's societal.

You got it

Semper.. you set yourself up for this one. There is no need to be PC, but the only persons you spoke of were black, homeless and criminals.

Chill out you guys. Semper didn't exclude anyone. He gave a few examples and you decided what he meant. Just because he didn't go into exactly how this phenomenon permeates all levels of society doesn't mean he's picking on anyone.

As far as I see, he didn't "set himself up for" anything. I don't care what some people say, others are going to attack them because of past crap. Get over it and talk about the subject or post somewhere else.

Please.

This juvenile bickering and trying to make the OP look bad is sickening. Do either of you have anything to say about the subject or is Semper just too fascinating that you can't stop talking about him?

Thank you BH. Semper used examples only; I can't see where he stated that those specific groups were the only groups who like to blame others for their woes. Good grief, this is a societal wide issue. I see and hear it all the time. It's never anyone's fault.

Semper, correct me if I'm wrong; but I believe you are stating that people in general need to take personnal responsibility for thier actions or inactions that result in less then wonderful aspects.

By the same token we all also need to take responsibility for inaction that results in issues such as increased crime and homelessness. These could be lessened if not eliminated if we all took afirmative action. I daresay that we all have been guilty of turning a blind eye when we could have helped and maybe changed the course of someone's life. It's easy to get on the internet and complain or mock another poster, not however, so easy to take action.

GH,

No need to correct you. In fact anyone without a chip in their shoulder or a prior agenda, would clearly see what I stated and not place their own bias and prejudice into it.

This is not anything I am shocked at, these types of attacks always come at me when there is no other alternative for the poster. Typical and expected.

BH, thank you as well....

Yet, their postings are at least contributory to the issue. They have brought out very clear and simple examples of the act of deflection. Deflection is a more subtle form of the refusal to accept responsibility, but no less apparent and at times effective.

The one poster used the term, "Super Intellect" in a descriptive form toward me, the OP. This is obvious in the intent to deflect from his previous claim to be in the top 3% of intellect and the derision he received after this proclamation as it relates to his posting style and the form of his thought process.

Attacks such as these, that in fact prove the points I have been making, are satisfying in the expectation of their arrival. Even more so the insults, however poorly worded, are indicative of a form of admiration as much as deflection...

Semper

Well, well, semp...

Do you forget posting this?

Originally posted by semperfortis
It is also notable to observe a posters inordinate usage of the emoticons to, I assume, illustrate some form of emotion or attitude. These little handy dandy gif files are fun and have there place and I have used them, but to decorate your post, in a serious discussion with numerous unrelated gif files is indicative of what? A lack or inability to discuss on a mature level.

You basically say I'm too immature to post in your thread, despite trying to say it in a flowery way. You are peeved that I use the emoticons (because they're not SUPPOSED to be used in posts ) too "inordinately." Guess I missed the emoticon limit rule. But more to the point, using them too "inordinately" shows that you are immature. Again, I missed that emotion usage-maturity level correlation.

I believe it again is an attempt at subverting the attention that would otherwise be drawn to an individual that in ordinary circumstances, would force the issue of responsibility.
However in this, the ethereal world, one can and some often do (As evidenced by previous postings) avoid the unsettling and often disastrous results of having to face the adult world and accept that responsibility.

Semper

And now we have flowery "I'm irresponsible cracks." All because I point out what 2 other posters pointed out before me, your rehashing of old threads. Oh yeah, and because I called you out for being close-minded on what you pretend to be open-minded about.

Then, you talk about your precognition skills, and how seeing what you saw in the past about the future in the present makes you feel all warm and tingly. Again with flowery words, yet somehow you are upset because I say something about a keen intellect.

Since we're discussing responsibility, who's responsible for the deaths of unarmed people when cops are acquitted? Obviously not the cops, as they are usually "justified" for shooting the person (despite common views, shooting a person does not mean you are responsible for killing them ). So, who should take responsibility?

The bullets?
The guns?
The heart that stops beating?
The brain that shuts down?

Nope. Obviously, the dead person is responsible for killing themselves, er, being killed by cops, er, being killed by bullets, er, being killed by guns...

Yep. If that person wasn't trying to show their ID to the cops (illegal, I know ), or trying to put their hands up (hands up with palms out is a universal threat ), or trying to get on the ground (you never know where a secret underground weapons cache will be), they wouldn't have been killed by the cops.

Er, the bullets.

Er, the guns...

I apologize if you have given yourself the importance of assuming any of my posts were directly indicated toward you ceeksa...

I, on a more professional level, have thoroughly reviewed the entire thread and can not find where I mentioned your name even once. Your inference is as usual, yours and not implied by others.

However if you wish to take credit for the, obvious now, farcical comment about the 3% fiasco, feel free to relieve yourself of that particular burden and continue on with the deflection...

You are doing a fantastic job of proving my opening post..

As for your police comments, we are all aware of your prejudice in that arena and also of your thread on the topic which is more applicable there where the prejudice ones may gather in peace. As such I find no intelligent comment germane to this thread...

Semper



[edit on 4/28/2007 by semperfortis]

Originally posted by semperfortis
I apologize if you have given yourself the importance of assuming any of my posts were directly indicated toward you ceeksa...

I, on a more professional level, have thoroughly reviewed the entire thread and can not find where I mentioned your name even once. Your inference is as usual, yours and not implied by others.

You're too funny, simp. I look forward to more laughs.

I like how you flat out lie in that last sentence. Of COURSE you never mentioned my name; that wouldn't have been flowery. What you DID do was use inference, as in "the one poster who doesn't get it," "the poster with past history of blah blah blah." You're not going to con me with that; tell it to someone else.

However if you wish to take credit for the, obvious now, farcical comment about the 3% fiasco, feel free to relieve yourself of that particular burden and continue on with the deflection...

...becky, is that you? Seriously, you sound like him right about now; he was pretty obsessed with that for a while.

You are doing a fantastic job of proving my opening post..

That's not me. I'm not responsible for proving your OP.

As for your police comments, we are all aware of your prejudice in that arena and also of your thread on the topic which is more applicable there where the prejudice ones may gather in peace. As such I find no intelligent comment germane to this thread...

Semper
[edit on 4/28/2007 by semperfortis]

Translation: the Blue Wall of Silence will not allow me to comment on that. Sure, it was on topic, with the question of responsibility and all, but I'd rather say the questions lack intelligence and are not REALLY on topic. And, I'm not responsible for dodging those questions.

Once again sir,

Thank you..

Your deflection and prejudice are shining examples of all I was talking about and provide those of us that wish to study this phenomenon a rare and wonderful opportunity to observe this in a real life setting...

Here we have the process of deflection and the rare, but inevitable follow up of refusal to accept responsibility. This is most apparent in studies of younger subjects, but more and more this is observable in many different age groups and cultural settings as seen here.

As we can clearly see, the deflection was determined to be inadequate by the subject and the transference into all out refusal of responsibility was smooth and apparently effortless on the part of the subject. This is clear indication of either a practiced relationship with the phenomenon, or more likely, a deep seated societal conditioning...

Semper

"LESS HUMANS, MORE HUMANITY"



Saw that on a bumper sticker once.

Originally posted by semperfortis
Once again sir,

Thank you..

Your deflection and prejudice are shining examples of all I was talking about and provide those of us that wish to study this phenomenon a rare and wonderful opportunity to observe this in a real life setting...

Who do you think you are, a mix of Dr. Phil and David Attenborough?


Well, I'm going to take a seat and listen to you ramble. It's pretty exciting, sitting in on something that I'm the subject of. It's like I'm watching my own Truman show while I'm still in it.

Eloquent in it's simplicity..

Thorough in form and complete in function...

Wonderful

Semper

Originally posted by truthseeka
Translation: the Blue Wall of Silence will not allow me to comment on that. Sure, it was on topic, with the question of responsibility and all, but I'd rather say the questions lack intelligence and are not REALLY on topic.

I'd like to say that blaming a GROUP of people for the actions of one person feeds right into this concept and is, if accidentally, on topic. Holding ALL cops responsible for the actions of one, in essence, takes the responsibility OFF the individual who pulls the trigger and puts it on "someone else". In this case, the "Men in Blue". So the individual doesn't have to carry the blame himself. Nice job.

It's the same, irresponsible behavior. You're clearly wishing to blame Semper for every bad cop, simply because they belong to the same group. It's the other side of the same coin. It's taking the responsibility AWAY FROM the individual and putting it on the group so one can prejudge the entire group. :shk:

I doubt you'd welcome the same judgment on yourself for any group to which you belong.

Originally posted by semperfortis
Eloquent in it's simplicity..

Thorough in form and complete in function...

Wonderful

Semper

Awww...

Now that I'm in the audience too, you abandon your grandiose, flowery rhetoric? Don't give up on your lecture; some of us ARE taking notes...

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic

Originally posted by truthseeka
Translation: the Blue Wall of Silence will not allow me to comment on that. Sure, it was on topic, with the question of responsibility and all, but I'd rather say the questions lack intelligence and are not REALLY on topic.

I'd like to say that blaming a GROUP of people for the actions of one person feeds right into this concept and is, if accidentally, on topic. Holding ALL cops responsible for the actions of one, in essence, takes the responsibility OFF the individual who pulls the trigger and puts it on "someone else". In this case, the "Men in Blue". So the individual doesn't have to carry the blame himself. Nice job.

If one cop is killing all these unarmed people NATIONWIDE, we clearly have a problem.

It's the same, irresponsible behavior. You're clearly wishing to blame Semper for every bad cop, simply because they belong to the same group. It's the other side of the same coin. It's taking the responsibility AWAY FROM the individual and putting it on the group so one can prejudge the entire group. :shk:

OK. I didn't blame simp for other officers shooting unarmed people; I blamed THEM. But they usually get away with it, so I ask who's REALLY to blame. I merely pointed out that simp's refusal to even speak on that smacks of the BWOS. Of COURSE he's not going to say, "yeah, my brothers in blue who kill unarmed people are responsible for their murders." The point is to show irony, once again.